hot load question

poker2112 · September 17, 2007, 08:01 PM

went shooting this weekend...by looking at the 223 brass (lc 06,imi ,ad ,wcc,rorg,fc 07,rem,pmc,s&b,win,& misc mil.) how do you tell if the load is too hot? started at 23,24,24.5,25,25.5,26,26.5,&27 grs..........there all pretty much the same looking ...no crack ,all have burnt marks.........55fmj with cannulure,seating depth right on the cannulure ,wc844 powder,ran really good in my ar 15 ........if i didnt mark each brass..i dont think i could tell them apart!!!!thanks

swmike · September 17, 2007, 08:14 PM

I read your post and then looked in my crystal ball to determine the caliber you were referring to. It came up with .223 but went murky on the type of powder

and the weight of bullet

If your primers are not excessively flattened and flowing around the firing pin into the firing pin hole in the bolt-face (it leaves a little ring around the firing pin dimple) you are most likely not over pressured.

For .223 I load 25.3 gr of H-335 under a 55gr bullet. This seems to work well giving me nice tight groups.

If my crystal ball was wrong on the caliber, could you enlighten us?

Scorch · September 17, 2007, 08:16 PM

Quote:

there all pretty much the same looking ...no crack ,all have burnt marks.........if i didnt mark each brass..i dont think i could tell them apart!!!!

Yep, that's what reloading manuals are for.

In order to determine whether your loads are operating at excessive pressure, you need to measure the pressure inside the cartridges being fired, best done with a transducer. There really is no way to tell you what load is too hot, you would have to tell us what cartridge, what bullet, what primer, what powder, and possibly what rifle they were shot in. Even then, unless you have grossly excessive pressure problems, no one on the internet will be able to tell you exactly and for sure what load is too hot. There is no way to know!!

So, follow load recommendations published in reloading manuals and you will know approximate velocity, approximate trajectory, approximate point blank range, and approximately whether or not the load is safe.

Linear Thinker · September 17, 2007, 09:16 PM

Repeating here my questions to your post on the other board:

Tell us more: caliber (sounds like a 223), powder, bullet weight and design, seating depth, primer used, any blown primers, any flattened primers, any cratered firing pin indents, which rifle, any extraction difficulties?
LT

steve4102 · September 17, 2007, 09:57 PM

Quote:

went shooting this weekend...by looking at the brass (lc 06,imi ,ad ,wcc,rorg,fc 07,rem,pmc,s&b,win,& misc mil.) how do you tell if the load is too hot? started at 23,24,24.5,25,25.5,26,26.5,&27 grs..........there all pretty much the same looking ...no crack ,all have burnt marks.........if i didnt mark each brass..i dont think i could tell them apart!!!!thanks

Huh???

poker2112 · September 17, 2007, 11:55 PM

oh its 223 brass with wc844 powder ,cc1 #41 ,55fmj with cannulure ,crimped right on cannulure,no flat or blown primers,shot in a ar15, no hiccups, ran really good when rapid firing, overall all the brass looks the same from 23-27gr

Linear Thinker · September 18, 2007, 06:50 AM

I tried a similar load a while back with surplus WC844, Win primers, 55gr Israeli FMJs, crimped into cannelure, WCC military brass. My load was 25 grains of powder, it cycled reliably and gave good accuracy.

I urge you not to mix brass brands, the thickness and internal volume vary tremendously, and with a small cartridge such as a 223 you can easily exceed the safe pressure. I learned the hard way when switching the same load between thin-walled FC brass to much thicker IMI brass. What worked in one blew every single primer in the other.
LT

Trapper L · September 18, 2007, 11:00 AM

Use the load data for H335 when using WC844. They are the same powder, WC844 is military while the H335 is military with a civilian name. At 27.0 grs you are over max per loading data. I'd back off to at least the 25.3 max listed per Hodgdon.

FWIW, there are two WC844 powders. Energy produced and burn rate are the same but the WC844T burns considerably hotter. If yours is the "T" version be aware barrel life will be shorter at max loads.

poker2112 · September 18, 2007, 05:42 PM

ok so go lighter in comm. brass .........thinking 25.3-25.5gr...... what about mil. brass........found a round (lc 06,62gr fmjscbt w/c) in my once fired brass that was not shot.....took off the bullet and measured the powder and it was 27gr.........deprimed it and the pocket was brand new clean......so can i go with a load like 27gr in mil. brass with 62gr ? thanks

September 17, 2007, 08:01 PM	#1
poker2112 Member Join Date: September 24, 2006 Posts: 62	hot load question went shooting this weekend...by looking at the 223 brass (lc 06,imi ,ad ,wcc,rorg,fc 07,rem,pmc,s&b,win,& misc mil.) how do you tell if the load is too hot? started at 23,24,24.5,25,25.5,26,26.5,&27 grs..........there all pretty much the same looking ...no crack ,all have burnt marks.........55fmj with cannulure,seating depth right on the cannulure ,wc844 powder,ran really good in my ar 15 ........if i didnt mark each brass..i dont think i could tell them apart!!!!thanks Last edited by poker2112; September 17, 2007 at 11:09 PM.

September 17, 2007, 08:14 PM	#2
swmike Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2005 Location: Marysville, WA Posts: 670	I read your post and then looked in my crystal ball to determine the caliber you were referring to. It came up with .223 but went murky on the type of powder and the weight of bullet If your primers are not excessively flattened and flowing around the firing pin into the firing pin hole in the bolt-face (it leaves a little ring around the firing pin dimple) you are most likely not over pressured. For .223 I load 25.3 gr of H-335 under a 55gr bullet. This seems to work well giving me nice tight groups. If my crystal ball was wrong on the caliber, could you enlighten us? __________________ My definition of Gun Control--- A steady grip and hitting your target. "In God we trust, all others are suspects." "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying, either I won't need any more, or more won't be of any help". ____________________________________________

September 17, 2007, 09:16 PM	#4
Linear Thinker Senior Member Join Date: February 10, 2007 Location: Blue State, NE US Posts: 202	Repeating here my questions to your post on the other board: Tell us more: caliber (sounds like a 223), powder, bullet weight and design, seating depth, primer used, any blown primers, any flattened primers, any cratered firing pin indents, which rifle, any extraction difficulties? LT

September 17, 2007, 11:55 PM	#6
poker2112 Member Join Date: September 24, 2006 Posts: 62	oh its 223 brass with wc844 powder ,cc1 #41 ,55fmj with cannulure ,crimped right on cannulure,no flat or blown primers,shot in a ar15, no hiccups, ran really good when rapid firing, overall all the brass looks the same from 23-27gr

September 18, 2007, 06:50 AM	#7
Linear Thinker Senior Member Join Date: February 10, 2007 Location: Blue State, NE US Posts: 202	I tried a similar load a while back with surplus WC844, Win primers, 55gr Israeli FMJs, crimped into cannelure, WCC military brass. My load was 25 grains of powder, it cycled reliably and gave good accuracy. I urge you not to mix brass brands, the thickness and internal volume vary tremendously, and with a small cartridge such as a 223 you can easily exceed the safe pressure. I learned the hard way when switching the same load between thin-walled FC brass to much thicker IMI brass. What worked in one blew every single primer in the other. LT

September 18, 2007, 11:00 AM	#8
Trapper L Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2006 Location: South Texas Posts: 804	Use the load data for H335 when using WC844. They are the same powder, WC844 is military while the H335 is military with a civilian name. At 27.0 grs you are over max per loading data. I'd back off to at least the 25.3 max listed per Hodgdon. FWIW, there are two WC844 powders. Energy produced and burn rate are the same but the WC844T burns considerably hotter. If yours is the "T" version be aware barrel life will be shorter at max loads.

September 18, 2007, 05:42 PM	#9
poker2112 Member Join Date: September 24, 2006 Posts: 62	ok so go lighter in comm. brass .........thinking 25.3-25.5gr...... what about mil. brass........found a round (lc 06,62gr fmjscbt w/c) in my once fired brass that was not shot.....took off the bullet and measured the powder and it was 27gr.........deprimed it and the pocket was brand new clean......so can i go with a load like 27gr in mil. brass with 62gr ? thanks