why does everybody hate uber magnums?

[troy_mclure]

it seems that every coupla days somebody posts a "i hate ... magnums" or "using a ... magnum is not hunting thread".

why do people hate them so?

how many times have you hunted hard all season, and there is that trophy bull/fat cow right at the limit for your gun?

well the uber magnums have been designed just for that!

i know everybody says "too many people just wound the animal at long range" .

what about the .30-30, .308, .243 hunters out there that get a bad shot at close range?

you might say: "what about the guys that go out and and shoot 500+ yd after only sighting in their rifles?"
to which i reply, "what about the even more people that do the same with their .270's and such?"

so what if shooting at $500+ yds isn't YOUR idea of hunting, if you like to sneak around with your "under powered" .30-30 and get within 50yd of of the target go ahead.

i say hunt your own hunt, and let others do the same.

[ChiefMuzz]

I don't particularly care for ubber magnums, but that's just my tastes. What I don't like about them are the individuals who think that you "need" one to hunt big game. The 30-30's, 30-06's, etc. have been killing big game long enough that just because there is some new uber magnum out there, doesn't mean they are less effective. It's always "bigger and better" with our society and eventually there will be new ultra-uber magnums that will put the current ones to shame. If I want need a cartridge that will kill anything, forget the uber magnum, give me a 45-70. It's been doing it since buffalo roamed the plains.

[10-96]

+1 what Chief said.
Plus, a long time ago a feller I perceived to be a large overgrown goober told me, "Ya jest cain't be a man if ya don't shoot a magnum!" Ever since then, I've been wondering how he would defend that comment to every hunter to grace America's shores since the first boat riders stalked the colonies with smooth bore muzzle loaders.

i say hunt your own hunt, and let others do the same.

Amen to that brother!

[ZeroJunk]

It's just the attitude du jour. Probably started in the gun rags when they ran out of anything else to write about.

Putting a belt or magnum label on a cartridge means nothing in and of itself. You can't kill something too dead.

If a man can't tell that he is flinching because the recoil is too much for his particular sensibilities, it doesn't matter what name is on it.

[Yankee Doodle]

You match the rifle to the game being hunted. Normally, I use a Ruger #3 in 45-70 for just about everything. However, were I to be going after Kodiak, Cape Buff, or anything else that can pound, stomp, grind or eat me, I don't think that a ".980 Super Pooper Belchfire Magnum" would be too much gun.
Just my humble opinion.

[hickstick_10]

its just that THE LIMIT OF THERE GUN

..................and there marksmanship.

The 30-06 was winning 1000 yard matches for some time before the 300 H&H came along, but thats not really the point.

If someone needs an extra 1000 Fpds to kill a deer, there not hunting properly IMHO (might have to involve getting out of the pick up I suppose:barf since i REALLY doubt there running out of impact energy to make a humane killing shot.

More then likely, its just to tough to hold in the beer farts to stalk within a couple hundred yards of the game, so obviously a nice big super mag has gotta help right? right? Blowing off a limb of an animal makes for an easy blood trail that even the drunkest can track most likely from the seat of a quad, even if it takes hours to find the suffering creature which becomes so stressed its only good for hamburger.

Know what works really good for getting closer? turning off the quad does wonders for easy stalking, I wonder how many deers are turned into coyote bait from the 700 yard shots? or how many bears are wounded and escape?

[Osageshooter]

To me, guns are like pizza. I like all varieties, just some more than others. I guess I look at the uber magnum decision from the standpoint of what I need. Go up in power and you go up in recoil. All other things equal, you generally go up in price and weight. Do you need a 300 uber mag to shoot mule deer at 400 yards or less? Probably not. You can get that done with a270. Certainly a 7mm mag. If what you need to do requires an uber mag, get it. If you just want one for the cool factor, get it anyway.

[hickstick_10]

and beside not every 1 kills for meat some people just kill for trophy .then it doesn't matter what you use

All game deserves a swift death. Theres not 1 man out of 100 who can make consistent good 700 + yard shots on game (I sure as hell cant). If they cant close within 300 yards or less of an ungulate(barring physical disability) then they have no business hunting.

Nothing wrong with wanting new guns, of whatever caliber, people just need to make sure its not a compensation for being a [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] outdoorsmen and hunter.

Reminds me of a younger guy i knew who asked me what a good rifle would be for 700 yard shots on deer. I asked him why he needed to make 700 yard shots on deer, then I realized he remembered he is 7 feet tall, so he sounds like a moos going through the bush.

Explained to him the wonders of staying out of the animals wind, he bagged a buck with a 30 yard shot this year, and hes sticking with his 270. He did buy a 338 for long targets and laughs though.

[hickstick_10]

I wouldnt mind a 416 barret myself, just out of morbid curiousity

[ZeroJunk]

Real world.

I went elk hunting last year in the Scapegoat Wilderness. Had one guy with me that was his first trip and another guy that was his second. The new guy shot at a good bull at about 200 yards four times with a 308 and missed him. The other guy shot a raghorn at about 200 yards with a 7RUM and nailed him in the heart. He also killed one with the same rifle at about 350 the year before and nailed him , one shot. I killed a raghorn with my 280AI. Another guy with me who was on his first hunt killed a 325 with a 7 RUM.

Neither was drunk or in a pick up truck. One, even though he is a surgeon, chews a little tobacco. All three doctors matter of fact. I think I will tell them to either get with the program or lose the magnums.

[hickstick_10]

for those 3 hunters there are 10 bubbas

Good to hear they werent taking 600 plus yard shots though

[hogdogs]

I do not "hate" much of nuttin'...

I do not care for the excessive muzzle report and recoil.

But the thing that really puts me off is ammo costs compared to my .30-30. If I need a little more range or kinetic energy, I would opt for the -06 or maybe a .308.

For my hunting, I rarely would get shots past 150 yards. I sight in my .30-30 'tween 85 and 100 for zero which puts me real close for 65 to 150.

I did pass on some 200+ yard deer across a pasture but it musta meant to be...

Had I had a Uber-Epic-Mega-Blaster 3,000, I still wouldn't have wanted to take those shots in the cold miserable rain as I would have been a soppin' frozen mess by the time I got the bugger gutted and to the truck.

Brent

[thallub]

I don't hate magnums: Matter of fact I own several of them. Mostly they reside in the back of the big gun safe while a .223, .308 or .30-06 goes hunting with me.

Once in a great while one of the magnums will come out for a long range hog hunt at a wheat field.

[ZeroJunk]

for those 3 hunters there are 10 bubbas

Exactly how do you know this? Something you have seen with your own eyes. Cartridge, distance, and details would be cool. Leg blown off etc.

I'm not saying that it's not true, just not much in to hearsay.

[Art Eatman]

Y'know, I never knew I hated uber-magnums. I've never needed one for the hunting I've done, but I don't know why that means I'd ever hate them...

In a way, isn't using a .243 on prairie dogs sorta uber-magnum-ish?

[banditt007]

Here is my take on magnums... If you need to hunt something really large and dangerous, you don't want a 30 ish or so caliber bullet and some insane velocity. You wan't slow and really heavy.... at least i would. Look what they use in africa on really big dangerous animals, a .30 cal or so bullet at 4k+ fps? or a 300+ grain bullet at below 2500fps?

So that leaves us with them being good for long distance thin skinned game, like deer/black bear/elk/moose ect. When one can take a 300+ yard shot with a standard caliber and have the animal humanely dead, that puts the magnums in the 400+ yard thin skin game arena. WHich as someone else mentioned.... if you cannot get within a closer distance of the game you are hunting, you shouldn't be hunting. Its called hunting, not sniping. I don't consider shooting an animal that is so far away that you can stand up, do jumping jacks, get back down prone, and take the shot, w/ the animal never knowing that you were even there, a hunt.

IMO these big magnums are good for long range paper punching. Or like i said long range thin skinned game "hunting" THey recoil a lot, cost a lot, many do not shoot them often b/c of the cost/recoil.

You will find the guys that CAN shoot well, and use the magnums as they were intended. But from what i've seen, it seems to be that i see far more new guys and 'tough' guys that buy them, thinking they will be able to buy something that allows them to take bad shots on game and still kill them quickly. Or take long range shots with accuracy just b/c its a magnum, not b/c they have the skill. As we know a bad shot is a bad shot.

As a final note I've read countless times people buying corelockts/winchester power points ect...standard cup and core bullets in these magnums getting a sub 100 yard shot and having the bullet act like a varmint bullet out of a 22-250. People need to realize that those bullets may work fine if your shots are far enough out that the bullet drops velocity to the FPS range it is ment to be used in... around 3k fps or less. But if there is a chance that the bullet will impact the animal at a higher velocity, one needs to step up to premium bullets to keep them from fragmenting.

I know it seems like magnum bashing in my post But it is not so much the cartridge that is at fault at all, its the misinformation and incorrect assumptions of their use that is their downfall IMO.

[rickyjames]

i have a have a 7mm rem mag i love. yesterday i watched a hunting show where a guy dropped a moose at almost 800 yds with the 7mm rem mag. i don't really see the need for anything else in north america.

[mapsjanhere]

I think what gets some hunters is the sometimes excessive destruction of game by uber-magnums. The "only shoot it if you eat it" rule is sometimes reasonable. But there's also the "uber magnum is never right" crowd that jumps over everybody who dares to target a deer with anything under 243 or over 30-06. I read a thread where a guy posted a story about a deer he took with a head shot with a 338 WM, and oh what a vile guy. Never mind he was out for elk and the deer happened to come by in high grass land where all you can shoot at was the head.

[Christchild]

I can't say that I "hate" them, and I can't even say that I dislike the magnum cartridges. There's a few things that come with them that I don't see a need for, in MY way of doing things. More powder burn when compared to the more common cartridges, brass costs more, more recoil... My .270 Winchester will do anything I'm interested in doing, and it'll do it well. My next centerfire rifle will be chambered in .243 Win., and I'll use premium bullets with that little cartridge for hunting.

I've thought about a magnum cartridge for the sake of just having it, but I can not, for the life of me, justify having one. It'd probably be the 7mm Remington Magnum, since the 7mm/.284" is popular and growing, but I don't see myself obtaining one. I don't "look down upon" or "scoff at" guys who employ the magnums, as long as they don't disregard proficiency and ethics. If a magnum is what You like, then by golly have at it! Just focus on Your proficiency, do NOT disregard ethics.......because if You disregard proficiency and ethics, one of us that focus on proficiency and ethics, and are shooting a .270 Win., .280 Rem. or a .30-06 Sprg will be along to show You out.........

[Buzzcook]

Why does anyone care what cartridge they use. As long as it's legal and the person makes a clean kill, that's all that matters.

If you want to use a .300rum on chipmunks, then do it.

[Brian Pfleuger]

Too many people think that power is a substitute for skill. That's my beef.

I don't care what kind of gun you use. Two things irritate me. One is the idea that you "need" a modern wonder magnum to kill an animal and the other is that you can pick up that modern wonder magnum and make those 700 yard shots when the truth is half the guys would miss with a 243 at 200 yards, say nothing of 700 yards with ANY gun.

[wncchester]

I neither "hate" nor "love" inanimate objects. I do like the performance of standard cartridges and doubt the value of many of the new shapes and hyped values but I couln't care less what others choose to use.

[Ricky]

I'm in California. Shots may be longer than you would commonly have in the east but there is nothing here that can't easily be killed with a well placed shot from a .270/.308/30-06. I have nothing against big magnums but unless I were hunting where there are big bears or other dangerous game I just don't see the reason to carry a big heavy rifle that punishes me when I shoot it.
I used to hunt with a 7mm Rem. Mag. It's a great round for long shots but I sold it and got an 06 that is lighter to carry and shoots as far as I care to shoot.

[mikejonestkd]

I think of uber mags like muscle cars, its great if someone has one because they want one, but don't try to convince me that it is the only vehicle ever made that is capable of running to the local corner store for a gallon of milk.

[globemaster3]

OK, I'll jump in.

I have no problem with uber mags. They fit a purpose and I have no right to deny anyone to purchase them.

In my experience, I see people shooting uber mags to make ridiculous shots or compensate for lack of marksmanship.

What makes a shot ridiculous? Historically, We can pick apart the next advantage and how they were percieved: muskets to bow/arrows, rifles to muskets, scopes to irons, blah blah blah.

This raises an important question: when does hunting become no longer hunting and just shooting? Have we reached a technological precipice where further gains yielded in weapon development are overkill? What is the next advantage? How about a laser? No compensation for drop, winds, etc! We already demonstrated the technology in a C-130 that hit a target with a chemical laser. We've seen miniturization unfathomable 20-30 years ago.

When does hunting skill, stalking your quarry, and scouting no longer become essential to the hunt? Would we cease to "hunt" but just kill? Don't get me wrong, I'm a card carrying member of PETA (people eating tasty animals), but here's an example to put in perspective. I was the deer depreadation program manager on base. Using spotlights, 12 gauge 00 buck, and often shooting from the truck, we killed a lot of deer. From a sportsman's perspective, it made me sick. There was no sport, it was just killing. Important killing and needed to be done to protect aircrews and aircraft, but it was just killing.

So, when these hunters are making 700-800+ yard shots, are they really hunting or just shooting/killing? Ok, they wear camoflauge, ride in their 4X4s, probably hike a ways. Wind readings are difficult and there is great skill in making a shot that far, I'll hand you that. I also haven't seen every exception to the rule dictated by terrain.

The other piece, making up for marksmanship, is really counter intuitive. The person is a poor marksman who needs to practice. By buying an uber mag, they now have something less enjoyable and more expensive to shoot. Yes, there are those who tolerate recoil well, but most don't. So now the hunter is in a situation where they will probably practice less. Counterproductive. An example I saw was a man trying to figure out why the last 3 deer he shot at, in Florida, with his .338 Win Mag, were not DRT. All shots were taken inside 100 yards. The bullet blew through before it could expand.

Sorry for the long post. Hopefully this is thought provoking (other than "why did he post so much?)