October 12, 2013, 10:50 PM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 7,839
|
ballester molina m1938
so until yesterday I didn't know these things existed. apparently it was a 1911 copycat made for the Argentine government. it is interesting in that it is listed as 11.25mm like the norwegian 1914(another 1911 copycat which is my grail gun) but also in that it does not have a grip safety, just the thumb safety. this gun is about the usual C&R piece that I run across, about 60% metal finish, rotten wood grip panels, and barrel shot out and magazine is shot but all parts matching, and no rust or pitting to speak of. apparently this gun was made between 1942 and 1944 for the Argentine Army. I about had to resort to fisticuffs with my little brother and he won out and bought it first but from what I have seen, it is a decent shooter(although the trigger is a bit mushy for 1911s and the sights are terrible). any reason why there isn't much talk of them going around?
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin |
October 12, 2013, 11:24 PM | #2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,966
|
It's basically a Star copy, not 1911.
1911 barrels will fit as will magazines. Replacement grips are available. The Ballester is an extremely well made gun. |
October 13, 2013, 12:01 AM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 7,839
|
actually, all 1911 mags will not fit. we went to two stores trying everything from ruger to wilson combat mags, nothing worked. interestingly enough, my el cheapo 15 round Pmag fits it like a glove and hasn't performed too bad so far.
we noticed that a number of them only insert halfway unless you hold the mag release while inserting.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin |
October 13, 2013, 01:20 AM | #4 |
Senior Member
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,966
|
Mine has a 1911 MecGar that works just fine.
|
October 13, 2013, 07:52 AM | #5 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
This is amazing!
I brought one home from the Virginia Beach Gun Show yesterday of the exact description you gave.
SN 19XXX (So I think that puts in I 1943.) in .45ACP. About 60% finish. Mine is nice and tight. Bore is good. I bought 1911 Govt. magazines for 10.00 at the show and they work like a champ. It appears to me that 1911 grips will not work on this pistol because of the location of the screw holes in the frame. The right honorable Mr. Deshivs reported that grips are available and I can verify that from my extremely limited experience. Anywhere from 15.00 to 25.00. I made a trade for mine and a Colt .38 DA from early in the last century in exchange for a converted Trapdoor. I don't know which of us came out on top, but I am very pleased with the two pistols I got. (I have two other Trapdoor saddle ring carbines and no matter how hard I try I can't shoot all three at once.)
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 13, 2013, 11:13 AM | #6 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 7,839
|
Quote:
haha, this one is in the 18XXX range.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin |
|
October 16, 2013, 11:24 AM | #7 | |
Staff
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,675
|
Quote:
They have always been considered a "cheap gun". Not shoddy made, just not worth much in the US market. I think they used to sell for half or maybe 2/3 of what a surplus US 1911A1 sold for. NOT a copy of the 1911, as noted. Some mags will work (USGI spec 7rnd has the best chance). 1911 barrels can work, may be drop in fit, may need fitting, individual guns vary some. Other 1911A1 parts do not fit (maybe the stock GI rear sight, not sure.) The best Argentines say "sistema Colt" and are license copies of the 1911A1. The most commonly found sistema colt is the 1927 model. I have one of these, and aside from the markings its exactly like a commercial Colt Govt model of that era.
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better. |
|
October 16, 2013, 12:07 PM | #8 |
Member In Memoriam
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 24,383
|
I put on my asbestos undies for this one, but IMHO, the Star safety system used in the Ballester-Molina is superior to that of the Colt. The Colt safety blocks the sear, but requires careful adherence to specs and/or careful fitting. And if the cocked and locked gun is dropped on the hammer, both hammer and sear will be destroyed.
The Star system, on the other hand, cams the hammer back off the sear and blocks it. If the hammer is struck, it is blocked by a good size piece of steel, not by the fragile sear and sear notch. Further, with the hammer pinned so it pivots rather than being loose in the frame, the situation where trigger inertia will drop the hammer when the slide is released simply does not happen. Because of the different systems, a grip safety was not considered necessary. (Of course, JMB didn't think it necessary either, and it really doesn't do what it was supposed to do, but that is another subject.) Jim |
October 16, 2013, 12:30 PM | #9 |
Staff
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,675
|
the cherubs polishing parts at the feet of St Browning look up to see him writing "james k" in his ledger......
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better. |
October 16, 2013, 12:43 PM | #10 |
Senior Member
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,966
|
James K-
You are absolutely correct about the safety. |
October 16, 2013, 01:01 PM | #11 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 30, 2009
Location: Northern AZ
Posts: 7,172
|
While the Star type safety used on the Ballester Molina and Ballester Rigaud pistols does block the hammer, it does not block the sear and, consequently, it is possbile for a lackadaisical person (they do exist) to pull the trigger when disengaging the safety, resulting in an AD as the hammer will fall and strike the firing pin.
|
October 16, 2013, 08:17 PM | #12 |
Member In Memoriam
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 24,383
|
Good point, but couldn't the same lackadaisical person accidentally pull the trigger while disengaging the safety on a 1911?
|
October 18, 2013, 11:24 AM | #13 |
Staff
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,675
|
If you pull the trigger, its NOT an AD.
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better. |
October 20, 2013, 06:55 AM | #14 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
I will be having some non-accidental discharges of this pistol...
Heading out today to giver a try.
I am using the steel case rounds. I'll let ya know.
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 22, 2013, 05:26 PM | #15 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
BM shot very nicely....
Found out that the lower left grip screw is stripped. I'll five that when I get home.
Went through fifty rounds of the steel case ammunition from Tula. Not one hiccup. Pistol seems accurate but I am just getting used to it. The original grips on this pistol makes it look cheap. I went looking for replacements but it appears that everything that is available is a dead ringer for the originals. Prolly make my own.
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 22, 2013, 05:27 PM | #16 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
Fixed the screw hole...
Retapped it for an American size screw and then made a screw from a spare one I had laying around.
Also worked on the grips today. Using walnut. Details at eleven.
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 22, 2013, 05:57 PM | #17 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 7,839
|
one of the screws on this one is ceased.
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin |
October 22, 2013, 06:06 PM | #18 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
T,
Should not be too hard to get out.
There is only about an eighth inch of thread on them. You will almost certainly be redoing the threads anyway. I just got done messing with mine and learned I will prolly be replacing the other three screws before long. Here's some shots of the replacement grips Also changed the lines just forward of the thumb safety. Notice that I changed the top contour of the right grip. The original goes all the way up to the slide and is cut off straight. You can tell where it went by looking at the wear pattern on the side of the frame.
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 22, 2013, 09:59 PM | #19 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 21, 2011
Location: Idaho
Posts: 7,839
|
perty... they kindof look out of place though with the worn metal... I guess it's time to take it to get reblued
__________________
ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin |
October 23, 2013, 06:02 AM | #20 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Naples, Fl
Posts: 5,440
|
You are completely correct....
They look like a ruby in a goat's A __ ___ as the pistol is right now.
I gotta get the grips screws worked out first.
__________________
Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath. |
October 23, 2013, 09:18 AM | #21 |
Member In Memoriam
Join Date: March 17, 1999
Posts: 24,383
|
The grip screw holes in the frame can strip also, which is why the Army insisted that Browning put grip screw bushings in the 1911. The thread strain is shifted to the replaceable bushing so the frame is not ruined by messing up one grip screw.
Jim |
October 23, 2013, 02:16 PM | #22 | |
Staff
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,675
|
Quote:
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better. |
|
October 23, 2013, 11:59 PM | #23 |
Senior Member
Join Date: March 20, 2008
Posts: 229
|
Yeah, one is slightly stripped in my ex-mil frame. What is the usual method to fix them?
|
October 24, 2013, 12:44 AM | #24 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 30, 2009
Location: Northern AZ
Posts: 7,172
|
Yeah, one is slightly stripped in my ex-mil frame. What is the usual method to fix them?
(I assume you are talking about a 1911 frame.) The best way is to use a low-temp solder and solder it in place. |
October 25, 2013, 06:55 PM | #25 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 12, 2002
Location: The same state as Mordor.
Posts: 5,567
|
Quote:
__________________
"As was the man of dust, so also are those who are of the dust, and as is the man of heaven, so also are those who are of heaven. Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven. " |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|