nics delay question

[TreeAce]

I live in Ohio. If, after the three days expires, there is no response from nics and I purchase a shotgun what are the chances it will be taken away from me later? I have tried to buy on two different occasions from two different stores but both of those places will not continue without a PROCEED. Now this time I am dealing with a store who will make the sale. But I am worried, mostly because the gun is a Beretta 686 and it costs 2k. I would faint if the feds took it. If I do buy the shotgun then the store who sold it would notifiy whomever the the sale was made right? THEN they get moving on my back check?? I just dont understand why they just dont say YES..or..NO. I freely admit that I DO have red flags in my record. I am NOT a felon and have never been convicted of any DV. I have been charged with DV twice about 6 years apart and 7 years since the last time. I also have multiple dui and a couple of poss of marj. I am not proud of my past but it is what it is. I am just over 4 years sober. I mentioned my record cuz I would think it matters. Am I crazy to buy this expensive (for me) shotgun without a firm PROCEED?

[viper7342]

If an authorization to proceed isn't initially given in a NICS check, they then have three days to either call back and deny the transaction or the dealer is allowed to go ahead and proceed with the transaction... I would advise you speak to an attorney to confirm this as I am not one and don't claim to be.

[chasep255]

What would cause the NICS not to go through immediately?

[Don P]

What would cause the NICS not to go through immediately?

The OP's background. Domestic violence is a no no, as well as the pot, and maybe the DUI's.
To answer the OP if the dealer is willing to sell without the PROCEED that should raise the red flag to YOU. Not a legal sale with out the proceed.

[big_bad_kitty]

Viper hit the nail on the head. I am an attorney and a Class I FFL. If there is no response in three days, you are good to go. They do not need anything from NICS other than the no response within the three days. You will know prior to the purchase if there is a do not proceed or no response for your purchase. Buy it and you will be fine with no response. That is federal, not state.

[MC 1911]

If we do not hear something within 3 days,we call and let them know we are proceeding with the sale. No problem.

[csmsss]

I'm surprised no one mentioned this, but the OP mentioned that he has tried to purchase on MULTIPLE occasions and each time the NICS check did not come back clean immediately. That's not a fluke or a coincidence. Something is definitely wrong, and my guess is he knows and hasn't been completely forthcoming about what the reason(s) might be.

[dogtown tom]

Don P

The OP's background. Domestic violence is a no no, as well as the pot, and maybe the DUI's.
To answer the OP if the dealer is willing to sell without the PROCEED that should raise the red flag to YOU. Not a legal sale with out the proceed.

Sure it is and it happens all the time.

If NICS gives a "Delayed" response at the time of purchase they will tell the dealer "The Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer of this firearm on (date) . The date they give will be after three business days has elapsed; beginning the next business day. (Example: If the purchase was attempted on a Saturday the first business day would be Monday....meaning that unless NICS calls the dealer to "Deny" the transaction the firearm may be transferred on Thursday.)

Only about one out of five "Delayed" transactions will get me a NICS callback before the three days expires.

[Tom Servo]

I have been charged with DV twice about 6 years apart and 7 years since the last time. I also have multiple dui and a couple of poss of marj.

He's going to get delayed every time. If there are flags in someone's record, it's got to be checked, and the OP has a few flags.

Furthermore, the NICS system does not keep a persistent database of previous checks, so someone who gets delayed once can expect it to happen in the future.

Not a legal sale with out the proceed.

Dogtown Tom's response to this is correct, but there are some dealers who, out of caution or previous issues, will not release a gun until they actually get a solid "proceed" callback.

That said, there's nothing to prevent the dealer from calling himself to check up on the status.

[AH.74]

The OP also does not specify why he did not wait for the proceed order the previous two times he "tried" to make a purchase.

[vranasaurus]

But if they transfer after three days with no response and it later comes back denied an ATF agent will come and retrieve the gun.

What I would recommend is that you get copies of the court documents regarding all your convictions and arrests and talk to a lawyer. This would allow you to make sure none of the convictions or arrests disqualify you under state or federal law from possessing firearms. If any are disqualifying you may be able to seek expungement or restoration of rights. If they aren't you can apply for a UPIN that allows the FBI to keep a record of you in the NICS system so you can avoid delays.

Are there any assault convictions? Many times if you have one they have to do a little research to make sure it doesn't qualify as a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence. Qualifying as a MCDV depends on the elements of the offense and the relationship of the victim to the perpetrator. What the crime was called doesn't matter.

I get delayed every time and they always get a proceed 1 or 2 days later. Mine is due to a now expunged deferred adjudication for an aggravated misdemeanor assault. I have considered a UPIN but have just been too lazy to fill out the paperwork.

[Tom Servo]

We won't know much if we don't hear back from the OP, but if he's not denied, there's a process called Voluntary Appeal.

That's where the blank on the 4473 everybody skips comes into play, the one asking for a UPIN. One can voluntarily submit fingerprints and other information to the FBI, upon which they'll issue a number that allows the buyer to avoid future delays.

[littleitaly1]

I have been through this exact situation. IN the state of Ohio,it is unlawful to attempt to purchase a firearm while under weapons disability. In the state of Ohio,anyone who has EVER been charged with even the slightest drug charge is under weapons disablility,including misdemeanors..The fact that the ncis delays you,yet in three days dont respond,does NOT mean you dodged the bullet and can just go get your gun. Its YOUR responsibilty as a law abiding citizen to make the proper judgement here..Get a lawyer,take care of this like an adult. As long as you have a drug charge on your record,you are commiting a felony by attempting to purchase,possess,or even shoot someone elses firearm...period.

2923.13 Having weapons while under disability.


(A) Unless relieved from disability as provided in section 2923.14 of the Revised Code, no person shall knowingly acquire, have, carry, or use any firearm or dangerous ordnance, if any of the following apply:

(1) The person is a fugitive from justice.

(2) The person is under indictment for or has been convicted of any felony offense of violence or has been adjudicated a delinquent child for the commission of an offense that, if committed by an adult, would have been a felony offense of violence.

(3) The person is under indictment for or has been convicted of any offense involving the illegal possession, use, sale, administration, distribution, or trafficking in any drug of abuse or has been adjudicated a delinquent child for the commission of an offense that, if committed by an adult, would have been an offense involving the illegal possession, use, sale, administration, distribution, or trafficking in any drug of abuse.

(4) The person is drug dependent, in danger of drug dependence, or a chronic alcoholic.

(5) The person is under adjudication of mental incompetence, has been adjudicated as a mental defective, has been committed to a mental institution, has been found by a court to be a mentally ill person subject to hospitalization by court order, or is an involuntary patient other than one who is a patient only for purposes of observation. As used in this division, “mentally ill person subject to hospitalization by court order” and “patient” have the same meanings as in section 5122.01 of the Revised Code.

(B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of having weapons while under disability, a felony of the third degree.

Effective Date: 04-08-2004

[wally626]

littleitaly1

Good reply, points out that for many situations knowledge of specific state laws is important. From a federal level TreeAce would be good to go after the three day delay. But according to your post his drug possession conviction would have disqualified him under item 3. Unless the

Unless relieved from disability as provided in section 2923.14 of the Revised Code

applied.

(D) Upon hearing, the court may grant the applicant relief pursuant to this section, if all of the following apply:

(1) The applicant has been fully discharged from imprisonment, community control, post-release control, and parole, or, if the applicant is under indictment, has been released on bail or recognizance.

(2) The applicant has led a law-abiding life since discharge or release, and appears likely to continue to do so.

(3) The applicant is not otherwise prohibited by law from acquiring, having, or using firearms.

Looks possible for minor offenses for someone that has kept clean for over 5 years to get un-disabled, but I guess it is going to depend on the how the local courts treat these cases.

[vranasaurus]

I have been through this exact situation. IN the state of Ohio,it is unlawful to attempt to purchase a firearm while under weapons disability. In the state of Ohio,anyone who has EVER been charged with even the slightest drug charge is under weapons disablility,including misdemeanors..The fact that the ncis delays you,yet in three days dont respond,does NOT mean you dodged the bullet and can just go get your gun. Its YOUR responsibilty as a law abiding citizen to make the proper judgement here..Get a lawyer,take care of this like an adult. As long as you have a drug charge on your record,you are commiting a felony by attempting to purchase,possess,or even shoot someone elses firearm...period.

2923.13 Having weapons while under disability.


(A) Unless relieved from disability as provided in section 2923.14 of the Revised Code, no person shall knowingly acquire, have, carry, or use any firearm or dangerous ordnance, if any of the following apply:

(1) The person is a fugitive from justice.

(2) The person is under indictment for or has been convicted of any felony offense of violence or has been adjudicated a delinquent child for the commission of an offense that, if committed by an adult, would have been a felony offense of violence.

(3) The person is under indictment for or has been convicted of any offense involving the illegal possession, use, sale, administration, distribution, or trafficking in any drug of abuse or has been adjudicated a delinquent child for the commission of an offense that, if committed by an adult, would have been an offense involving the illegal possession, use, sale, administration, distribution, or trafficking in any drug of abuse.

(4) The person is drug dependent, in danger of drug dependence, or a chronic alcoholic.

(5) The person is under adjudication of mental incompetence, has been adjudicated as a mental defective, has been committed to a mental institution, has been found by a court to be a mentally ill person subject to hospitalization by court order, or is an involuntary patient other than one who is a patient only for purposes of observation. As used in this division, “mentally ill person subject to hospitalization by court order” and “patient” have the same meanings as in section 5122.01 of the Revised Code.

(B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of having weapons while under disability, a felony of the third degree.

Nowhere in that statute does it say anything about EVER being charged with a drug charge.

It says under indictment for drug charges which means that charges are pending. If the charges were dismissed or the accused was acquited the person is no longer under indictment.