What would you do???

AdrenalineJunky · July 19, 2002, 02:09 PM

You wake up in the middle of the night because you hear noises outside. You look outside to find two guys with flashlights going through your car. How do you react? This actually happened to me last night.

jhisaac · July 19, 2002, 02:22 PM

Grab the gun of your choice while calling 911. Turn on an external light. Wait for the cops to show.

IvyGroves · July 19, 2002, 02:51 PM

call cops
turn on lights
grab camera and .45 or shotgun

Take their picture for future id - shoot only if they turn on you. After all, a car is just property and you can replace it - your life is worth defending.

every circumstance is different. It's hard to tell what is the "right" or "wrong" thing to do in a particular instance. But it's great to think about the various things one could do.

Christopher II · July 19, 2002, 02:58 PM

Turn over and go back to sleep. They want my POS '87 Civic with the leaky radiator, they're welcome to it. I'd rather have the insurance money.

Seriously, call the cops and hang out until they arrive.

- Chris

Toadlicker · July 19, 2002, 04:23 PM

First, ask yourself where you live.

If the answer is "Texas", shoot the thieves.

If the answer is not "Texas", you'll probably have to hold your fire and call the police.

Double Naught Spy · July 19, 2002, 09:59 PM

In Texas, you do have that option. However, you need to consider if shooting and maybe killing to car burglars is worth the various legal hassles that might arise relative to the value of the car. Keep in mind that you may have to pony up quite a bit of $ to cover your legal hassles and that amount could easily be more than the value of the car, especially if you get sued in civil court and lose. And while the situation may seem clear cut in this scenario to you, it may not to the cops and so you may get arrested. So then you may end up being out fees for a criminal lawyer and for bail.

Okay, so you saw two in the car. How many others did you spot? Did you fixate on the action in the car or did you scan the whole area to make sure there was not other participants? While you shoot the two in the car, a third guy unknown to you may be able to return fire against you. Is the car worth the risk?

Other costs to you may include damage you inflict on the car yourself as well as lost wages for the periods of time in which you have to deal with the legal issues, such as being in jail, being questioned by the cops, or being in court.

Another potential risk is that if the guys are gang members and you harm or kill them, other gang members may want to take revenge against you and they will have no problem finding out where you live.

stevetuna · July 19, 2002, 10:19 PM

I hope I'm never tested like that, A. J. - but if I am I hope I'll remember that everything that is truly important is inside my house (wife, daughters, dog). I'd call the cops (Glock and Surefire light already in hand before my feet hit the floor) and I'd keep them on the line.

Also, I'd be breathing deeply to try to keep myself calm, knowing that my most important job is guarding the two bedrooms at the end of the house.

I'd be satisfied to let the police and the insurance company do their jobs at that point. Now, should someone want to enter my house...

So let us know - what did happen?

yorec · July 20, 2002, 05:18 PM

First question is which car? If its the one with the lightbar on top and big decals on the side marked "Police," I relax - city'll pay for all damages and thefts...

Seriously, call police and take pictures from a safe vantage point. Be a good witness - makes the cops jobs ealier to do. That way, when Joe rookie shows up and you hand him a great case - the guys who broke in will likely get what they deserve.

Also, for all you guys who live in Texas and wanna shoot these guys - what if it's some high schooler trying to pull a practical joke on the coach or other buddy and got the wrong place? Sure - they shouldn't have been messin' with your car and you may get away scott free legally, but you gotta live with what each of your bullet's does when it leaves. A kid in a wheelchair for the rest of his life ain't worth any car I've ever owned...

And what if it is a couple of bad guys? What about thier friend who sits as look out across the street with the rifle? It is only a car after all, not worth your life and limb is it?

I'm not going out there until the red and blue lights arrive, but then it'll be with radio, handcuffs, vest, etc. and the guys just arriving will know to expect me...

KSFreeman · July 20, 2002, 06:06 PM

Call the po-po. Get a description. Be a good witness. May be nothing, but who knows.

What's the GSC stuff about shooting theives? Who said they were theives? Maybe detectives with wrong address? Stoned teenagers? Car buffs looking at the killer sound system? Did we lose Rule #4 around here or something?

Mannlicher · July 20, 2002, 06:13 PM

KSFreeman admonishes: What's the GSC stuff about shooting theives? Who said they were theives? Maybe detectives with wrong address? Stoned teenagers? Car buffs looking at the killer sound system?...................

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, there is a very high probability that it is a duck. My money would be on their being theives. At any rate, NO one should be in my car, when it is parked in my driveway, in the middle of the night.

Now I would probably not shoot them, at this point, they have not presented themselves as a threat to me or mine, but you can bet your bippy, they are THEIVES. If bold enough to B&E your car in front of your house, they are probably bold enough to shoot ya.

My advise? Mostly like the others have said. Take a pic, call the cops, and turn on an outside light. Getting them off your property with you remaining in one piece is real important here.

gryphon · July 21, 2002, 07:52 AM

Detectives better not be searching my car without a warrant and/or my consent. Otherwise they are breaking into/searching my car illegally, and they'd be damn luck not to be in some serious doo-doo.

KSFreeman · July 21, 2002, 08:55 AM

gryphon, maybe so, but remember Rule #4 whoever they are. Just because you think they are no-goodniks does not mean that they are.

Call the cops, hold your fire, be a good witness. Oh, yeah, don't run out to greet the cops with the shotgun! Yikes.

Blackhawk · July 21, 2002, 04:08 PM

911

watch

Double Naught Spy · July 22, 2002, 11:12 AM

yorec, I already mentioned the aspect of accomplices which is valid, no doubt.

So you pose the question for us Texans as to what if it is some high schooler trying to pull a practical joke but got the wrong place. Well, it would be a darn shame and it would suck for the highschooler to make a fatal error such as that if the home owner decides to cap him. While it would be a shame, the fault of the death would not reside with the home owner even if the home owner feels bad about the whole thing.

Change the scenario slightly. What if the home owner kills a couple of kids coming in a window and it turns out to be a couple of highschoolers trying to play a prank on their coach? Is it different just because they were coming in the domicile? Maybe. It just depends on what your comfort level is with events going on around you. Either way, the kids are just kids trying to play a prank with no intent of harming you or your family as it is just a prank and they have the wrong house. It would still be a real shame and it would suck for the high schoolers, but once again, the fault would not be with the home owner even if the home owner feels guilty.

Bottom line is that parents should teach their kids better to be more responsible and even if that does not work, kids need to know that there are some very REAL life and death risks associated with what they may be doing that may result from another person simply exercising their rights to protect themselves and their property against what is perceived as a threat to themselves and their property. Kids are going to always do things that are not quite right. No doubt about it. However, they need to be armed with enough information to be able to make better informed decisions about what they do.

Mr.Wingshooter · July 22, 2002, 01:46 PM

My roomate at the time spotted two young black adults trying to break into his car with a shirt hanger, they where after his new CD player and the CD's that where laying in the front seat. We turned on the front porch light, they started to run, my friend busts out the door with his shotgun, I follow him, and the thugs ran like hell. They had a head start and I was gaining on them but gave up the chase when my buddy said, to let em go from our driveway, they will be back, trust me. He was from the #2 murder capital of the US at that time so I knew that he knew about gangs. I preceded to my closet and got out my assualt rifle and shotgun and loaded them and set them in the living room.

Sure enough about an hour later four thugs pull up outside the house in an old buick, we flicked the lights on, and readied our guns from behind the couch, when they saw the AK, and 2 shotguns they got scared and fled as fast that crappy buick would go. We laughed for about 5 minutes, and then called the cops who busted them about 4 streets down robbing another car. No thug was ever seen on our street again.

That's how we prevent crime here in the south!! That smallish chapter of a gang is gone from our town now, all the southern hill folk ran em out.

In another note my old roomate lost his best friend in high school to some Blood's that decided they would do a drive by shooting on some Crips at a school dance, of course a bullet hit an unintended person, so I think he wanted to stop this activity before it got worse.

wingnutx · July 22, 2002, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Oh, yeah, don't run out to greet the cops with the shotgun!

Cops are pretty happy when you leave the magazine out and the action open. I'm all for making cops less nervous when they respond to my 911 call

CWL · July 22, 2002, 07:03 PM

OK, so what did you do AdrenalineJunky?
With your tagline, I'd imagine you went running out there...

I would have lit the lights & called the cops. Simple thieves don't usually need flashlights to ransack a car. Sounds like they were looking for something they thought you may have had.

July 19, 2002, 02:09 PM	#1
AdrenalineJunky Member Join Date: July 16, 2001 Location: Ukiah, CA Posts: 47	What would you do??? You wake up in the middle of the night because you hear noises outside. You look outside to find two guys with flashlights going through your car. How do you react? This actually happened to me last night. __________________ Work the ditches, beat the brush...and bang'em down!

July 19, 2002, 09:59 PM	#6
Double Naught Spy Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2001 Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX Posts: 12,717	In Texas, you do have that option. However, you need to consider if shooting and maybe killing to car burglars is worth the various legal hassles that might arise relative to the value of the car. Keep in mind that you may have to pony up quite a bit of $ to cover your legal hassles and that amount could easily be more than the value of the car, especially if you get sued in civil court and lose. And while the situation may seem clear cut in this scenario to you, it may not to the cops and so you may get arrested. So then you may end up being out fees for a criminal lawyer and for bail. Okay, so you saw two in the car. How many others did you spot? Did you fixate on the action in the car or did you scan the whole area to make sure there was not other participants? While you shoot the two in the car, a third guy unknown to you may be able to return fire against you. Is the car worth the risk? Other costs to you may include damage you inflict on the car yourself as well as lost wages for the periods of time in which you have to deal with the legal issues, such as being in jail, being questioned by the cops, or being in court. Another potential risk is that if the guys are gang members and you harm or kill them, other gang members may want to take revenge against you and they will have no problem finding out where you live. __________________ "If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011 My Hunting Videos https://www.youtube.com/user/HornHillRange

July 20, 2002, 05:18 PM	#8
yorec Senior Member Join Date: February 2, 2000 Location: Wyoming Posts: 2,328	First question is which car? If its the one with the lightbar on top and big decals on the side marked "Police," I relax - city'll pay for all damages and thefts... Seriously, call police and take pictures from a safe vantage point. Be a good witness - makes the cops jobs ealier to do. That way, when Joe rookie shows up and you hand him a great case - the guys who broke in will likely get what they deserve. Also, for all you guys who live in Texas and wanna shoot these guys - what if it's some high schooler trying to pull a practical joke on the coach or other buddy and got the wrong place? Sure - they shouldn't have been messin' with your car and you may get away scott free legally, but you gotta live with what each of your bullet's does when it leaves. A kid in a wheelchair for the rest of his life ain't worth any car I've ever owned... And what if it is a couple of bad guys? What about thier friend who sits as look out across the street with the rifle? It is only a car after all, not worth your life and limb is it? I'm not going out there until the red and blue lights arrive, but then it'll be with radio, handcuffs, vest, etc. and the guys just arriving will know to expect me... __________________ What part of "... shall not be infringed..." don't you understand?

July 20, 2002, 06:06 PM	#9
KSFreeman Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: Lafayette, Indiana--American-occupied America Posts: 5,418	Call the po-po. Get a description. Be a good witness. May be nothing, but who knows. What's the GSC stuff about shooting theives? Who said they were theives? Maybe detectives with wrong address? Stoned teenagers? Car buffs looking at the killer sound system? Did we lose Rule #4 around here or something? __________________ "Arguments of policy must give way to a constitutional command." Payton v. New York, 445 U.S. 573, 602 (1980).

July 20, 2002, 06:13 PM	#10
Mannlicher Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Location: North Central Florida & Miami Posts: 3,209	KSFreeman admonishes: What's the GSC stuff about shooting theives? Who said they were theives? Maybe detectives with wrong address? Stoned teenagers? Car buffs looking at the killer sound system?................... If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, there is a very high probability that it is a duck. My money would be on their being theives. At any rate, NO one should be in my car, when it is parked in my driveway, in the middle of the night. Now I would probably not shoot them, at this point, they have not presented themselves as a threat to me or mine, but you can bet your bippy, they are THEIVES. If bold enough to B&E your car in front of your house, they are probably bold enough to shoot ya. My advise? Mostly like the others have said. Take a pic, call the cops, and turn on an outside light. Getting them off your property with you remaining in one piece is real important here. __________________ Nemo Me Impune Lacesset "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.".........Ronald Reagan

July 19, 2002, 02:22 PM	#2
jhisaac Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2000 Location: Newberg, Or Posts: 144	Grab the gun of your choice while calling 911. Turn on an external light. Wait for the cops to show.

July 19, 2002, 02:51 PM	#3
IvyGroves Member Join Date: July 26, 2001 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 36	call cops turn on lights grab camera and .45 or shotgun Take their picture for future id - shoot only if they turn on you. After all, a car is just property and you can replace it - your life is worth defending. every circumstance is different. It's hard to tell what is the "right" or "wrong" thing to do in a particular instance. But it's great to think about the various things one could do.

July 19, 2002, 02:58 PM	#4
Christopher II Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 1999 Location: Germantown, MD Posts: 2,349	Turn over and go back to sleep. They want my POS '87 Civic with the leaky radiator, they're welcome to it. I'd rather have the insurance money. Seriously, call the cops and hang out until they arrive. - Chris __________________ "There is no worse tyranny than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him." – Robert Heinlein "Contrary to popular belief, your vote does not matter, and you cannot make a difference." - Bob Murphy, "Picking Neither of Two Evils" My PGP Public Key

July 19, 2002, 04:23 PM	#5
Toadlicker Member Join Date: June 22, 2002 Location: Hotlanta Posts: 37	First, ask yourself where you live. If the answer is "Texas", shoot the thieves. If the answer is not "Texas", you'll probably have to hold your fire and call the police.

July 19, 2002, 10:19 PM	#7
stevetuna Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2001 Location: Nantucket, MA Posts: 258	I hope I'm never tested like that, A. J. - but if I am I hope I'll remember that everything that is truly important is inside my house (wife, daughters, dog). I'd call the cops (Glock and Surefire light already in hand before my feet hit the floor) and I'd keep them on the line. Also, I'd be breathing deeply to try to keep myself calm, knowing that my most important job is guarding the two bedrooms at the end of the house. I'd be satisfied to let the police and the insurance company do their jobs at that point. Now, should someone want to enter my house... So let us know - what did happen?

July 21, 2002, 07:52 AM	#11
gryphon Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,069	Detectives better not be searching my car without a warrant and/or my consent. Otherwise they are breaking into/searching my car illegally, and they'd be damn luck not to be in some serious doo-doo. __________________ Your suffering will be legendary, even in HELL!! --- PinHead, HellRaiser 2

July 21, 2002, 08:55 AM	#12
KSFreeman Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2001 Location: Lafayette, Indiana--American-occupied America Posts: 5,418	gryphon, maybe so, but remember Rule #4 whoever they are. Just because you think they are no-goodniks does not mean that they are. Call the cops, hold your fire, be a good witness. Oh, yeah, don't run out to greet the cops with the shotgun! Yikes. __________________ "Arguments of policy must give way to a constitutional command." Payton v. New York, 445 U.S. 573, 602 (1980).

July 21, 2002, 04:08 PM	#13
Blackhawk Senior Member Join Date: November 4, 2001 Posts: 5,040	911 watch

July 22, 2002, 11:12 AM	#14
Double Naught Spy Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2001 Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX Posts: 12,717	yorec, I already mentioned the aspect of accomplices which is valid, no doubt. So you pose the question for us Texans as to what if it is some high schooler trying to pull a practical joke but got the wrong place. Well, it would be a darn shame and it would suck for the highschooler to make a fatal error such as that if the home owner decides to cap him. While it would be a shame, the fault of the death would not reside with the home owner even if the home owner feels bad about the whole thing. Change the scenario slightly. What if the home owner kills a couple of kids coming in a window and it turns out to be a couple of highschoolers trying to play a prank on their coach? Is it different just because they were coming in the domicile? Maybe. It just depends on what your comfort level is with events going on around you. Either way, the kids are just kids trying to play a prank with no intent of harming you or your family as it is just a prank and they have the wrong house. It would still be a real shame and it would suck for the high schoolers, but once again, the fault would not be with the home owner even if the home owner feels guilty. Bottom line is that parents should teach their kids better to be more responsible and even if that does not work, kids need to know that there are some very REAL life and death risks associated with what they may be doing that may result from another person simply exercising their rights to protect themselves and their property against what is perceived as a threat to themselves and their property. Kids are going to always do things that are not quite right. No doubt about it. However, they need to be armed with enough information to be able to make better informed decisions about what they do. __________________ "If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011 My Hunting Videos https://www.youtube.com/user/HornHillRange

July 22, 2002, 01:46 PM	#15
Mr.Wingshooter Junior member Join Date: April 23, 2002 Location: Arkeysaw Posts: 171	had this happen to me too, here is what My roomate at the time spotted two young black adults trying to break into his car with a shirt hanger, they where after his new CD player and the CD's that where laying in the front seat. We turned on the front porch light, they started to run, my friend busts out the door with his shotgun, I follow him, and the thugs ran like hell. They had a head start and I was gaining on them but gave up the chase when my buddy said, to let em go from our driveway, they will be back, trust me. He was from the #2 murder capital of the US at that time so I knew that he knew about gangs. I preceded to my closet and got out my assualt rifle and shotgun and loaded them and set them in the living room. Sure enough about an hour later four thugs pull up outside the house in an old buick, we flicked the lights on, and readied our guns from behind the couch, when they saw the AK, and 2 shotguns they got scared and fled as fast that crappy buick would go. We laughed for about 5 minutes, and then called the cops who busted them about 4 streets down robbing another car. No thug was ever seen on our street again. That's how we prevent crime here in the south!! That smallish chapter of a gang is gone from our town now, all the southern hill folk ran em out. In another note my old roomate lost his best friend in high school to some Blood's that decided they would do a drive by shooting on some Crips at a school dance, of course a bullet hit an unintended person, so I think he wanted to stop this activity before it got worse.

July 22, 2002, 07:03 PM	#17
CWL Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2001 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 1,576	OK, so what did you do AdrenalineJunky? With your tagline, I'd imagine you went running out there... I would have lit the lights & called the cops. Simple thieves don't usually need flashlights to ransack a car. Sounds like they were looking for something they thought you may have had.