What will out shoot a CZ 527,Tikka Varmint?

Vt.birdhunter · October 15, 2011, 07:48 PM

Looking for a .223 bolt action.

What will significantly outperform the CZ 527 Varmint and Tikka Varmint rifles?

Sako?

Weatherby Sub-MOA?

Custom rifle?

I appreciate any input, TYVM.

jgcoastie · October 15, 2011, 08:06 PM

What goal are you trying to accomplish?

Any of the above would be dandy shooters, provided the trigger puller does their part.

300magman · October 15, 2011, 08:28 PM

Welllllll....judging by the name, how about the Tikka SUPER Varmint

OR ... how about the exact same rifles, but with top quality handloads

More Seriously though -> For a better answer, you probably are going to have to define the parameters that you want to out preform...by what are you judging the rifles, and what abilities/qualities are you seeking in particular?

I will make a few general statements though, based on my experience, taking varmint rifles from several manufacturers and putting them side by side you may have a hard time determining a huge difference between how any of the better offerings on the market shoot. ... though with any, I presume you could luck into (or out of) a particularly good or bad example.

Though I've never fired one, I would presume that a $2500-$5000 custom rifle would be on an entirely different level; the kind that only a very very skilled shooter could find the limits of.

Fullboar · October 15, 2011, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vt.birdhunter

Looking for a .223 bolt action.

What will significantly outperform the CZ 527 Varmint and Tikka Varmint rifles?

Sako?

Weatherby Sub-MOA?

Custom rifle?

I appreciate any input, TYVM.

Unless you spend lots of $$$ on a custom rifle in a target type caliber (ie: 22PPC, 6mmPPC, 22BR, 6mmBR ect) you wont out shoot the Tikka Varmint and even then you still may not. Tikka's use the same barrels as what is on the Sako's so there's a good chance they will be around the same in accuracy. Their is a couple of old guy's at my local gun club that use Sako Varmints in 222 in bench rest comps that win just about everything and the only thing they have done to them is put them in a custom stocks and 1 has had factory trigger ajusted to make it really light the other has the factory Sako set trigger. IMHO Tikka's and Sako are without a doubt the most accurate factory production rifles on the market.

phil mcwilliam · October 16, 2011, 03:23 AM

I don't bench rest shoot, I mainly hunt. I own 4 Sako rifles & a CZ. I have also shot Tikka & Weatherby rifles in .22 centerfire.
Since I mainly own Sakos , I'm biased & Ill give them the edge, but even I wouldn't say there is a significant difference between these brands of rifle in accuracy - they are all good.

Vt.birdhunter · October 16, 2011, 08:05 AM

The only goal/parameter I have is to minimize grouping size. Wanted to stick with a .223, although I already shoot .222. It would take some real arm twisting to slip me into a new caliber.

300magman · October 16, 2011, 08:31 AM

You could consider finding a reputable smith with some experience in accurizing rifles; take him a rifle of your choice, and have him true the action, work the trigger, and install a custom barrel, along with a good bedding job on the stock.

That could get pretty expensive in a hurry, but it should be less than a custom rifle, especially if what you are starting with doesn't need All of the above work.

Vt.birdhunter · October 16, 2011, 10:03 AM

300Magman, how much of an accuracy gain would you expect with a bedded custom barrel over Tikka's factory setup on the T3 Sup Varmint? (rough ballpark)

Gain from action truing?

hooligan1 · October 16, 2011, 10:07 AM

Custom rifle? maybe.. GA Precision, out of Kansas City, Mo.

Jeff56 · October 16, 2011, 01:08 PM

Certain Savage rifles have a very good chance of shooting more accurate than those rifles. The 12 LRPV (said by many on the Savage board to be the best rifle Savage makes, the F/TR, F Class, etc. are all excellent shooters for what they do. If you want a hunting rifle you'll probably want a lighter rifle though. I've shot sub .5" groups at 100 yards with my 12 LRPV and I've shot many 2" groups at 440 yards with it. Then there's the fact that Savage stock rifles have been winning competitions against custom built rifles. That's a pretty good indication they are hard to beat as factory rifles.

300magman · October 16, 2011, 06:38 PM

Quote:

300Magman, how much of an accuracy gain would you expect with a bedded custom barrel over Tikka's factory setup on the T3 Sup Varmint? (rough ballpark)

Gain from action truing?

I am not the right man to ask, I have no experience with tikka's products and next to none with custom work.

darkgael · October 17, 2011, 12:58 PM

Quote:

how much of an accuracy gain would you expect with a bedded custom barrel over Tikka's factory setup on the T3 Sup Varmint? (rough ballpark)

You are asking questions that are pretty much impossible to answer even in a Ball Park kind of way. The number of variables involved is staggering.
Will there be any gain at all? Maybe....Maybe not. It depends.

With what kind of ammo?
What is the weather?
Who is doing the shooting?
What time of day?
How quickly is the group being shot?
Etc., etc., etc.

hagar · October 17, 2011, 07:44 PM

Remington VS, honest 1/3 inch groups multiple times.

lewwetzel · October 18, 2011, 12:01 AM

Cooper. And much better customer service than either.

makarov · October 18, 2011, 01:57 AM

I bought a CZ 527 Kevlar a few years back. It has the factory HS Precision stock. Really like that gun. Shoots fantastic groups. The single set trigger is easy to use and helps it shoot those groups. Hard to imagine anything really shooting that much better. I think I paid $600 for it about 6 years ago. It is a keeper. The Kevlar stock models have an aluminum bedding block in the stock and a free floated barrel.

Jeff56 · October 18, 2011, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Hard to imagine anything really shooting that much better.

That's probably true but just for the record my 12 LRPV also has an H-S Precision stock, an aluminum bedding block and the barrel is free floated. I find it hard to believe anything will shoot a lot better than it does. But all those things are secondary to the barrel anyway. Unless a rifle has a great barrel it won't shoot great. I've been shocked at how well my Savage shoots really but from other reports I've seen it isn't that unusual for other Savages to shoot as well as mine does. And swapping barrels is pretty easy on them too so at some point you can upgrade to a better barrel if that's what you want.

Scorch · October 18, 2011, 11:41 AM

A few options in the accuracy department:
- TC Icon is one of the most accurate rifles on the market, check them out.
- Howa 1500/Weatherby vanguard Sub-MOA (essentially the same rifle) are consistently accurate.
- Tikka Varmint is a good choice.
- CZ (I would probably opt for the 550 Varmint, but it's your choice).
- Remington 700, any Remington 700.
- Oh, yeah, and Savage. They shoot very well. Look like hammered ****, but they shoot very well.

Vt.birdhunter · October 18, 2011, 06:37 PM

I appreciate the advice.

Cooper is certainly on the wish list.
Ill check out the TC Icon and the CZ 550 Varmint as well.

TYVM

Jeff56 · October 18, 2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

They shoot very well. Look like hammered ****, but they shoot very well.

Savage has gone out of their way to improve the looks of their rifle lately. They have reduced the size of the barrel nut which is what has always made them look like hunchbacks.

The big thing though is it's almost impossible to find a better shooting rifle than a Savage especially for the money you spend. It's no fluke that they take stock built rifles right off the rack and win competitions against CUSTOM built rifles costing 5 times as much or more. No other rifle company can make that claim. That is incredibly impressive IMO and it's the reason I bought a Savage 12 LRPV. And it certainly hasn't disappointed me at all. It shoots fantastic. It shoots way better than I do. It's almost easy to shoot 2" groups at a quarter of a mile and I never shot that much distance before I bought this rifle. There aren't many places to shoot that far around this area but I joined a club that has a range that far. They keep talking about getting a 600 yard range going but it still hasn't happened. Whatever the case my Savage will hang in with any stock rifle I've ever shot.

Fullboar · October 18, 2011, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vt.birdhunter

I appreciate the advice.

Cooper is certainly on the wish list.
Ill check out the TC Icon and the CZ 550 Varmint as well.

TYVM

Do yourself a favour and at least checkout the Sako, IMHO the best factory production rifle on the market. The Trigger, Barrel, Stock, Fit and Finish can not be beaten (unless you go custom but even then it's close). The accuracy guarantee is also the best, while other gun manufacturers guarantee to be MOA or Sub MOA, their's is with premium match grade ammo with only 3 shots. The Sako is guaranteed to shoot 1" (Sub MOA) with any ammo (standard hunting ammo ect) with 5 shots (even their light weight sporter barrel rifles carry this guarantee).

Rimfire5 · October 19, 2011, 08:18 AM

+1 for the CZ 527.

I have a .223 Kevlar Varmint HS Precision stock version with a 1:9 twist and it shoots great. I love the set trigger for testing loads on the bench. It breaks at a very nice 1 lb 6 oz and the factory trigger is a crisp 3 lbs and perfect for the field. No need to even bother adjusting it.

The first group out of the box was 0.238 with 52 grain SMKs.

Since then I have tried 50, 52, 55, 60, 63 and 65 grain bullet loads and I have 20 hand loads with those weights that all have group averages under 0.45 inches with the best 25 groups from 0.116 to 0.213. I have shot 469 measured groups through the CZ and it shoots as good now as it did when I shot that first group.

I have never had another rifle shoot so well across such a wide variety of bullet weights.

October 15, 2011, 07:48 PM	#1
Vt.birdhunter Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 637	What will out shoot a CZ 527,Tikka Varmint? Looking for a .223 bolt action. What will significantly outperform the CZ 527 Varmint and Tikka Varmint rifles? Sako? Weatherby Sub-MOA? Custom rifle? I appreciate any input, TYVM. __________________ Maintaining a constant state of cat-like readiness and a heightened state of suspicious alertness.

October 15, 2011, 08:06 PM	#2
jgcoastie Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Location: Kodiak, Alaska Posts: 2,118	What goal are you trying to accomplish? Any of the above would be dandy shooters, provided the trigger puller does their part. __________________ "To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them." -Richard Henry Lee, Virginia delegate to the Continental Congress, initiator of the Declaration of Independence, and member of the first Senate, which passed the Bill of Rights.

October 15, 2011, 08:28 PM	#3
300magman Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2008 Posts: 714	Welllllll....judging by the name, how about the Tikka SUPER Varmint OR ... how about the exact same rifles, but with top quality handloads More Seriously though -> For a better answer, you probably are going to have to define the parameters that you want to out preform...by what are you judging the rifles, and what abilities/qualities are you seeking in particular? I will make a few general statements though, based on my experience, taking varmint rifles from several manufacturers and putting them side by side you may have a hard time determining a huge difference between how any of the better offerings on the market shoot. ... though with any, I presume you could luck into (or out of) a particularly good or bad example. Though I've never fired one, I would presume that a $2500-$5000 custom rifle would be on an entirely different level; the kind that only a very very skilled shooter could find the limits of. Last edited by 300magman; October 15, 2011 at 08:41 PM.

October 16, 2011, 08:05 AM	#6
Vt.birdhunter Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 637	The only goal/parameter I have is to minimize grouping size. Wanted to stick with a .223, although I already shoot .222. It would take some real arm twisting to slip me into a new caliber. __________________ Maintaining a constant state of cat-like readiness and a heightened state of suspicious alertness. Last edited by Vt.birdhunter; October 16, 2011 at 08:23 AM.

October 16, 2011, 10:03 AM	#8
Vt.birdhunter Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 637	300Magman, how much of an accuracy gain would you expect with a bedded custom barrel over Tikka's factory setup on the T3 Sup Varmint? (rough ballpark) Gain from action truing? __________________ Maintaining a constant state of cat-like readiness and a heightened state of suspicious alertness.

October 16, 2011, 03:23 AM	#5
phil mcwilliam Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2007 Posts: 573	I don't bench rest shoot, I mainly hunt. I own 4 Sako rifles & a CZ. I have also shot Tikka & Weatherby rifles in .22 centerfire. Since I mainly own Sakos , I'm biased & Ill give them the edge, but even I wouldn't say there is a significant difference between these brands of rifle in accuracy - they are all good.

October 16, 2011, 08:31 AM	#7
300magman Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2008 Posts: 714	You could consider finding a reputable smith with some experience in accurizing rifles; take him a rifle of your choice, and have him true the action, work the trigger, and install a custom barrel, along with a good bedding job on the stock. That could get pretty expensive in a hurry, but it should be less than a custom rifle, especially if what you are starting with doesn't need All of the above work.

October 16, 2011, 10:07 AM	#9
hooligan1 Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2010 Location: Independence Missouri Posts: 4,586	Custom rifle? maybe.. GA Precision, out of Kansas City, Mo. __________________ Keep your Axe sharp and your powder dry.

October 16, 2011, 01:08 PM	#10
Jeff56 Junior member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Posts: 116	Certain Savage rifles have a very good chance of shooting more accurate than those rifles. The 12 LRPV (said by many on the Savage board to be the best rifle Savage makes, the F/TR, F Class, etc. are all excellent shooters for what they do. If you want a hunting rifle you'll probably want a lighter rifle though. I've shot sub .5" groups at 100 yards with my 12 LRPV and I've shot many 2" groups at 440 yards with it. Then there's the fact that Savage stock rifles have been winning competitions against custom built rifles. That's a pretty good indication they are hard to beat as factory rifles.

October 17, 2011, 07:44 PM	#13
hagar Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2000 Location: Colombia, SC Posts: 745	Remington VS, honest 1/3 inch groups multiple times. __________________ I don't have time for busy people

October 18, 2011, 12:01 AM	#14
lewwetzel Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2008 Posts: 105	Cooper. And much better customer service than either.

October 18, 2011, 01:57 AM	#15
makarov Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2000 Location: Washington State Posts: 709	I bought a CZ 527 Kevlar a few years back. It has the factory HS Precision stock. Really like that gun. Shoots fantastic groups. The single set trigger is easy to use and helps it shoot those groups. Hard to imagine anything really shooting that much better. I think I paid $600 for it about 6 years ago. It is a keeper. The Kevlar stock models have an aluminum bedding block in the stock and a free floated barrel. __________________ "Where Zen ends, asskicking begins" - Hyde - That 70's Show

October 18, 2011, 11:41 AM	#17
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	A few options in the accuracy department: - TC Icon is one of the most accurate rifles on the market, check them out. - Howa 1500/Weatherby vanguard Sub-MOA (essentially the same rifle) are consistently accurate. - Tikka Varmint is a good choice. - CZ (I would probably opt for the 550 Varmint, but it's your choice). - Remington 700, any Remington 700. - Oh, yeah, and Savage. They shoot very well. Look like hammered ****, but they shoot very well. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

October 18, 2011, 06:37 PM	#18
Vt.birdhunter Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 637	I appreciate the advice. Cooper is certainly on the wish list. Ill check out the TC Icon and the CZ 550 Varmint as well. TYVM __________________ Maintaining a constant state of cat-like readiness and a heightened state of suspicious alertness.

October 19, 2011, 08:18 AM	#21
Rimfire5 Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 923	+1 for the CZ 527. I have a .223 Kevlar Varmint HS Precision stock version with a 1:9 twist and it shoots great. I love the set trigger for testing loads on the bench. It breaks at a very nice 1 lb 6 oz and the factory trigger is a crisp 3 lbs and perfect for the field. No need to even bother adjusting it. The first group out of the box was 0.238 with 52 grain SMKs. Since then I have tried 50, 52, 55, 60, 63 and 65 grain bullet loads and I have 20 hand loads with those weights that all have group averages under 0.45 inches with the best 25 groups from 0.116 to 0.213. I have shot 469 measured groups through the CZ and it shoots as good now as it did when I shot that first group. I have never had another rifle shoot so well across such a wide variety of bullet weights.