Stainless steel vs harden steel

gunnysgt68 · February 6, 2012, 06:09 PM

Help!! I need an answer! Which is better stainlee steel or the regular steel for a 1911 pistol? I have a Taurus 1911 alloy and wor it out. I shoot about 5000-8000 rds a year. I need a new pistol and at this point I'm not sure. Comments would be appreciated. Thanks Gunny

mete · February 6, 2012, 06:52 PM

Describe the usage .Target [bullseye] ,IPSC, Carry ?? Unless you need the 'stainless' properties then stick to the carbon steel.

gunnysgt68 · February 6, 2012, 07:23 PM

Thanks. I have a homemade range where I live so a few buddies and I set up IDPA and USPSA scenerios. We also shoot paper. I try to shoot what I would carry if I could (ILLINOIS). So I'm looking towards a Sig 1911 4.25" SS . I had a Springfield Armory 4" Champion Loaded in Stainless. Nice gun a touch heavy. Thanks again Gunny

AKsRul.e · February 6, 2012, 10:21 PM

ALL gunsteels are "alloys"

Carbon steel is iron with some carbon and traces of other metals.

Stainless steel is iron with some chromium and other metals.

Either one can be relatively hard or soft - but both are harder than aluminum alloy.

Stainless is used in guns mainly because it resists corrosion.

KyJim · February 6, 2012, 11:25 PM

Carbon steel may technically be "stronger" but you won't see any difference in the real world.

martyd · February 8, 2012, 04:28 PM

If you were ONLY shooting at the range -1911-45cal. Would aluminum be good vs Stainless S. ? With S.S. being 7 oz. more. I trying to bull eyes the tarage and im afraid the recoil is going to stop that ? Any help -thanks Martyd
To get the S.S. is $300 more.

dahermit · February 8, 2012, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Carbon steel is iron with some carbon and traces of other metals.

That only describes "plain carbon steel", not used in modern firearms. Also, there are steels like 4140, 4130 which are known as "high alloy steels", that would be referred to as, "carbon steel", if used in the context to compare to stainless steels.

Quote:

Stainless steel is iron with some chromium and other metals.

There are three categories (ferritic, matinsetic, and austinetic) of stainless steel with more than thirty AISI types. The type used in firearms is likely "Martinsetic". Martinsetic stainless steels can be heat trated for hardness, toughness.

Quote:

Either one can be relatively hard or soft - but both are harder than aluminum alloy.

Hardness is not a desired feature in some of the gun's parts (frame, slide, locking lugs, etc.). Toughness is. Some of the small parts (the sear, forinstance), needs to be "hard", to resist wear.

Quote:

Stainless is used in guns mainly because it resists corrosion.

A stainless (Stainless implies that there is only one type of steel that is stainless). Stainless steels also are not normally blued or blackened. Therefore, there is no need for additional labor to polish and apply an additional finish.

It is unlikely that a shooter will find that a stainless steel gun will have any significant difference in a useful life than a high-alloy, blued gun.

Skans · February 10, 2012, 08:45 AM

The steel alloys used today are far better than they need to be - stainless v. "carbon" steel is just personal preference. I like both.

batmann · February 10, 2012, 09:04 AM

When you say 'wore out', what exactly wore out? The slide rails, frame rails, it is just loose? It takes a lot to make about any 1911 to do that.

Dashunde · February 10, 2012, 09:23 AM

Carbon or Stainless from a reputable maker would be fine either way.

The carbon might actually wear a bit longer, but it's finish wont hold up nearly as well unless its like Glocks Tenifer, hard chrome, or one of those ceramic coatings. YMMV.
For example, my Para is all steel and is wearing very well, but its coating completely sux.

The stainless should hold its own in wear, and it has the advantage of being taken apart (by you) and either quickly bead blasted for a fresh matt finish, or you can hand rub it with good quality 600-1000 grit sandpaper for a nice satin finish that you can touch up any time - use that black aluminum oxide stuff. Its super easy to do, just dont rub in circles - consistant back and fourth only will leave a nice finish.

For heavy usage and ease of self-refinishing I'd go stainless without a doubt.

tim s · February 10, 2012, 10:23 AM

As in all things it depoends on application. Quality SS is just fine for most applications including probably 90%+ of 1911 guns' production or semi custom. for those that prefer, say, match grade, 1911 type performance then carbon steels probably yield somewhat better final fit and precise tolerances and tend to lap in better. I'd guess this is why, for instance, an outfit like Les Baer will only produce pistols with the 1 1/2" accuracy guarantee in pistols made with carbon steel.

orionengnr · February 10, 2012, 11:43 PM

Quote:

I have a Taurus 1911 alloy and wor it out. I shoot about 5000-8000 rds a year.

Really? The Taurus 1911s have only been out about three years now. You "wor" it out within 15,000-24,000 rounds?
What did you "wor" out?

dsk · February 11, 2012, 12:16 AM

If there still is any difference in wearability between carbon or stainless steel it's so slight you'll never notice. The longevity of your firearm will have more to do with maintenance and/or the loads you use than which steel it's made out of. We've come a long way from the early days of stainless steel where galling and softness were issues.

Cascade1911 · February 11, 2012, 07:52 AM

Something like 8620, properly hardened, tempered and carburized, would most likely be tougher and harder than the 416 SS most commonly used in stainless frames and slides. Properly being the key word. Then again some gun makers don't even properly harden and temper their 416. On the other hand, either one will certainly wear better than aluminum.

As an aside:

Quote:

Also, there are steels like 4140, 4130 which are known as "high alloy steels"

4140 and 4130 (as well as 8620) are categorized as "low alloy steels".

dahermit · February 11, 2012, 09:56 AM

Quote:

4140 and 4130 (as well as 8620) are categorized as "low alloy steels".

I stand corrected...they are indeed low alloy steels. Memory is not what it used to be.

February 6, 2012, 06:09 PM	#1
gunnysgt68 Junior Member Join Date: July 1, 2008 Posts: 10	Stainless steel vs harden steel Help!! I need an answer! Which is better stainlee steel or the regular steel for a 1911 pistol? I have a Taurus 1911 alloy and wor it out. I shoot about 5000-8000 rds a year. I need a new pistol and at this point I'm not sure. Comments would be appreciated. Thanks Gunny

February 6, 2012, 06:52 PM	#2
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	Describe the usage .Target [bullseye] ,IPSC, Carry ?? Unless you need the 'stainless' properties then stick to the carbon steel. __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

February 6, 2012, 07:23 PM	#3
gunnysgt68 Junior Member Join Date: July 1, 2008 Posts: 10	stainless Thanks. I have a homemade range where I live so a few buddies and I set up IDPA and USPSA scenerios. We also shoot paper. I try to shoot what I would carry if I could (ILLINOIS). So I'm looking towards a Sig 1911 4.25" SS . I had a Springfield Armory 4" Champion Loaded in Stainless. Nice gun a touch heavy. Thanks again Gunny

February 6, 2012, 10:21 PM	#4
AKsRul.e Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2010 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 234	ALL gunsteels are "alloys" Carbon steel is iron with some carbon and traces of other metals. Stainless steel is iron with some chromium and other metals. Either one can be relatively hard or soft - but both are harder than aluminum alloy. Stainless is used in guns mainly because it resists corrosion.

February 6, 2012, 11:25 PM	#5
KyJim Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2005 Location: The Bluegrass Posts: 9,142	Carbon steel may technically be "stronger" but you won't see any difference in the real world.

February 8, 2012, 04:28 PM	#6
martyd Junior Member Join Date: February 8, 2012 Posts: 3	If you were ONLY shooting at the range -1911-45cal. Would aluminum be good vs Stainless S. ? With S.S. being 7 oz. more. I trying to bull eyes the tarage and im afraid the recoil is going to stop that ? Any help -thanks Martyd To get the S.S. is $300 more.

February 10, 2012, 08:45 AM	#8
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	The steel alloys used today are far better than they need to be - stainless v. "carbon" steel is just personal preference. I like both.

February 10, 2012, 09:04 AM	#9
batmann Senior Member Join Date: November 14, 2004 Location: Greenwood, IN Posts: 773	When you say 'wore out', what exactly wore out? The slide rails, frame rails, it is just loose? It takes a lot to make about any 1911 to do that.

February 10, 2012, 09:23 AM	#10
Dashunde Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 2004 Posts: 2,018	Carbon or Stainless from a reputable maker would be fine either way. The carbon might actually wear a bit longer, but it's finish wont hold up nearly as well unless its like Glocks Tenifer, hard chrome, or one of those ceramic coatings. YMMV. For example, my Para is all steel and is wearing very well, but its coating completely sux. The stainless should hold its own in wear, and it has the advantage of being taken apart (by you) and either quickly bead blasted for a fresh matt finish, or you can hand rub it with good quality 600-1000 grit sandpaper for a nice satin finish that you can touch up any time - use that black aluminum oxide stuff. Its super easy to do, just dont rub in circles - consistant back and fourth only will leave a nice finish. For heavy usage and ease of self-refinishing I'd go stainless without a doubt.

February 10, 2012, 10:23 AM	#11
tim s Senior Member Join Date: February 8, 2011 Posts: 223	As in all things it depoends on application. Quality SS is just fine for most applications including probably 90%+ of 1911 guns' production or semi custom. for those that prefer, say, match grade, 1911 type performance then carbon steels probably yield somewhat better final fit and precise tolerances and tend to lap in better. I'd guess this is why, for instance, an outfit like Les Baer will only produce pistols with the 1 1/2" accuracy guarantee in pistols made with carbon steel.

February 11, 2012, 12:16 AM	#13
dsk Senior Member Join Date: June 19, 2001 Posts: 1,603	If there still is any difference in wearability between carbon or stainless steel it's so slight you'll never notice. The longevity of your firearm will have more to do with maintenance and/or the loads you use than which steel it's made out of. We've come a long way from the early days of stainless steel where galling and softness were issues.