Moose hunting; .50 BMG?

Brett Bellmore · September 2, 2000, 08:24 AM

My brother in law is suggesting that we plan to go moose hunting in a couple of years; Would a .50 BMG rifle like the Maadi-Griffin be suitable for such a hunt? I just bought the plans, and could have it finished by then.

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Sic semper tyrannis!

ArmySon · September 2, 2000, 08:43 AM

You could use it but it's a bit of an overkill.

Brett Bellmore · September 2, 2000, 09:53 AM

ArmySon: Would it be? I was figuring on using the .30 saboted rounds; Stewart warns that the use of the full sized bronze bullets wears out your barrel in short order.

Actually, though, I was more concerned about legalities, hunting regulations. This trip is still in the planning stages, and neither of us even has a firearm suitable for moose hunting yet.

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Sic semper tyrannis!

Al Thompson · September 2, 2000, 10:45 AM

The legalities of assembling the rifle are beyond this particular forum.

Hunting with a .50 is (AFAIK) legal everywhere. Somebody out west introduced a bill trying to outlaw the .50 for elk.

IMHO, it's sort of a waste. My understanding is that moose are fairly close range targets. If your going to use a .30 bullet, you might be ahead dollar wise getting a good rifle. Additionally, the saboted bullet should be selected with care as the velocity may over stress the bullet. (4000 fps?) I would think hard about a Barnes X bullet myself.

Giz

Art Eatman · September 2, 2000, 12:56 PM

Having acquired an incredible amount of knowledge and expertise in the hunting of the mighty moose from TV and the huntin'zines,

it seems to me that the comment about close range has merit. The majority of all meese seem to be shot within 100 yards.

Modern loadings in the .45-70 seem to me to a rational approach. "Big" .30s with heavy bullets also are commonly accepted.

FWIW, Art

BadMedicine · September 3, 2000, 02:13 AM

Where are you going moose hunting? That really depends on whether its legal there or not. In Idaho, the gun can't weigh more than 16 lbs, that includes the scope, clips, sling, bullets, and everything, can't be a rim-fire, and it also can't be a set-gun. But in alaska the only restrictions are no rim-fires, and no set-guns, so as long as you can carry it, bring a friggen cannon!! We just got home from moose hunting about 1/2 hour ago. I took my .375 H&H and my dad carries a .338 win mag. We also took the .22-250, for black-dot shots

Yes, most shot's are within a hundred yards, and putting the sneak on them is about as challenging as sneaking up on a farm-yard cow, but the stuff they live in is thick undergrowth, and nearly un-penetratable. they can walk 5 yrds, and lay down, and you'll never see them again. Hence the .22-250. If they're more than a couple hundred yards, and only in a small clearing, they'll be gone before you get there, so ya shoot them in the neck, and then go get them. (this is all in theory, so far, we've shot them with nothing less than a .338) But a guy we knew offed one with a .22, yes a bit light, but that's all he had. "I shot 'em in the back of his head, an' his legs went limp like wet noodles." I think a .50 will be plenty enough gun. you won't be carrying it though will you? mostly spot and stock, or spot and snipe?? Good luck

Brett Bellmore · September 3, 2000, 07:25 AM

Gizmo99: Actually, I've already checked the legalities of building it where I live, and that's no problem. As for hunting with it being legal everywhere, I wish! (Or maybe I don't.) Can't use ANY rifle on deer in the lower half of Michigan; Have to use a shotgun with deer slugs. Some nimrods in the legislature think that's safer in populated areas... Like there aren't populated areas north of their stupid line, and expanses of nothing south of it!

Actually, I agree that the Maadi-Griffin might not be the best choice for hunting moose, but it's what I've got the plans for, and am looking for an excuse to build.

We're looking at Montana, by the way.

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Sic semper tyrannis!

Dangus · September 3, 2000, 08:05 AM

To my knowledge, hunting with rifles is not legal everywhere. In Iowa, if I remember correctly, it is illegal to hunt with any rifles, only shotguns, and in some rare cases, pistols are allowed. Black powder is an exception to the rifle rule as long as it's a muzzle loader or a pistol.

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The Alcove

I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist

The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me

Al Thompson · September 3, 2000, 05:33 PM

There are lots of places where rifles are not permitted. We have a few here - shotgun only or what ever.

I am aware of minimum calibers - .24 in my home state of Tennessee for instance. "Maximum" calibers don't seem to be a problem. Yet.

Giz

Dangus · September 4, 2000, 01:39 AM

While I would love to rifle hunt, I understand why it's illegal in states like Iowa, where most hunting is done in farm country, which has too many houses around and too many roads to be safe with rifles.

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The Alcove

I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist

The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me

Keith Rogan · September 4, 2000, 11:28 AM

I think you'll be cursing the day you were born if you ever have to drag 30 pounds of rifle through a swamp looking for moose. Are you going to try and shoot that thing off the shoulder or do you figure you'll just find them out in a pasture where you can just set up a bipod?

You're not going to hunt in the lower 48 because you can go through your whole life without ever being drawn for moose. You can try Canada but I doubt they'll let you in the country with a .50 bmg.
That leaves Alaska where toting a rifle that size through muskeg and "hippy-heads" and alder jungles is ....not going to be much fun.

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Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan

Schmit · September 4, 2000, 11:57 AM

> That leaves Alaska where toting a rifle that size through muskeg and "hippy-heads" and alder jungles is ....not going to be much fun.

Toting any rifle through alder jungles is not much fun IMO!

Hippy-heads? I know what you mean but we called them something different. Pulled a groin muscle walking over a field of them once. Snow was just deep enough where you couldn't make out where they were. You'd be on top of one then then next step you'd wouldn't be. Try that w/o snowshoes while carrying a pack... better yet... don't!

Keith Rogan · September 5, 2000, 10:58 AM

I always used that other name too, just because it was the only thing I knew to call them. If you call them "tussocks", people just say, "huh"?
I'm more comfortable with "hippy-heads" than the standard term.

For those of you who haven't had the pleasure, these things are little grass topped hummocks about the size of a human head and spaced 6-8" apart. Some areas, like SW Alaska have thousands of square miles of these little ankle busters which can't really be appreciated until you are packing 80 pounds of meat over them for miles at a time.

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Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan

BadMedicine · September 5, 2000, 11:36 AM

If they're 6-8" apart, you're lucky. Alot of the time they're right next to eachother and you have to watch every step you make to keep from landing a foot in-between them, and falling up to you're hip in water, or busting your leg. You also can't watch for game as well if you have to divirt all your attention to these so-called "hippie-heads"

Dr.Rob · September 5, 2000, 11:44 AM

50? Are you afraid your moose is going to be driving an armored car?

Seriously, while the .50 has legitimate use as a long range sporting arm.. the there is a HUGE difference between SHOOTING a moose, and hunting one. Your shot will likely be up close and personal (within 100 yds)

A solid 375 H&H magnum by CZ is more than up to the task, as far as busting brush and breaking bones.

Rob

dZ · September 5, 2000, 04:12 PM

let alone the catcalls back at camp when everyone knows you touched off a round and missed!

dZ

Erik · September 5, 2000, 04:36 PM

A couple of my friends are transplants from Maine. Two used to guide moose hunts. They commented that a .30-30 or a 30-06 was all most brought along- or needed to bring along.

ArmySon · September 5, 2000, 10:50 PM

Whenever a buddies of mine ask me is this caliber or that caliber enough to kill a moose, bear, elk, etc, I ask them this question, "What did people use before modern rifles were invented to take big game?"

Cosmoline · September 6, 2000, 02:20 AM

As I understand these matters, the hard part is finding your trophy bull. After that you just hike in and shoot him at fairly close range. Moose aren't deer. They don't bolt off at the first sign of humans. In Los Anchorage and nearby trails I've walked right next to moose hundreds of times. Most of the time they just stand there like cattle. Of course, from time to time they will decide to have some fun and bolt *toward* the trail monkeys. When that happens, just jump into the devil's club and you'll be fine. Other than the inch-long thorns in your flesh.

BadMedicine · September 6, 2000, 12:00 PM

Yes, moose aren't as skittish as deer, but city moose, and the ones you'll be hunting, are two different animals. "los anchorage" mooose see people everyday. last spring we had a cow and calf eating our newly planted garden. Out came the wristrocket, and a well planted steel ball on her rump sent her stampeding away, with babies in close pursuit. And last winter a young bull moose decided the best place for him to lay down was on Tudor road (busy road right in town) this worked out fine till an impaciant motorist decide he would just drive closer honking till the moose left. The moose started to get up "good, it's working" It then charged the car and careemed into the front of the car mashing the h*ll out of it. The motorist was then pleased to see that it worked, the moose waltzed into the woods unfazed. While wild moose can be stalked, fairly close, exspecially in the thick stuff they live, don't expect to just walk up to thirty yards and plink them. Unlike their cousins in anchorage, the wild ones ahve to avoid predators.

Field-dressed · September 7, 2000, 01:48 AM

Gotta agree with the Doc. Bull moose aren't deer, but they're sure as hell not like hunting cattle. You can screw your self out of a moose very easily. Most shots are under 100 yards and I'd hate to be the one toting a .50 BMG out of the bush. I've killed several with my 30-06, 1 with my bow and hope my next one will be with a spankin new 45-70.

Brett - Build the rifle and THEN discover the need for a new moose shooter.

Thibault · October 2, 2000, 03:29 PM

50?
Forget Canada.... You can't legally own one of those, let alone hunt with it....
Our recipe in Northern Quebec, as far as moose is concerned, is pretty much anything in the 27 to 30 range, 300 Win Mag being considered almost overkill, and anything over it a laughing matter....
Shoot whatever you feel comfy with, light enough to drag all day...

Dave McC · October 3, 2000, 04:47 AM

Not a moose marauder, few here in Md. But, recalling Col Askins, the 30-30 is probably the round that's killed the most moose.

BadMedicine · October 3, 2000, 11:47 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>the 30-30 is probably the round that's killed the most moose.[/quote]

That don't make it the best round. I read somewhere that most of the grizzlies killed in the states was with 30-30's. It isn't the best cartridge, but it's what the settleers and the indians had when the West was being won, and that's what they used. Moose aren't incredibly tough, or strong willed like a grizz, they die as easy (size comparably) as a deer, but you also want to shoot them with a size comparably bullet.

September 2, 2000, 08:24 AM	#1
Brett Bellmore Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 1999 Location: Capac, MI, USA Posts: 1,927	My brother in law is suggesting that we plan to go moose hunting in a couple of years; Would a .50 BMG rifle like the Maadi-Griffin be suitable for such a hunt? I just bought the plans, and could have it finished by then. ------------------ Sic semper tyrannis!

September 2, 2000, 08:43 AM	#2
ArmySon Staff Alumnus Join Date: April 14, 2000 Posts: 2,926	You could use it but it's a bit of an overkill.

September 2, 2000, 09:53 AM	#3
Brett Bellmore Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 1999 Location: Capac, MI, USA Posts: 1,927	ArmySon: Would it be? I was figuring on using the .30 saboted rounds; Stewart warns that the use of the full sized bronze bullets wears out your barrel in short order. Actually, though, I was more concerned about legalities, hunting regulations. This trip is still in the planning stages, and neither of us even has a firearm suitable for moose hunting yet. ------------------ Sic semper tyrannis!

September 2, 2000, 10:45 AM	#4
Al Thompson Staff Alumnus Join Date: May 2, 1999 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,611	The legalities of assembling the rifle are beyond this particular forum. Hunting with a .50 is (AFAIK) legal everywhere. Somebody out west introduced a bill trying to outlaw the .50 for elk. IMHO, it's sort of a waste. My understanding is that moose are fairly close range targets. If your going to use a .30 bullet, you might be ahead dollar wise getting a good rifle. Additionally, the saboted bullet should be selected with care as the velocity may over stress the bullet. (4000 fps?) I would think hard about a Barnes X bullet myself. Giz

September 2, 2000, 12:56 PM	#5
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	Having acquired an incredible amount of knowledge and expertise in the hunting of the mighty moose from TV and the huntin'zines, it seems to me that the comment about close range has merit. The majority of all meese seem to be shot within 100 yards. Modern loadings in the .45-70 seem to me to a rational approach. "Big" .30s with heavy bullets also are commonly accepted. FWIW, Art

September 3, 2000, 02:13 AM	#6
BadMedicine Junior member Join Date: July 7, 2000 Location: Anchorage Posts: 863	Where are you going moose hunting? That really depends on whether its legal there or not. In Idaho, the gun can't weigh more than 16 lbs, that includes the scope, clips, sling, bullets, and everything, can't be a rim-fire, and it also can't be a set-gun. But in alaska the only restrictions are no rim-fires, and no set-guns, so as long as you can carry it, bring a friggen cannon!! We just got home from moose hunting about 1/2 hour ago. I took my .375 H&H and my dad carries a .338 win mag. We also took the .22-250, for black-dot shots Yes, most shot's are within a hundred yards, and putting the sneak on them is about as challenging as sneaking up on a farm-yard cow, but the stuff they live in is thick undergrowth, and nearly un-penetratable. they can walk 5 yrds, and lay down, and you'll never see them again. Hence the .22-250. If they're more than a couple hundred yards, and only in a small clearing, they'll be gone before you get there, so ya shoot them in the neck, and then go get them. (this is all in theory, so far, we've shot them with nothing less than a .338) But a guy we knew offed one with a .22, yes a bit light, but that's all he had. "I shot 'em in the back of his head, an' his legs went limp like wet noodles." I think a .50 will be plenty enough gun. you won't be carrying it though will you? mostly spot and stock, or spot and snipe?? Good luck

September 3, 2000, 07:25 AM	#7
Brett Bellmore Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 1999 Location: Capac, MI, USA Posts: 1,927	Gizmo99: Actually, I've already checked the legalities of building it where I live, and that's no problem. As for hunting with it being legal everywhere, I wish! (Or maybe I don't.) Can't use ANY rifle on deer in the lower half of Michigan; Have to use a shotgun with deer slugs. Some nimrods in the legislature think that's safer in populated areas... Like there aren't populated areas north of their stupid line, and expanses of nothing south of it! Actually, I agree that the Maadi-Griffin might not be the best choice for hunting moose, but it's what I've got the plans for, and am looking for an excuse to build. We're looking at Montana, by the way. ------------------ Sic semper tyrannis!

September 3, 2000, 08:05 AM	#8
Dangus Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2000 Location: IA Posts: 1,907	To my knowledge, hunting with rifles is not legal everywhere. In Iowa, if I remember correctly, it is illegal to hunt with any rifles, only shotguns, and in some rare cases, pistols are allowed. Black powder is an exception to the rifle rule as long as it's a muzzle loader or a pistol. ------------------ The Alcove I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me

September 3, 2000, 05:33 PM	#9
Al Thompson Staff Alumnus Join Date: May 2, 1999 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,611	There are lots of places where rifles are not permitted. We have a few here - shotgun only or what ever. I am aware of minimum calibers - .24 in my home state of Tennessee for instance. "Maximum" calibers don't seem to be a problem. Yet. Giz

September 4, 2000, 01:39 AM	#10
Dangus Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2000 Location: IA Posts: 1,907	While I would love to rifle hunt, I understand why it's illegal in states like Iowa, where most hunting is done in farm country, which has too many houses around and too many roads to be safe with rifles. ------------------ The Alcove I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me

September 4, 2000, 11:28 AM	#11
Keith Rogan Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 1999 Location: Kodiak, Alaska Posts: 1,014	I think you'll be cursing the day you were born if you ever have to drag 30 pounds of rifle through a swamp looking for moose. Are you going to try and shoot that thing off the shoulder or do you figure you'll just find them out in a pasture where you can just set up a bipod? You're not going to hunt in the lower 48 because you can go through your whole life without ever being drawn for moose. You can try Canada but I doubt they'll let you in the country with a .50 bmg. That leaves Alaska where toting a rifle that size through muskeg and "hippy-heads" and alder jungles is ....not going to be much fun. ------------------ Keith The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan

September 4, 2000, 11:57 AM	#12
Schmit Staff Alumnus Join Date: March 11, 1999 Location: Masquito infested flatlands of Mid-FL Posts: 1,857	> That leaves Alaska where toting a rifle that size through muskeg and "hippy-heads" and alder jungles is ....not going to be much fun. Toting any rifle through alder jungles is not much fun IMO! Hippy-heads? I know what you mean but we called them something different. Pulled a groin muscle walking over a field of them once. Snow was just deep enough where you couldn't make out where they were. You'd be on top of one then then next step you'd wouldn't be. Try that w/o snowshoes while carrying a pack... better yet... don't!

September 5, 2000, 10:58 AM	#13
Keith Rogan Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 1999 Location: Kodiak, Alaska Posts: 1,014	I always used that other name too, just because it was the only thing I knew to call them. If you call them "tussocks", people just say, "huh"? I'm more comfortable with "hippy-heads" than the standard term. For those of you who haven't had the pleasure, these things are little grass topped hummocks about the size of a human head and spaced 6-8" apart. Some areas, like SW Alaska have thousands of square miles of these little ankle busters which can't really be appreciated until you are packing 80 pounds of meat over them for miles at a time. ------------------ Keith The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan

September 5, 2000, 11:36 AM	#14
BadMedicine Junior member Join Date: July 7, 2000 Location: Anchorage Posts: 863	If they're 6-8" apart, you're lucky. Alot of the time they're right next to eachother and you have to watch every step you make to keep from landing a foot in-between them, and falling up to you're hip in water, or busting your leg. You also can't watch for game as well if you have to divirt all your attention to these so-called "hippie-heads"

September 5, 2000, 11:44 AM	#15
Dr.Rob Staff Alumnus Join Date: July 28, 1999 Location: Denver Posts: 2,454	50? Are you afraid your moose is going to be driving an armored car? Seriously, while the .50 has legitimate use as a long range sporting arm.. the there is a HUGE difference between SHOOTING a moose, and hunting one. Your shot will likely be up close and personal (within 100 yds) A solid 375 H&H magnum by CZ is more than up to the task, as far as busting brush and breaking bones. Rob

September 5, 2000, 04:12 PM	#16
dZ Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 1999 Location: Exiled, Fetid Swamp, DC Posts: 7,548	let alone the catcalls back at camp when everyone knows you touched off a round and missed! dZ

September 5, 2000, 04:36 PM	#17
Erik Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1999 Location: America Posts: 3,479	A couple of my friends are transplants from Maine. Two used to guide moose hunts. They commented that a .30-30 or a 30-06 was all most brought along- or needed to bring along.

September 5, 2000, 10:50 PM	#18
ArmySon Staff Alumnus Join Date: April 14, 2000 Posts: 2,926	Whenever a buddies of mine ask me is this caliber or that caliber enough to kill a moose, bear, elk, etc, I ask them this question, "What did people use before modern rifles were invented to take big game?"

September 6, 2000, 02:20 AM	#19
Cosmoline Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2000 Posts: 1,080	As I understand these matters, the hard part is finding your trophy bull. After that you just hike in and shoot him at fairly close range. Moose aren't deer. They don't bolt off at the first sign of humans. In Los Anchorage and nearby trails I've walked right next to moose hundreds of times. Most of the time they just stand there like cattle. Of course, from time to time they will decide to have some fun and bolt toward the trail monkeys. When that happens, just jump into the devil's club and you'll be fine. Other than the inch-long thorns in your flesh.

September 6, 2000, 12:00 PM	#20
BadMedicine Junior member Join Date: July 7, 2000 Location: Anchorage Posts: 863	Yes, moose aren't as skittish as deer, but city moose, and the ones you'll be hunting, are two different animals. "los anchorage" mooose see people everyday. last spring we had a cow and calf eating our newly planted garden. Out came the wristrocket, and a well planted steel ball on her rump sent her stampeding away, with babies in close pursuit. And last winter a young bull moose decided the best place for him to lay down was on Tudor road (busy road right in town) this worked out fine till an impaciant motorist decide he would just drive closer honking till the moose left. The moose started to get up "good, it's working" It then charged the car and careemed into the front of the car mashing the h*ll out of it. The motorist was then pleased to see that it worked, the moose waltzed into the woods unfazed. While wild moose can be stalked, fairly close, exspecially in the thick stuff they live, don't expect to just walk up to thirty yards and plink them. Unlike their cousins in anchorage, the wild ones ahve to avoid predators.

September 7, 2000, 01:48 AM	#21
Field-dressed Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 148	Gotta agree with the Doc. Bull moose aren't deer, but they're sure as hell not like hunting cattle. You can screw your self out of a moose very easily. Most shots are under 100 yards and I'd hate to be the one toting a .50 BMG out of the bush. I've killed several with my 30-06, 1 with my bow and hope my next one will be with a spankin new 45-70. Brett - Build the rifle and THEN discover the need for a new moose shooter.

October 2, 2000, 03:29 PM	#22
Thibault Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2000 Location: Middle of nowhere, Northern Quebec Posts: 336	50? Forget Canada.... You can't legally own one of those, let alone hunt with it.... Our recipe in Northern Quebec, as far as moose is concerned, is pretty much anything in the 27 to 30 range, 300 Win Mag being considered almost overkill, and anything over it a laughing matter.... Shoot whatever you feel comfy with, light enough to drag all day...

October 3, 2000, 04:47 AM	#23
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Not a moose marauder, few here in Md. But, recalling Col Askins, the 30-30 is probably the round that's killed the most moose.

October 3, 2000, 11:47 AM	#24
BadMedicine Junior member Join Date: July 7, 2000 Location: Anchorage Posts: 863	<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>the 30-30 is probably the round that's killed the most moose.[/quote] That don't make it the best round. I read somewhere that most of the grizzlies killed in the states was with 30-30's. It isn't the best cartridge, but it's what the settleers and the indians had when the West was being won, and that's what they used. Moose aren't incredibly tough, or strong willed like a grizz, they die as easy (size comparably) as a deer, but you also want to shoot them with a size comparably bullet.