NFA Guru's-- Help please

KUHIO · December 3, 2008, 08:38 PM

So I had a discussion with a coworker of mine today. He stated that he has a friend who owns a short barreled shotgun (16'' never been registered NFA) and only recently became aware of the legalities of NFA weapons. This gun has been short barreled for 14 years. Now he wants to know how to go about making this firearm legal. Can he? What does he need to do?

Chipperman · December 3, 2008, 09:48 PM

1. Separate the barrel from the receiver and dispose of the barrel posthaste.
2a. Get a new barrel 18" or longer.
or
2b. If he wants an SBS, do a Form 1 to make an SBS. He can then put a short barrel on it when the Form is approved.

KUHIO · December 3, 2008, 10:09 PM

Thanks Chipperman. I did a little google and found some conflicting info from ATF here http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#m7. It says

Quote:

The NFA permits only manufacturers, makers, and importers to register firearms. Mere possessors may not register firearms. An unregistered NFA firearm is a contraband firearm, and it is unlawful to possess the weapon

But you're saying the gun is legal if he submits the proper form to the ATF and is approved?

hoytinak · December 3, 2008, 10:16 PM

The approved form 1 would make him (the owner) the "manufacturer" once he puts the short barrel on it.

KUHIO · December 3, 2008, 10:36 PM

Ok, I see, thanks for the clarification guys!

rkba_net · December 3, 2008, 11:32 PM

The weapon in ? is CONTRABAND and cannot legally be registered by an individual. NFA weapons must be registered PRIOR to manufacture by an individual. A PD / GOVT agency can register it, but the resulting weapon will be registered on an ATF FORM 10. These weapons cannot be transfered to anyone except PD's / GOVT agencies, not even CIII dealers or CII manufacturers. A felony has already be committed... he just was not caught... as far as putting a >18 barrel on it and then filling a form 1.... sure you can do it... ATF doesn't know the weapon exists... just because you can get away with it does NOT make it legal....

KUHIO · December 3, 2008, 11:44 PM

rkba_net- I know his gun is illegal. I knew that from the get go. Does that mean that even by disposing of the short barrel and installing a legal barrel the gun is contraband? Can he make the gun legal by install 18''+ barrel? THEN file the necessary paper work to SBS it? I realize that he can be in SERIOUS trouble if found in possession of this gun. I advised my coworker to notify him of that immediately. He has unknowingly been in violation of the law for 14 years! Is this guy at risk of criminal penalty no matter what he does?

FireCop203 · December 4, 2008, 09:52 AM

Quote:

rkba_net- I know his gun is illegal. I knew that from the get go. Does that mean that even by disposing of the short barrel and installing a legal barrel the gun is contraband? Can he make the gun legal by install 18''+ barrel? THEN file the necessary paper work to SBS it? I realize that he can be in SERIOUS trouble if found in possession of this gun. I advised my coworker to notify him of that immediately. He has unknowingly been in violation of the law for 14 years! Is this guy at risk of criminal penalty no matter what he does?

The gun IS illegal in it's current configuration. It is a $250.000.00 fine, 10 years in prison and a felony to possess.

If the barrel is removed and destroyed and replaced with a barrel over 18" in length, it is legal.

If the barrel is removed, taken to another location away from the receiver, it is legal. It is not illegal to possess a short barrel with no receiver. It is not illegal to possess a receiver without a barrel.

The procedure for registering under the rules of the NFA are as follows:

Has to be legal in your state of residence.

2 copies of ATF form 1 with your photographs attached and CLEO signature have to be submitted.

2 fingerprint cards.

1 citizenship form.

$200.00 fee.

Another requirement is that the gun must be engraved with specs meeting ATF requirements with a minimum of First initial, Last name and city and state of the manufacturer (person submitting Form 1).

There is also another procedure where you create a trust and no fingerprint cards, photos, or CLEO signoff is required. I do not know those procedures, so, I can't help you there.

Go to the website www.atf.gov and you will find a link to order all the forms you will need. There is also a contact number if you actuall want to speak to someone. All of these forms are free.

Once all the paperwork is completed and submitted there is a wait of 2-3 months for approval. Once approved, the gun can be reassembled. The gun can NOT be assembled until the approved Form 1 has been received.

GE-Minigun · December 4, 2008, 10:16 AM

Kuhio, what your buddy has to do is this…remove the current barrel and either destroy it, sell it or give it to someone that DOES NOT have a shotgun that it will fit. After that, if he wants to register the gun as an SBS he will have to fill out the Form 1 (very easy) and AFTER approval he can put the barrel back on. If however he’s not interested in doing the SBS thing, just add an 18” or longer barrel and go about his business. The gun is contraband now as it sits with the short barrel on it, NOT if he changes it out to 18” or longer. Criminal penalty…yes and no. Since he has the gun AND the short barrel he’s in danger of getting caught and being charged with “conspiracy to construct” or assemble… something along those lines. This is the main reason if a person wants to SBR an AR15 they should wait until the Form 1 is approved BEFORE getting the short barreled upper. If he gets rid of the barrel there’s no criminal penalty to be charged with.

December 3, 2008, 08:38 PM	#1
KUHIO Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 250	NFA Guru's-- Help please So I had a discussion with a coworker of mine today. He stated that he has a friend who owns a short barreled shotgun (16'' never been registered NFA) and only recently became aware of the legalities of NFA weapons. This gun has been short barreled for 14 years. Now he wants to know how to go about making this firearm legal. Can he? What does he need to do? Last edited by KUHIO; December 3, 2008 at 09:22 PM.

December 3, 2008, 11:44 PM	#7
KUHIO Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 250	rkba_net- I know his gun is illegal. I knew that from the get go. Does that mean that even by disposing of the short barrel and installing a legal barrel the gun is contraband? Can he make the gun legal by install 18''+ barrel? THEN file the necessary paper work to SBS it? I realize that he can be in SERIOUS trouble if found in possession of this gun. I advised my coworker to notify him of that immediately. He has unknowingly been in violation of the law for 14 years! Is this guy at risk of criminal penalty no matter what he does? Last edited by KUHIO; December 3, 2008 at 11:51 PM.

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December 3, 2008, 09:48 PM	#2
Chipperman Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2000 Location: Live Free or Die, Baby! Posts: 1,550	1. Separate the barrel from the receiver and dispose of the barrel posthaste. 2a. Get a new barrel 18" or longer. or 2b. If he wants an SBS, do a Form 1 to make an SBS. He can then put a short barrel on it when the Form is approved.

December 3, 2008, 10:16 PM	#4
hoytinak Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 5,721	The approved form 1 would make him (the owner) the "manufacturer" once he puts the short barrel on it.

December 3, 2008, 10:36 PM	#5
KUHIO Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 250	Ok, I see, thanks for the clarification guys!

December 3, 2008, 11:32 PM	#6
rkba_net Senior Member Join Date: October 26, 2000 Posts: 153	The weapon in ? is CONTRABAND and cannot legally be registered by an individual. NFA weapons must be registered PRIOR to manufacture by an individual. A PD / GOVT agency can register it, but the resulting weapon will be registered on an ATF FORM 10. These weapons cannot be transfered to anyone except PD's / GOVT agencies, not even CIII dealers or CII manufacturers. A felony has already be committed... he just was not caught... as far as putting a >18 barrel on it and then filling a form 1.... sure you can do it... ATF doesn't know the weapon exists... just because you can get away with it does NOT make it legal....

December 4, 2008, 10:16 AM	#9
GE-Minigun Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2008 Posts: 240	Kuhio, what your buddy has to do is this…remove the current barrel and either destroy it, sell it or give it to someone that DOES NOT have a shotgun that it will fit. After that, if he wants to register the gun as an SBS he will have to fill out the Form 1 (very easy) and AFTER approval he can put the barrel back on. If however he’s not interested in doing the SBS thing, just add an 18” or longer barrel and go about his business. The gun is contraband now as it sits with the short barrel on it, NOT if he changes it out to 18” or longer. Criminal penalty…yes and no. Since he has the gun AND the short barrel he’s in danger of getting caught and being charged with “conspiracy to construct” or assemble… something along those lines. This is the main reason if a person wants to SBR an AR15 they should wait until the Form 1 is approved BEFORE getting the short barreled upper. If he gets rid of the barrel there’s no criminal penalty to be charged with.