231 and .38 spc light pop can loads

Wyoredman · March 1, 2012, 10:59 AM

Is 3.5 gr of WW 231 to light for a 158gr LSWC in a .38 SPC?

I want a light round for shooting cans.

I have Lyman, Sierra, Speer, and Hodgdon manuals and they are conflicting as to the min load with 231.

I want to use 231 because I have alot of it on hand. If I go buy a different powder, my can plinking costs go up quite a bit!

Thanks for the insight.

**Mike Irwin** · March 1, 2012, 11:09 AM

Nope.

That's right in the middle of the recommended loads on the Hodgdon site, which go from 3.1 grains to 3.7 grains.

I've actually gone below 3.1 grains before...

Wyoredman · March 1, 2012, 11:35 AM

Thanks, I just wanted confirmation from another reloader! Makes me sleep better an night!

joneb · March 1, 2012, 11:41 PM

I found 4.0gr of 231 with 158gr lswc loaded for .38spl is very accurate, I would work down for that. I would not go below the minimum load.

BossHoss · March 3, 2012, 07:42 AM

LOL.

I have a 32lb keg of this dirty powder.

It is a great shotgun powder.

Loaded at less than the max it becomes VERY dirty in handguns in my experience. My friend and I who are trying to burn this up, call our dirty hands after shooting it....231 hands!!!

but,

Bonus.

Yes, 4.0gns in a 38 spec case with my H and G #50's and the Lyman DEWC 358xxx (cant remember the number) , both 148's shoot the tightest darn groups out of a Smith Mod. 27 that I have seen.

No, they are NOT puffer loads at all. But, print clover leafs .

4.0 231 with the 158 lswc is a winner also...even less dirty, better burn completion.

Dropping the powder charge,...will decrease expansion and sealing of the cyl, and make for very dirty guns, hands.

There ARE plenty of better powders for PUFFER loads that are not as dirty.

So, if you want smoky , and dirty, but LIGHT with 231 ...reduce the charge and have fun....the cleanup afterwards will make you try a proper pressure load for that powder's burn-rate.

**Mike Irwin** · March 3, 2012, 11:41 AM

"I have a 32lb keg of this dirty powder.

It is a great shotgun powder."

You don't have a keg of 231, then.

231 has no commercial or home reloader applications as a shotshell powder. Like Bullseye, 231s only application is as a handgun powder.

And where did you get a 32 pound keg of powder? The largest container size provided for commercial sale is 8 pounds. I believe that's set by Department of Transportation regulations.

I've never found 231 to be smokey or dirty at all when firing reduced loads. I have found lubed lead bullets to be VERY smokey, though.

Paul B. · March 3, 2012, 01:58 PM

"I've never found 231 to be smokey or dirty at all when firing reduced loads. I have found lubed lead bullets to be VERY smokey, though."

I have to agree. For .38 Spl. level loads with .357 Mag. brass i use 5.0 gr. of Unique and the Lyman #358156 semiwadcutter bullet. Weighs right at 158 gr. in my alloy. vey accurate. FWIW, the bullet is sized to .359".
For those who might care, my pet load for the .38 Spl. is the Lyman #358495 148 gr. wadcutter over 3.1 gr. of W231. Extremely accurate in my K38 S&W.
Paul B.

jim8115 · March 4, 2012, 12:21 PM

I chrono'ed some 158 Gr hornady LSWC/hp's with 4.0 grains of 231 from my 4" model 10
AVG was 726 FPS

Gatofeo · March 4, 2012, 11:36 PM

I've been using 231 since it was introduced in the 1970s. Never found it a dirty powder.
It's clean burning in my handguns (.25 ACP, .380 ACP, 9mm with lead bullets, .38 Special, .44 Special, .44-40, .45 Long Colt with lead bullets for light target loads, and .45 ACP with lead bullets).
I suspect that Bosshawg got 231 confused with Unique, which has a (largely undeserved) reputation for being dirty, and is also used in shotgun shells.
I've never seen a recipe for using 231 in shotgun shells. I suppose it might be used for very, very low velocity loads in the smaller gauges, but I sure wouldn't want to experiment!
I leave the load recommendations to the manufacturers, who have modern equipment to measure pressures and trained ballisticians to recognize potential problems. Anything less is guesswork that may be very dangerous.

**Mike Irwin** · March 5, 2012, 07:34 AM

"I suppose it might be used for very, very low velocity loads in the smaller gauges"

Only if you want to blow the side out of the chamber or the barrel.

kraigwy · March 5, 2012, 08:48 AM

A lot can be gained by reading reloading manuels, the part about reloading and reloading components, .................... not just the loading data.

Wyoredman · March 5, 2012, 10:52 AM

Tried them out on Satrurday. Very accurate and nice to shoot. Cans don't stand a chance @ 25 yards with these loads! And you can shoot them all day without any flinch. A very nice soft shooting load. Thanks for the help.

March 1, 2012, 10:59 AM	#1
Wyoredman Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2011 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,350	231 and .38 spc light pop can loads Is 3.5 gr of WW 231 to light for a 158gr LSWC in a .38 SPC? I want a light round for shooting cans. I have Lyman, Sierra, Speer, and Hodgdon manuals and they are conflicting as to the min load with 231. I want to use 231 because I have alot of it on hand. If I go buy a different powder, my can plinking costs go up quite a bit! Thanks for the insight. __________________ Go Pokes! Go Rams!

March 1, 2012, 11:09 AM	#2
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	Nope. That's right in the middle of the recommended loads on the Hodgdon site, which go from 3.1 grains to 3.7 grains. I've actually gone below 3.1 grains before... __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

March 3, 2012, 11:41 AM	#6
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	"I have a 32lb keg of this dirty powder. It is a great shotgun powder." You don't have a keg of 231, then. 231 has no commercial or home reloader applications as a shotshell powder. Like Bullseye, 231s only application is as a handgun powder. And where did you get a 32 pound keg of powder? The largest container size provided for commercial sale is 8 pounds. I believe that's set by Department of Transportation regulations. I've never found 231 to be smokey or dirty at all when firing reduced loads. I have found lubed lead bullets to be VERY smokey, though. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

March 3, 2012, 01:58 PM	#7
Paul B. Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 1999 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 3,801	"I've never found 231 to be smokey or dirty at all when firing reduced loads. I have found lubed lead bullets to be VERY smokey, though." I have to agree. For .38 Spl. level loads with .357 Mag. brass i use 5.0 gr. of Unique and the Lyman #358156 semiwadcutter bullet. Weighs right at 158 gr. in my alloy. vey accurate. FWIW, the bullet is sized to .359". For those who might care, my pet load for the .38 Spl. is the Lyman #358495 148 gr. wadcutter over 3.1 gr. of W231. Extremely accurate in my K38 S&W. Paul B. __________________ COMPROMISE IS NOT AN OPTION!

March 4, 2012, 12:21 PM	#8
jim8115 Senior Member Join Date: July 23, 2011 Location: Arkansas Posts: 229	for what its worth I chrono'ed some 158 Gr hornady LSWC/hp's with 4.0 grains of 231 from my 4" model 10 AVG was 726 FPS

March 1, 2012, 11:35 AM	#3
Wyoredman Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2011 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,350	Thanks, I just wanted confirmation from another reloader! Makes me sleep better an night! __________________ Go Pokes! Go Rams!

March 1, 2012, 11:41 PM	#4
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	I found 4.0gr of 231 with 158gr lswc loaded for .38spl is very accurate, I would work down for that. I would not go below the minimum load.

March 3, 2012, 07:42 AM	#5
BossHoss Member Join Date: January 22, 2010 Posts: 25	FAVORITE POWDER!!! For now.... LOL. I have a 32lb keg of this dirty powder. It is a great shotgun powder. Loaded at less than the max it becomes VERY dirty in handguns in my experience. My friend and I who are trying to burn this up, call our dirty hands after shooting it....231 hands!!! but, Bonus. Yes, 4.0gns in a 38 spec case with my H and G #50's and the Lyman DEWC 358xxx (cant remember the number) , both 148's shoot the tightest darn groups out of a Smith Mod. 27 that I have seen. No, they are NOT puffer loads at all. But, print clover leafs . 4.0 231 with the 158 lswc is a winner also...even less dirty, better burn completion. Dropping the powder charge,...will decrease expansion and sealing of the cyl, and make for very dirty guns, hands. There ARE plenty of better powders for PUFFER loads that are not as dirty. So, if you want smoky , and dirty, but LIGHT with 231 ...reduce the charge and have fun....the cleanup afterwards will make you try a proper pressure load for that powder's burn-rate.

March 4, 2012, 11:36 PM	#9
Gatofeo Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2004 Location: Remote Utah desert Posts: 224	I've been using 231 since it was introduced in the 1970s. Never found it a dirty powder. It's clean burning in my handguns (.25 ACP, .380 ACP, 9mm with lead bullets, .38 Special, .44 Special, .44-40, .45 Long Colt with lead bullets for light target loads, and .45 ACP with lead bullets). I suspect that Bosshawg got 231 confused with Unique, which has a (largely undeserved) reputation for being dirty, and is also used in shotgun shells. I've never seen a recipe for using 231 in shotgun shells. I suppose it might be used for very, very low velocity loads in the smaller gauges, but I sure wouldn't want to experiment! I leave the load recommendations to the manufacturers, who have modern equipment to measure pressures and trained ballisticians to recognize potential problems. Anything less is guesswork that may be very dangerous. __________________ "And lo, did I see an ugly cat. Smoke. Brimstone. Holes in parchment. And this ugly cat was much amused." --- The Prophesies of Gatodamus (1503 - 1566)

March 5, 2012, 07:34 AM	#10
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	"I suppose it might be used for very, very low velocity loads in the smaller gauges" Only if you want to blow the side out of the chamber or the barrel. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

March 5, 2012, 08:48 AM	#11
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	A lot can be gained by reading reloading manuels, the part about reloading and reloading components, .................... not just the loading data. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

March 5, 2012, 10:52 AM	#12
Wyoredman Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2011 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,350	Tried them out on Satrurday. Very accurate and nice to shoot. Cans don't stand a chance @ 25 yards with these loads! And you can shoot them all day without any flinch. A very nice soft shooting load. Thanks for the help. __________________ Go Pokes! Go Rams!

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