230gr for .38/.357? Really?

10-96 · October 7, 2012, 02:01 AM

The other day I was surfing the innerwebs and came across some 230gr .357 wadcutter bullets at an outfit called Badman Bullets- http://www.badmanbullets.com/OnlineS...wling-pin.html

OK, now I'm always game for something a little on the different side and heavy bullets in hand-fired firearms. Had to admit- this really caught my curiosity going.

Does anyone see a productive purpose for these other than bowling pin shooting? There's just not a lot of info out there about these things (who woulda thunk?). Also, I do recall seeing a warning about only using these in L-frame and larger revolvers. Now, if that's the case, how did the British get away with running .360 diameter 200gr bullets in k-frames?

Has anyone here tinkered around with anything like this before? Have you gotten decent results beyond 10 meters? Apparently that's the going distance for pin shoots I guess.

steveno · October 7, 2012, 04:27 AM

they look like they are machined out of solid bar stock of some kind. a bullet that long will either cause some oal problems or a big loss in case capacity.

darkgael · October 7, 2012, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Now, if that's the case, how did the British get away with running .360 diameter 200gr bullets in k-frames?

The 200 grain bullet used by the Brits was actually a bit larger at .361-.362. They got away with it because it was used in the .38 S&W, a different cartridge than the .38 S&W Special. It has a much shorter case.
The .38 S&W is on the far right. Next to it is the .38 Long Colt.

Pete

Deja vu · October 7, 2012, 07:31 AM

I have shot those (not sure if same brand but same wait and looked the same) before. Just wanted to see how they functioned in my Coonan. They worked fine. There was not alot of capacity so they where pretty slow but they did stabilize.

g.willikers · October 7, 2012, 07:40 AM

Does there have to be an actual need or reason to try something?
With some experiment, that bullet could lead to a new something in .38/357, mebbe.

Seaman · October 7, 2012, 09:46 AM

Very interesting.

A 230 gr bullet coming out of a .357 case ...might be enough space there for the right powder to make it a viable SD round. There is a sample pack, just may take them up on it ... would be nice to get the M13 out of mothballs.

Redhawk5.5+P+ · October 8, 2012, 01:30 AM

Just order a handfull? $7.95 shipped, what the hell! You only live once boys, step up to the plate, I'm more worried about id theft more that losing $7.95.

Technosavant · October 8, 2012, 08:43 AM

Quote:

might be enough space there for the right powder to make it a viable SD round.

I'd anticipate there would be. There's a ton of unused capacity in the .38spl case.

What I wonder is what kind of load data would be used and if pressures could be kept low enough to accelerate that heavy bullet up to any kind of useful speed. I also wonder if the barrel twist would actually stabilize that thing.

KevK. · October 8, 2012, 08:58 AM

I've known a few folks hunt using 180gr .357 with some success out of a lever action rifle and long barrel revolvers. Would 200 gr be that much different?

Bob Wright · October 8, 2012, 09:15 AM

A 230 gr. .357???? That's a pretty heavy bullet, remembering that 230 gr. is the nominal for the .45 ACP.

It looks as if it would have to be deep seated in the case for OAL limitations, which would cut down powder capacity. Would probably limit velocity so likely be a close range proposition. But, for bowling pins, maybe just the thing!

Keep us posted, please!

Bob Wright

drail · October 8, 2012, 09:18 AM

With a revolver the only real limitation is the length of the cylinder. But I cannot see any reason to built a 230 gr. .357. Marketing is a powerful force. For bowling pins you cannot beat a .45 ACP revolver. Or a .41. Or a .44.

Bob Wright · October 8, 2012, 09:24 AM

Drail wrote:

Quote:

With a revolver the only real limitation is the length of the cylinder. But I cannot see any reason to built a 230 gr. .357. Marketing is a powerful force. For bowling pins you cannot beat a .45 ACP revolver. Or a .41. Or a .44.

The 230gr. bullet is a lot of mass in motion, required for bowling pin matches. The advantage of such a bullet in .357 is that it can be fired in an L-Framed Smith, while larger calibers require N-Framed guns. Many shooters, including this correspondent, cannot handle N-Frames guns in fast DA firing as well as the L-Frames.

Bob Wright

Chesster · October 8, 2012, 12:29 PM

I still have a couple of boxes of the old 200gr RNL .38s but that is the heaviest I have ever tried.

Nanuk · October 8, 2012, 12:46 PM

http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/de...Powder&Source=

Granted that was for a 250 grain bullet....

the 230 could probably get about 1200 fps from a 6" 686 without too much pressure......HMMM....

Redhawk5.5+P+ · October 8, 2012, 04:16 PM

Can you say .357 Maximum Super?

.357 Max. 225g Hawk FP 1650FPS

Newton24b · October 10, 2012, 06:20 PM

6 inch barrel, gp100 or 686 or similar size taurus, scope base, rings, decent scope. can we say really fun deer pistol?

drail · October 10, 2012, 06:44 PM

For bowling pin matches a .45 ACP is "required". Any major dude will tell you.

Redhawk5.5+P+ · October 13, 2012, 12:48 AM

Just got a bag 50 to my door for $7.95. They are cool, now what am I going to do with them since I don't reload. Maybe they'll make great stocking stuffers.

FloridaVeteran · October 13, 2012, 01:29 AM

I still have some .45LC equivalents of those that I bought long, long ago. The bullets are so big, re o.a.l., that they come all the way to the end of the cylinder in my old Blackhawk, meaning I can't shoot them from my Model 25 Smith.

October 7, 2012, 02:01 AM	#1
10-96 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Location: Tx Panhandle Territory Posts: 4,159	230gr for .38/.357? Really? The other day I was surfing the innerwebs and came across some 230gr .357 wadcutter bullets at an outfit called Badman Bullets- http://www.badmanbullets.com/OnlineS...wling-pin.html OK, now I'm always game for something a little on the different side and heavy bullets in hand-fired firearms. Had to admit- this really caught my curiosity going. Does anyone see a productive purpose for these other than bowling pin shooting? There's just not a lot of info out there about these things (who woulda thunk?). Also, I do recall seeing a warning about only using these in L-frame and larger revolvers. Now, if that's the case, how did the British get away with running .360 diameter 200gr bullets in k-frames? Has anyone here tinkered around with anything like this before? Have you gotten decent results beyond 10 meters? Apparently that's the going distance for pin shoots I guess. __________________ Rednecks... Keeping the woods critter-free since March 2, 1836. (TX Independence Day) I suspect a thing or two... because I've seen a thing or two.

October 7, 2012, 07:31 AM	#4
Deja vu Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2010 Location: Border of Idaho & Montana Posts: 2,584	I have shot those (not sure if same brand but same wait and looked the same) before. Just wanted to see how they functioned in my Coonan. They worked fine. There was not alot of capacity so they where pretty slow but they did stabilize. __________________ Shot placement is everything! I would rather take a round of 50BMG to the foot than a 22short to the base of the skull. all 26 of my guns are 45/70 govt, 357 mag, 22 or 12 ga... I believe in keeping it simple. Wish my wife did as well...

October 7, 2012, 07:40 AM	#5
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Does there have to be an actual need or reason to try something? With some experiment, that bullet could lead to a new something in .38/357, mebbe. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

October 7, 2012, 09:46 AM	#6
Seaman Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2011 Posts: 654	Very interesting. A 230 gr bullet coming out of a .357 case ...might be enough space there for the right powder to make it a viable SD round. There is a sample pack, just may take them up on it ... would be nice to get the M13 out of mothballs. __________________ For 20 years the sea was my home, always recall the sun going down, and my trusty friend, a 1911 pistol, strapped to my side.

October 8, 2012, 08:58 AM	#9
KevK. Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2012 Posts: 137	I've known a few folks hunt using 180gr .357 with some success out of a lever action rifle and long barrel revolvers. Would 200 gr be that much different? __________________ CZ82, S&W Mod. 65 .357, Marlin 22mn (22WMR), Mossberg 500.

October 7, 2012, 04:27 AM	#2
steveno Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2004 Location: Minden , Nebraska Posts: 1,407	they look like they are machined out of solid bar stock of some kind. a bullet that long will either cause some oal problems or a big loss in case capacity.

October 8, 2012, 01:30 AM	#7
Redhawk5.5+P+ Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2012 Location: NV Posts: 743	Just order a handfull? $7.95 shipped, what the hell! You only live once boys, step up to the plate, I'm more worried about id theft more that losing $7.95.

October 8, 2012, 09:15 AM	#10
Bob Wright Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2012 Location: Memphis, Tennessee Posts: 2,987	A 230 gr. .357???? That's a pretty heavy bullet, remembering that 230 gr. is the nominal for the .45 ACP. It looks as if it would have to be deep seated in the case for OAL limitations, which would cut down powder capacity. Would probably limit velocity so likely be a close range proposition. But, for bowling pins, maybe just the thing! Keep us posted, please! Bob Wright

October 8, 2012, 09:18 AM	#11
drail Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2008 Posts: 3,150	With a revolver the only real limitation is the length of the cylinder. But I cannot see any reason to built a 230 gr. .357. Marketing is a powerful force. For bowling pins you cannot beat a .45 ACP revolver. Or a .41. Or a .44.

October 8, 2012, 12:29 PM	#13
Chesster Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2007 Location: Dixie Posts: 2,538	I still have a couple of boxes of the old 200gr RNL .38s but that is the heaviest I have ever tried. __________________ Chesster Proud NDN "The American Idle" Vote 'Pro-Choice' on 2nd Amendment issues!!!

October 8, 2012, 12:46 PM	#14
Nanuk Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2005 Location: Where the deer and the antelope roam. Posts: 3,082	http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/de...Powder&Source= Granted that was for a 250 grain bullet.... the 230 could probably get about 1200 fps from a 6" 686 without too much pressure......HMMM.... __________________ Retired Law Enforcement U. S. Army Veteran Armorer My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon.

October 8, 2012, 04:16 PM	#15
Redhawk5.5+P+ Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2012 Location: NV Posts: 743	Can you say .357 Maximum Super? .357 Max. 225g Hawk FP 1650FPS

October 10, 2012, 06:20 PM	#16
Newton24b Junior member Join Date: February 10, 2009 Posts: 974	6 inch barrel, gp100 or 686 or similar size taurus, scope base, rings, decent scope. can we say really fun deer pistol?

October 10, 2012, 06:44 PM	#17
drail Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2008 Posts: 3,150	For bowling pin matches a .45 ACP is "required". Any major dude will tell you.

October 13, 2012, 12:48 AM	#18
Redhawk5.5+P+ Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2012 Location: NV Posts: 743	Just got a bag 50 to my door for $7.95. They are cool, now what am I going to do with them since I don't reload. Maybe they'll make great stocking stuffers.

October 13, 2012, 01:29 AM	#19
FloridaVeteran Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2012 Location: Central Florida Posts: 399	I still have some .45LC equivalents of those that I bought long, long ago. The bullets are so big, re o.a.l., that they come all the way to the end of the cylinder in my old Blackhawk, meaning I can't shoot them from my Model 25 Smith.

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