It's 2:00 AM and an Intruder is in your house

[OuTcAsT]

I agree, there is no possession worth taking a life However,If someone breaks into my home, he is a threat, I have no idea whether he is armed or not, and I don't care.

If he trespasses in my home, he is a threat to my self and my family, and I Will neutralize the threat up to, and including leathal force. I do not wish to take another human life at all, but I will if necessary.

If you want to stand around and have a conversation with an intruder in your home that is your choice (good luck with that)

I would rather explain the actions taken by me to make sure I, and my family survived, than to explain why my family did not survive to the rest of my kin.

remember: a corpse makes a poor witness at a trial.

[Rangefinder]

Why does it seem that a lot of people on this thread are almost eager to kill? To drop the hammer, pull the trigger, blast, smoke check, etc.

I'm a little curious about the same thing. One thing I can say to this---it's easy to talk about it, but living with it under even the most justified of circumstances is another matter entirely. To take a life under questionable circumstances is a serious burden on one's self, and people I associate with do not take the matter lightly, neither do I. It's an easy thing to say "anybody comes in my house uninvited, I'm texturing the walls with gray matter". The reality of it would put most into years of therapy and meds.

OK, that's enough "soap-box" for me today.

[RoscoeC]

Get a glock. Every trigger pull is the same. No de-cocker. No external safety. No crap. Pull the trigger it goes bang. First time, everytime, all the time. Don't want it to go bang, keep your finger off the trigger. When your life is at stake, DA/SA is just plain dangerous. When you are awakened in a stupor you are even more likely to misfire with two different trigger pulls. If they are all the same, then you are more likely to go to your muscle memory and do it right. Or, as others have suggested, there is no more effective or devastating weapon at short range than a properly deployed shotgun. However, my Glock is at my fingertips when I sleep, my shotgun is not.

And finally, if you question for one second whether you would use deadly force on an intruder to your home, get rid of all your firearms and invest in burglar bars. If you hesitate for an instant, he will very likely take your weapon from you and beat you to death with it.

[stephen426]

I mentioned this in another thread. Do you have a good alarm system that would alert you if your house was broken in to? This will scare off most burglers. Do you have a dog that might do the same as the alarm and maybe be even a little more than the alarm can? Do you sleep with your bedroom door locked and do you have nice solid doors?

If you answered yes to all of the above, then you can do whatever you want with your gun. Chances are that if the alarm goes off and the burgler does not leave, you are dealing with a more serious problem. If you don't have an alarm system or a dog, chances are you won't even know someone has broken into your house until he has a gun in your face.

If you really suspect an intruder, I would lock the door if possible (with gun in hand of course). I would go for cover (or concealment if that was all I had available) and then I would then call the police. Once the calvary is on the way, I would yell that I have called the police and that I have a gun. I would cover the door with my weapon (single action if you need) and yell that if the bad guy tries to go through the door, they would be shot. The racking of a shotgun is always a very compelling arguement too!

[joab]

Why does it seem that a lot of people on this thread are almost eager to kill? To drop the hammer, pull the trigger, blast, smoke check, etc.

I don't get that sense at all
What I see are people who are realistically looking at a very viablescenario and others trying to what if their way out of it.

Being prepared to shoot does not mean longing for the opportunity.
But trying to look at all the minute little angles will get you killed someday

[Model520Fan]

IFF I had my P225 beside my bed, I would not cock it unless the guy were coming up the stairs and I intended to pick him off at first appearance, but that's because I feel comfortable enough with DA and might have shaking hands while this was going on. I don't have a problem with your choice, because it sounds like you are more comfortable with SA, and seem conscious of the need to keep your finger away from the trigger before use.

In reality, I usually have a DAO revolver by my bed, one with a slightly better DA than your Ruger, most likely, and the act of gripping the gun firmly would settle any adrenaline issues. I have a lot of practice with S&W DA revolvers, and also with Colt DA's.

I feel that this is a personal choice based on your own observation of your own skills and tendencies. I suspect that you have chosen correctly, especially since you have thought about it and are continuing to do so. I also suspect that many folks, myself included, are usually better served by a good DAO.

[Mikeyboy]

+1 Stephen.. My thought is to take a defensive position in the house protecting you family and call 911. My spot is at the top of the stairs since all the bedrooms are on the second floor. If you are certain you have an intruder in your house, why go looking for trouble and get ambushed. Let the BG come to you. If the BG starts up the stairs he will have a flashlight beam and a pistol pointed at him. I'm in a superior position, with the BG being blinded by my flashlight. If he is unarmed I yell, "Freeze!" If he is armed, if he keeps on coming, etc. he gets a bullet. If he runs away, I let him go. Trust me , I will be yelling at him with my foul mouth,as he is running out the door, making it clear that if he comes back he and his whole family (the whole family thing is really BS of course) will die. I will be a good witness and the guy will get caught. Too many rambos think they just blast away at unarmed intruders, thinking it is somehow manly and fun, but they forget an important rule...Identify your target as friend or foe. Taking a shot at at an unarmed shadow in your house , can lead to you to accidently shooting a family member, your teenage daughter's boyfriend sneaking in (I have a nice drop piece for this ....just kidding), or a drunk neighbor thinking he is breaking into his own house. Even if it is a BG, are you willing to kill an unarmed intruder who meant your family no physical harm, and just wants to surrender or run when you point your gun at him?

As to the checking out a bump in the night with you gun in SA mode, we had this conversation in the revolver forum. Its not safe, and it increases your chances of having a AD.

[Blackwater OPS]

Why does it seem that a lot of people on this thread are almost eager to kill? To drop the hammer, pull the trigger, blast, smoke check, etc.

Even in the great state of Kalifornia, the law specifically assumes that a person in your home that should not be there presents a deadly threat. Why does it do this? Are the liberal politicians here eager to see people killed by citizens? No, a person who breaks into your home is a dangerous one and if you hesitate, you may save a harmless burglars life , or you may get killed by a guy who knows it's his third strike. Your chioce, no one here(hopefully) will judge you for it, but don't put those who would chose to act off as bloodthirsty.

[Rangefinder]

Also, I think a lot of it comes down to area. I know my attitude takes a healthy shift toward the "shoot first, ask later" state of mind when I'm in the thick of the bigger cities. Here, where I live currently (population 26,000), the chances of innocent mistake of going to the wrong door is much higher than a possible BG with intent to harm me or my family. Call it situational differences.

[Trip20]

Originally Posted by Powderman

OK. Here's a question...

Why does it seem that a lot of people on this thread are almost eager to kill? To drop the hammer, pull the trigger, blast, smoke check, etc.

Powderman,

I can’t speak for everyone, but my take is that what you see in this thread, is not necessarily blood lust, or some sick need to pull the trigger.

I think in most cases people respect the intrinsic danger posed by an intruder who has slipped – uninvited – into their sanctuary and more than likely has the “drop” on the homeowner. The responses in this thread show just how much certain people respect this danger, and their responses to this danger are serious and steadfast.

Originally Posted by Powderman

First of all, if someone is in your house, you have the drop on them, and they are not armed, why shoot? You do not have a reason to shoot them at that point.

If your family is not in imminent danger, why shoot?

In the dead of night, in a darkened home, startled awake (if your lucky) from a sound sleep; it is difficult for one to precisely inventory an intruder’s belongings in a timely manner, when all one can see is the dark silhouette creeping down the hallway.

This is not news to anyone, but all sorts of weapons are easily hidden aboard one's person. It's safe to assume these items will not be out in the open under a spotlight for the homeowner to catalog.

In my opinion, it's a bit naive to believe one will "have the drop" on a home invader, as more often than not, the opposite will be true -- it's my guess that the odds are in their favor. If by chance you "have the drop" on the intruder, well then possibly tactics could change -- but who knows.

Thankfully, the overwhelming majority of us will never have to deal with such a situation. I can’t imagine the terror one would feel if, God forbid, it should happen. Gives me the chills thinking about it.

For myself, I hope not to hesitate due to considering whether or not an intruder is armed. They're uninvited in my home, and once identified as non-friendly, I must assume there is credible danger of death of bodily harm.

Believe me, I want to shoot no one – ever – but I will to protect what’s dear to me.

[BigO01]

The nice thing about having a good sized dog is you get to laugh at questions like this . A burglar in my home is going to become a "chew toy" real fast and when I was a kid we had a fool break into our screened in back porch , BAD move thats where Charlie slept Charlie was a mixed breed shep that weighed in at about 60 lbs . The screams woke the whole family up , we found blood , parts of a T-shirt and jeans and two torn screens , one he cut to get to the lock and get in and the other he jumped out of trying to get away from Charlie . Funy thing was , I guess Charlie wasn't done playing and decide to play with him all the way home , dog came back the next morning all covered in blood none of which was his as he had no cuts on him at all because we gave him a nice hot bath and checked him over real well .

Never bothered to call the cops we figured the little scumbag got what he deserved , I often wonder if the dog killed him because there was a whole lotta blood on the porch , in the yard etc. etc. . of course this was back in the early 70's and if he did even the local politicians wouldn't have done anything as they would today .

So if anyone in my home gets past the dog and they get a good dose of lead SA/DA whatever , might grab a shotgun instead of a pistol , I wont worry about being choosy and of course a teenage son or two will probably grab a gun too .

Burglars don't stand much of a chance at my house , how about yours ?

[Model520Fan]

Big001,

Nice post.

Whom did you employ for grief counseling, if I may ask?

520

[stephen426]

Originally Posted by Trip20

In my opinion, it's a bit naive to believe one will "have the drop" on a home invader, as more often than not, the opposite will be true -- it's my guess that the odds are in their favor. If by chance you "have the drop" on the intruder, well then possibly tactics could change -- but who knows.

I defer you to my post on another thread...

If you cannot secure your house to prevent a bad guy from entering undetected, your home defense strategy is useless.

First line of defense should be deterrence. This may include motion activated flood lights, a fenced in yard with a guard dog, nasty thorny plants near windows, alarm decals, etc...

Second line of defense should be detection. This is where the alarm system and the dog come into play. Most alarm systems have a battery backup system. Mine also has cellular backup in case someone cuts the lines. Make sure you test your alarm system on a regular basis to ensure that everything works properly. Something to consider is adding a panic code and a panic password in case someone grabs you outside of your home and forces you to turn off the alarm. Use of the panic code turns off the siren but alerts the central station that police assistance is needed. My wife and I also have a code to alert each other in case of a such a scenario. You can ask a specific question or use a specific name that you never use (middle name or nickname).

Third line of defense depends on the actual threat level. This would typically mean gathering all family members in the safe room and covering the door with your home defense weapon. If the alarm goes off, train your family to go to the safe room immediately. If everyone is accounted for, then lock the door and call the police. If you need to go out and gather your family members, it becomes much more dangerous. Have your wife (if you are married) to lock the door and cover the door with a gun, and tell her to be ready to shoot anyone that comes through unannounced. If you need to go out of the safe room to gather the family, I would suggest a pistol rather than a long gun since it is easier to use one handed and easier to clear corners. You should have a high powered flash light that has a instant on/off tail cap in case you run across the bad guy or even consider a weapon mounted light so you have one free hand. The drawback of course is that the weapon light give the bad guy a nice place to aim. I do not feel that it is wise to clear your house yourself. If the police have decent response times where you live, just stay in the safe room protecting your family. Have them find cover (bath tubs work great) and keep their heads down. Once this is done, you can announce in a loud voice (from a position of cover) that the police are on their way and that you are armed and ready to shoot if the bad guy chooses to come through the door. Material things are replacable and besides, most burgleres will have high tailed it out of there once the alarm went off.

Remember... all this is only possible if you are alerted that your house has actually been broken into.

[Dre_sa]

just a thought...
once the alarm goes off, and evryone is safely in the safe room, turn the alarm off. this will serve multiple purposes, you will be able to hear again, you will be able to talk to the police over the phone effectively, and the bad guy will know you are home (possible psychological value might chase him off sooner) i know it would freak me right out.
of course you will be in the safe room covering the entrance with you HD weapon, and your family will be hiding in a safer spot (somewhere behind you).
to stay on topic, i think that if you are awake enough, by all measn switch to SA, just keep your finger off the trigger. once you hear something like the bad guy trying to get into you safe room, then you put it back on the trigger and yell at him to go away (how politely you do so will be left to your own discretion).

[FastDraw]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I really appreciate your thoughts.

For me when "I know" there is an intruder in the house in the early morning hours I plan to cock my DA/SA pistol and keep my finger OFF the trigger until I determine I intend to shoot.

Someone suggested having a shotgun. I do have. It is a Mossberg 500 loaded with #4 buckshot. Time permitting it would be my first choice. Also someone suggested a Glock. I own several, including a G27 and a G23. Quite honestly I shoot the G23 better than the Ruger P90....... but the G23 is my wife's bedside gun. She shoots this one rather well. (Maybe this is reason enough to buy a 2nd G23 )

Hopefully I will never have to defend my home........

Thanks again.........

FastDraw

[Trip20]

stephen426 -- great post.

The title of the thread was:

"It's 2:00 AM and an Intruder is in your house"

In addition, my post was in response to another poster who stated:

"First of all, if someone is in your house..."

Deferring me to a size 50 font wasn't necessary.

[stephen426]

Trip,

The big font was for the thread "do you sleep with a gun under your pillow". I just can't believe what a lack of common sense there is sometimes. People were talking about how it allows them to access their guns faster or how to draw undetected. On that post, I was just stressing the importance of having advanced warning.

If we are simply discussing whether or not to cock a pistol, then I guess it wouldn't matter as long as you kept your finger off the trigger. If you shoot low in DA, by all means shoot in SA.

[Trip20]

Stephen, I understand.

I was only pointing out that this particular thread was dealing with when there is already someone in your house.

But, I absolutely agree that your first 1st, 2nd, 3rd...etc, lines of defense should have to be breeched before it's time to employ your DA/SA skills. Simply relying on your nightstand gun is a sign of being ill prepared.

Not all lines of defense are plausible, affordable, or practical for all living environments, but one should do what one can based on one's lifestyle, living conditions, and budget – in addition to firearms and training.

[9guy]

Whatever you're most comfortable with. If you feel you shoot more accurately in SA, then cock it. However, it's true you're less likely to accidentally discharge in DA.

As far as identifying, ensuring they're armed, etc...that's up to you and the state you live in.

Personally, I believe if you don't want to get shot, you shouldn't break into someone's home, armed or not.

Every situation's different, but if you're sure it's a intruder and not a family member, I don't think you should waste time trying to interview them to determine their true intentions. That could cost you the lives of yourself and your family. I say take them down.

[stephen426]

Originally Posted by Trip20

Not all lines of defense are plausible, affordable, or practical for all living environments, but one should do what one can based on one's lifestyle, living conditions, and budget – in addition to firearms and training.

I'm not sure if you guys remember the movie Conspiracy Theory starring Mel Gibson and Julia Roberts. He had a few economical ways to alert him if there was an intruder. He placed a glass bottle upside down on the doorknob of his front door. While his other method may not be so practical, he shattered a light bulb and scattered it on the walkway so the crunch of the glass would alert him.

A few other cheapo methods to alert you of intruders is tying bells to your doors. It might look kind of silly but it would work. You could also buy a cheapo motion sensor from Radio Shack. Don't tell me you can't afford $15 bucks for your own security. Set this baby by the front door or the hall way leading to the bedroom, and an intruder will never get the drop on you.