The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Dave McCracken Memorial Shotgun Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old December 26, 2012, 05:09 PM   #26
pabuckslayer08
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 18, 2010
Location: South Central Pa
Posts: 692
With no training I really think the pump is the best home defense weapon. No jams to worry about, and I mean come on, racking the pump really isnt a difficult thing to wrap your head around. I would take a pump shotgun over any handgun as well for HD purposes
pabuckslayer08 is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 06:45 PM   #27
jmortimer
Junior member
 
Join Date: January 24, 2010
Location: South West Riverside County California
Posts: 2,763
"No jams to worry about"

They all "jam."
jmortimer is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 07:13 PM   #28
jmr40
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 15, 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 10,786
I theory the pump. In actual practice the semi will be more reliable. Most problems are caused by operator error and that is less likely with a semi.

If I had to survive in the wilderness for years with only one gun it would be the pump. It can take more abuse and still work with poor quality ammo. But is a stessful SD situation in normal situations I'd take the semi auto.
jmr40 is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 07:43 PM   #29
breakingcontact
Junior member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2012
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 736
Can get yourself a more severe jam w a pump as well.
breakingcontact is offline  
Old December 27, 2012, 04:27 PM   #30
Erno86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 22, 2012
Location: Marriottsville, Maryland
Posts: 1,738
May I second the suggestion...for the woman to go with a Stoeger Coach double barrel shotgun. Check out the low-recoiling 12 gauge Aguila minishot shells. It has a short barrel...which makes it less likely for an intruder to grab it.
No sound is probably more terrifying to a home intruder, than to hear the rack-an-shuck of a pump action shotgun. I would shy away from the semi auto shotgun. Make sure she wears hearing protection, in case she lights one off in the bedroom --- cuz shotgun blasts are awfully loud in enclosed spaces.

If she prefers a pump...teach her to rack the action during recoil. Live-fire training should be mandatory. Get Matt Burkett's Shotgun Mastery dvd.
Erno86 is offline  
Old December 28, 2012, 08:47 PM   #31
hey.moe
Member
 
Join Date: December 3, 2010
Location: Northwest Florida
Posts: 21
I've got to agree with the point made earlier that if you're not willing or able to devote the necessary time to becoming proficient with the gun and knowledgeable of self-defense, then a gun is probably not for you.

As someone also said, snap caps are relatively inexpensive and a great way to get comfortable with the operation of the gun. I learned all my manual of arms using snap caps, and continue to train with them on a regular basis. I use live ammo to validate my practice.

-Stan-
hey.moe is offline  
Old December 28, 2012, 09:30 PM   #32
BigD_in_FL
Junior member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Location: The "Gunshine State"
Posts: 1,981
If training is not part of the program, get a dog and a can of bear spray- SERIOUSLY
Not everyone needs or should have a gun for SD
I wouldn't buy my wife a Vette and then have her drive at Daytona without the requisite training because she is not prepared to o it safely. Same with guns
BigD_in_FL is offline  
Old December 28, 2012, 11:28 PM   #33
shortwave
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 17, 2007
Location: SOUTHEAST, OHIO
Posts: 5,970
Quote:
With no training I really think the pump is the best home defense weapon. No jams to worry about, and I mean come on, racking the pump really isnt a difficult thing to wrap your head around.
Hell, I've seen guys short shucking pumps while bird or rabbit hunting. Couldn't imagine them in a HD situation.
shortwave is offline  
Old December 29, 2012, 08:01 PM   #34
BigD_in_FL
Junior member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Location: The "Gunshine State"
Posts: 1,981
Exactly, saying pump cannot malf is poor advice and could get someone killed.
BigD_in_FL is offline  
Old December 31, 2012, 08:37 PM   #35
bfskinnerpunk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2009
Posts: 201
I'm just learning about shotguns, too....

But I would never suggest that a person (like this one) get a dog for protection. I'd suggest that almost any gun combined with a marginally trained person is safer than a protection dog.

Dogs are alive and active in / around the house all day (not tucked under your mattress or in a safe). If the mailman, UPS, meter reader or the neighbor's kid arrives, would you trust that your doberman will decipher friend from foe?

With dogs, there is always the "oh I forget to put him in the pen.." moment at just the wrong time.

Guns, of any type, stay put.... and don't do anything until you do.
bfskinnerpunk is offline  
Old January 9, 2013, 06:02 AM   #36
ClydeFrog
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 1, 2010
Posts: 5,797
12ga Stoger coach gun(home defense version)...

Of the 2 common formats; auto vs pump action, I'd lean towards the pump action. A few top US instructors like Massad Ayoob, Louis Ayelbuck(check spelling) & John Farnam have guides and videos for defense training with pump shotguns. A couple(man & woman) could learn the basic drills with a well made pump action. The semi auto style seems better suited for SWAT or estate security type functions.
If a woman(wife-girlfriend) can't or won't learn to use a full scale 500 or 870 model pump, maybe a simple 12ga sideXside or O/U defense shotgun could work. Stoger puts out a "tactical" type with 1913 rails on it for lasers/white lights.
Someone could train to operate a coach gun even under stress. A white light would be a smart add-on to prevent ADs or mistaken IDs.

New low recoil LE/defense shotgun rounds are out there too.
Clyde
ClydeFrog is offline  
Old January 9, 2013, 09:33 AM   #37
BigD_in_FL
Junior member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Location: The "Gunshine State"
Posts: 1,981
Quote:
Practice makes perfect.
Not quite...

PERFECT practice makes perfect, which is why a newbie should take a lesson or three to learn the right way to go from the beginning. Otherwise, they will ingrain bad habits that have to be unlearned. If these folks aren't going to practice at all, then lessons would be a great but likely not happening scenario in this case. That just sounds like a bad outcome waiting to happen, IMO.
BigD_in_FL is offline  
Old January 9, 2013, 09:59 AM   #38
ratrodney
Member
 
Join Date: July 4, 2012
Posts: 99
Id rsther pull the trigger 5 or 6 times wo pumping in between myself. Kinda the difference between a single action handgun or a dao only in my book. RR
ratrodney is offline  
Old January 9, 2013, 10:08 AM   #39
hogdogs
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,069
I agree with BigD to an extent but will profess that ANY practice that makes you proficient with your weapon is better than none...

For instance, i am not formally trained unless circa 1970's Soldier of Fortune and Field and Stream magazine articles count...

But being a po' folk redneck with caring parents and grand parents to lead me best they could, I learned to make best use of my ammo for practice and hunting...

No such thing as "bustin' off a few rounds for the heck of it..."... I am rife with fundamental flaws and bad habits that would likely make a truly trained gunman cringe or worse...

But I do make the lead fall on the right target pretty much routinely...

One of my worst known flaws is in use of the trigger hand and finger... Having grown up on borrowed guns much of the time and these being owned by average or taller men when I was a super small boy for my age, my grip placement is far from precise as is where I place my finger on the trigger... Even with the same gun of mine and during same session, my hand and finger are all over the place...

Sometimes I "pull" the trigger, sometimes I "squeeze" it while other times I just "snap it off the sear"...

One bad habit that must be avoided or corrected is the "flinch factor"... It WILL cause missed shots and under duress can get your still beating heart handed to you...

Brent
hogdogs is offline  
Old January 11, 2013, 11:35 PM   #40
EdInk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 27, 2009
Posts: 3,968
It sounds to me that they would be better served with a service pistol like a Model 10 or Glock 19.
__________________
Sic Semper Tyrannis
EdInk is offline  
Old January 12, 2013, 05:50 AM   #41
redrick
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 5, 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,041
I agree with the others who suggested a coach gun or double action revolver.

IMO a beginer would likely short stoke a pump more than a good semi with tested buckshot would jam.
redrick is offline  
Old January 14, 2013, 07:22 PM   #42
cajun47
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 28, 2007
Location: swamp people
Posts: 539
topic over:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoEp2WW_5dk

you welcome.
cajun47 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:18 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.07328 seconds with 10 queries