Primers?

joyrock · February 24, 2010, 06:09 PM

Ok, let me get this right. There are 4 basic types of primers: Small Pistol, Large Pistol, Small Rifle, and Large Rifle (not counting the 50BMG?)
Small Pistol is for 25ACP, 32ACP, 9MM? Any thing else?
Large Pistol is for 45ACP, 10MM, 44mag?
Small Rifle is for 223?
Large Rifle is for 7.62x54R?
Is there a list for all these primers and what they fit?
Are the small pistol and small rifle the same size? Are they interchangeable?
If not what would happen?
And what is a Magnum primer?
Thanks, Matt.

Sevens · February 24, 2010, 06:31 PM

There are four basic SIZES of primers (you listed them.) Mixed in with those are magnum and bench rest primers.

Small pistol fits many, many more cartridges than you listed, and the most obvious ones include .38 Special, .357 Mag, .380 Auto, .40 S&W, and countless others.

Large Pistol fits all that you mentioned and many more, too, like .41 Mag, .44 Special, .45 Colt and others.

Small rifle fits a zillion different rifle calibers, and large rifle fits a zillion larger rifle calibers.

SOME odd heavyweight/hardcore handgun rounds use rifle primers (.454 Casull, .460 Mag, .500 Mag) but these are not your "average" off the shelf calibers.

As for physical dimensions, small pistol and small rifle have the same physical external dimensions, but are definitely not the same. Small rifle primers have a harder primer cup to better contain rifle type pressures and burn hotter and longers.

Large pistol and large rifle primers have the same diameter/circumference, but the large rifle primers are taller than their large pistol counterpart.

Interchangeable: Kind of, not really...sometimes.

There are folks that use small rifle primers in small pistol applications with good results. First, your firearm must deliver a hard enough hammer strike to detonate the harder cup and second, you must make sure you re-work any handloads developed with pistol primers when you substitute a small rifle primers as your pressure will go up with them.

You should never use a small pistol primer in a rifle round due to the higher pressures that most rifle rounds generate.

You can't safely or effectively swap large pistol with large rifle or vice-versa.

As for a list of what they all fit? Any decent load manual that lists data also lists the primer they used to develop that data... so that is one way to find a "list."

NWPilgrim · February 24, 2010, 06:32 PM

Within those four "sizes" there are, depending on manufacturer, regular, magnum, match, and military.

Rifle primers are generally harder to ignite and have a hotter, longer flame. Small rifle has the same exterior dimensions as small pistol. But Large rifle is actually taller than large pistol.

Always use the type of primer specified in the load table data you are using. reloading manuals like Speer, Lyman, Sierra describe primers in detail.

Small pistol fits everything from .40S&W and down: 9mm, .380, .38 special, etc. Small pistol magnum is usually used for .357 magnum.

Large pistol will be for everything else, except some high pressure cartridges which may specify a rifle primer.

Small rifle is for .223, .30 Carbine, etc. Large rifle primers are for .308, .30-06 etc. Some cartridges will use either a large or small primer depending on manufacturer of the case. I believe brass 7.62x39 cases have been made for large rifle primers by some manufacturers and small rifle by others.

Here is a general overview of primer usage by CCI:
http://www.cci-ammunition.com/produc...imer_chart.htm

mrawesome22 · February 24, 2010, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Is there a list for all these primers and what they fit?

The manual will tell you what to use and whether or not to use a magnum.

jepp2 · February 24, 2010, 08:17 PM

It will help you avoid problems like using a Remington 6 1/2 small rifle primers in most small rifles (like 222, 223, etc.) and avoid using the Remington 1 1/2 small pistol primer in the 40 S&W cartridge.

gearheadpyro · February 25, 2010, 09:16 PM

+ another 1 on the reloading manual.

Pick up the Lyman 49th manual and read the beginning section. It will help clear up all of these kinds of questions.

I also have a website I'm working on that should help too. http://www.rifles-shooting-reloading.com

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot · February 25, 2010, 11:00 PM

Yes, if you haven't bought a number of loading manuals by now, your late!

The good manuals all list what the loads were developed with, be it standard, mag., large or small.

It is part of what you buy the manual for.

In the informational section of many manuals it give great amounts of info as per primers, powders and all kinds of very good tips for quality and safe reloading.

Good manuals are #1 on the must have list.

Keep em coming

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

totaldla · February 26, 2010, 12:03 AM

All good info so far.

A "magnum" primer contains either more or slightly different explosive compound designed to give a larger flame front to better ignite the powder. Most ball (spherical shaped) powders benefit greatly from a magnum primer. Winchester Large Pistol primers are a bit of an exception to the labeling rule in that they've been tested and found to be as hot as other "magnum" primers, yet Winchester labels them for "normal or magnum". Other manufacturers make a clear distinction between their "normal" and "magnum" primers.

There are also primers with a harder cup material which is less likely to slam-fire in military rifles with floating firing pins.

February 24, 2010, 06:31 PM	#2
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,756	There are four basic SIZES of primers (you listed them.) Mixed in with those are magnum and bench rest primers. Small pistol fits many, many more cartridges than you listed, and the most obvious ones include .38 Special, .357 Mag, .380 Auto, .40 S&W, and countless others. Large Pistol fits all that you mentioned and many more, too, like .41 Mag, .44 Special, .45 Colt and others. Small rifle fits a zillion different rifle calibers, and large rifle fits a zillion larger rifle calibers. SOME odd heavyweight/hardcore handgun rounds use rifle primers (.454 Casull, .460 Mag, .500 Mag) but these are not your "average" off the shelf calibers. As for physical dimensions, small pistol and small rifle have the same physical external dimensions, but are definitely not the same. Small rifle primers have a harder primer cup to better contain rifle type pressures and burn hotter and longers. Large pistol and large rifle primers have the same diameter/circumference, but the large rifle primers are taller than their large pistol counterpart. Interchangeable: Kind of, not really...sometimes. There are folks that use small rifle primers in small pistol applications with good results. First, your firearm must deliver a hard enough hammer strike to detonate the harder cup and second, you must make sure you re-work any handloads developed with pistol primers when you substitute a small rifle primers as your pressure will go up with them. You should never use a small pistol primer in a rifle round due to the higher pressures that most rifle rounds generate. You can't safely or effectively swap large pistol with large rifle or vice-versa. As for a list of what they all fit? Any decent load manual that lists data also lists the primer they used to develop that data... so that is one way to find a "list." __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

February 24, 2010, 06:32 PM	#3
NWPilgrim Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 2,346	Within those four "sizes" there are, depending on manufacturer, regular, magnum, match, and military. Rifle primers are generally harder to ignite and have a hotter, longer flame. Small rifle has the same exterior dimensions as small pistol. But Large rifle is actually taller than large pistol. Always use the type of primer specified in the load table data you are using. reloading manuals like Speer, Lyman, Sierra describe primers in detail. Small pistol fits everything from .40S&W and down: 9mm, .380, .38 special, etc. Small pistol magnum is usually used for .357 magnum. Large pistol will be for everything else, except some high pressure cartridges which may specify a rifle primer. Small rifle is for .223, .30 Carbine, etc. Large rifle primers are for .308, .30-06 etc. Some cartridges will use either a large or small primer depending on manufacturer of the case. I believe brass 7.62x39 cases have been made for large rifle primers by some manufacturers and small rifle by others. Here is a general overview of primer usage by CCI: http://www.cci-ammunition.com/produc...imer_chart.htm __________________ "The ultimate authority ... resides in the people alone. ... The advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition." - James Madison

February 24, 2010, 08:17 PM	#5
jepp2 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,476	+1 on the Reloading Manual It will help you avoid problems like using a Remington 6 1/2 small rifle primers in most small rifles (like 222, 223, etc.) and avoid using the Remington 1 1/2 small pistol primer in the 40 S&W cartridge.

February 25, 2010, 09:16 PM	#6
gearheadpyro Senior Member Join Date: September 3, 2009 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 169	+ another 1 on the reloading manual. Pick up the Lyman 49th manual and read the beginning section. It will help clear up all of these kinds of questions. I also have a website I'm working on that should help too. http://www.rifles-shooting-reloading.com __________________ www.southernmarksman.com Owner of & Chief Instructor for The Southern Marksman, LLC NRA Life Member, NRA CRSO, Multi-Discipline NRA Certified Instructor

February 24, 2010, 06:09 PM	#1
joyrock Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2008 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 153	Primers? Ok, let me get this right. There are 4 basic types of primers: Small Pistol, Large Pistol, Small Rifle, and Large Rifle (not counting the 50BMG?) Small Pistol is for 25ACP, 32ACP, 9MM? Any thing else? Large Pistol is for 45ACP, 10MM, 44mag? Small Rifle is for 223? Large Rifle is for 7.62x54R? Is there a list for all these primers and what they fit? Are the small pistol and small rifle the same size? Are they interchangeable? If not what would happen? And what is a Magnum primer? Thanks, Matt. __________________ Oleg Volk is my hero!

February 25, 2010, 11:00 PM	#7
Crusty Deary Ol'Coot Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Location: Deary, Ideeeeeeho Posts: 531	Yes, if you haven't bought a number of loading manuals by now, your late! The good manuals all list what the loads were developed with, be it standard, mag., large or small. It is part of what you buy the manual for. In the informational section of many manuals it give great amounts of info as per primers, powders and all kinds of very good tips for quality and safe reloading. Good manuals are #1 on the must have list. Keep em coming Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

February 26, 2010, 12:03 AM	#8
totaldla Senior Member Join Date: August 10, 2009 Location: SW Idaho Posts: 1,296	All good info so far. A "magnum" primer contains either more or slightly different explosive compound designed to give a larger flame front to better ignite the powder. Most ball (spherical shaped) powders benefit greatly from a magnum primer. Winchester Large Pistol primers are a bit of an exception to the labeling rule in that they've been tested and found to be as hot as other "magnum" primers, yet Winchester labels them for "normal or magnum". Other manufacturers make a clear distinction between their "normal" and "magnum" primers. There are also primers with a harder cup material which is less likely to slam-fire in military rifles with floating firing pins.