Do you ever get nervous buying used guns?

[jasmith85]

The thread about regretting selling guns made me think about this. I find myself not trusting buying used guns from private parties due to something that happened to me a few years ago. What happened was I went to a shop in Nashville and tried to buy a used Colt Commander. When the clerk ran the background check on me the system came back saying that the gun's serial number was marked as stolen. That alone isn't a big deal I guess. I just bought something else and the owner gave me a free magazine for my trouble.

Since I bought a different gun I was still there when the cops arrived to pick up the Colt Commander and I heard their conversation. Apparently the store had taken it on trade from a regular customer who had bought it from a guy at a gunshow. The owner said that he ran the number when he took the trade and it came up clean. The officer then told him that even though it was clean when he took it on trade he was still out of luck as far as the price of it goes unless he can talk the customer that traded it into paying him for it. What this made me realize was if I had bought that gun before the owner realized it was stolen I would have been the one out that money on it even though I came across it completely legally.

After that situation I sold the only used gun I owned at the time and have not purchased a used gun since. I know I am in the extreme side when it comes to this, but does anyone else feel uneasy about buying a used gun from a private party due to situations like this?

[cc-hangfire]

I can understand your concerns, but of the over 60 firearms I've owned only 5 were purchased new. With a C&R license, any firearm acquired that way is going to be used.

Maybe I've been lucky , but of the millions of firearms in existence I expect only a very, very small % have a criminal history.

[Garycw]

Actually I get excited buying used guns. Especially if you can find a bargain. I've never had a problem with a used gun, but I do check them out good

[Nathan]

Don't get me wrong, because I DEFINATELY want stolen guns found and returned to their owner, but the current system is setup to "lose" guns.

When I buy new, I buy from an FFL. I'm fine with the check and transfer process here in OH.

When I buy or sell used, I will most likely be doing this FTF to get us both the maximum value. I would not buy/sell if I had any concern. Honestly, these concerns are just in conversation. If the sellor knows nothing about this gun, or guns in general, that would be a huge red flag. Same for a buyer. I had a guy who wanted to buy a cheap gun of mine and had no transportation.....basically, I was supposed to bring it to him in a bad neighborhood....alarm bells....I bailed.

Back to my point, FTF sales definitely allow stolen guns to pass. I just can't see trading a gun into a dealer and taking the devaluation.

So, I suppose people buying and selling FTF are taking this risk.

[turkeestalker]

Honestly I'd never really thought of being bitten after the fact in a situation like that. I guess it does take time for things to catch up... thanks for making me paranoid now!!
Of course I'm joking, but no, I've purchased many used firearms but only on occasion was it from a private individual. I'm guessing that an instance like the one you encountered at your LGS is not common, but not unheard of. I'll just consider myself fortunate up to now and pray my good fortune continues.

[jmtbiggin]

Your scenerio happened to me. I bought a single shot NEF 20 GA for 85 bucks in 2008 from a local chain pawn shop. 2 months later at the gym I was lifting when a Detective I knew (casually) was also lifting. Out of the blue he asked me if had recently purchased the shotgun. I told the truth,and he came and got my gun while he was on duty because it had been reported stolen. The original owner got his gun back, the pawn shop had my money and the theives in jail. I showed the seizure form to pawn shop and they said tough break for you. In a way I understand why they refused me a refund. Serveral long guns were stolen from a man who did not notice for weeks that guns x y and z are missing. That is why the guns did not come up as hot when pawn shop purchased them. I can under stand that if you have 20 long guns a 4 are missing you might take while to notice. I am glad I did not buy the LC Smith SBS. All guns were recovered because of the paper traial

[jmtbiggin]

Lesson learned,add caveat on sales ticket if gun is seized refund is due

[JohnKSa]

If you pushed the issue, you might have been able to get a refund. As I understand the situation, nobody can legally own stolen property. That means that the Pawn Shop didn't really own the gun at the time they "sold" it to you. That means the sale wasn't legal and they should refund your money.

[Sevens]

but does anyone else feel uneasy about buying a used gun from a private party due to situations like this?

I absolutely do not worry about things of this nature, but I also pay attention to the person selling the gun in the first place. And I am absolutely NOT saying that I can sniff out someone and have half a clue about the history of the gun, but what I am saying is that if anything about the seller seems OFF, I am OUT.

If he can't produce a driver's license ensuring that he has residence in my state and is at least 21 years old, I don't care if the price is twenty bucks. If he acts shady or drops any clues that he runs outside of the law, I have no interest in purchasing anything from him. If he is some acquaintance through friends or work or wherever and I have reason to believe that he is a recreational drug user, the conversation never even gets as far as me having interest in his guns.

Where does that leave me?
If I feel and see no red flags, I end up with a firearm that really has no chance of being queried in any system anyway. This is because:
--I do not buy firearms for the purpose of selling them

--on the rare occasion that I do elect to forward one on, it's not going to a gun store because I won't accept 25-50% of the value of a gun that I'm selling

--I'm not shipping it to or fro, so it's not going to enter any FFL's book for any reason

--I don't break the law and end up with my guns in the hands of LE or anyone else who might "run the number" on it

Could, somehow, I end with a firearm that was somehow reported stolen?
Sure, I guess. But there are millions and millions of guns in this country and I can't imagine the percentage of those floating around just happen to be stolen property is high and again... there's just not a lot of occasion for my guns to be run through any database.

Certainly there COULD be. If I need to contact a manufacturer for service and it needs to be shipped, it would likely enter an FFL's book.

If I KNEW, somehow, after the fact that I happened to be holding a firearm that was stolen? Man, I'd be sick about it. I'm all about the gun karma -- doing what is right by the next guy. I would be horrified if any of my favorite guns were stolen, so I'd be extremely proactive in trying to get a stolen gun back to the guy who had it taken from him. I truly believe all of that goes around and comes around.

[TXAZ]

I'm less worried about a gun I buy used, than some stuff off ebay. ("America's garage sale", and super easy way to get questionable goods out of the area)

I'll get either a photo of a DL or CHL on a gun buy, so traceability is there.

[StukaJU87]

I've had it happen once, luckily the store refunded my money plus gave me a $25 gift card for the inconvenience.

[longspurr]

An idea. How about a searchable database of reported stolen guns, on line, that a person can log into and check if a gun is reported stolen?

This should be very easy to do and would help keep stolen guns out of general circulation. Might reduce the desirability of stealing a gun if you know you will have a problem selling it.

Some are against “registering guns”. Well these are guns that are in bad guys hands so why not try to keep good guys from making a mistake as some of the posters have shown can easily happen now.

[peggysue]

NO

[Sevens]

An idea. How about a searchable database of reported stolen guns, on line, that a person can log into and check if a gun is reported stolen?

I will second the "NO" !

The idea doesn't sound so bad until you consider how such a system might be abused.

Then it is a train wreck.

[FrankenMauser]

From a dealer... No worries. There's legal recourse that usually isn't even necessary. You just need an officer involved in the case to remind the gun shop that it was an illegal sale, and you'll get your money back.


Private transfers?...

It's all about the person selling the gun to me.

If they're sketchy and shady... No deal, and I'm staying far away (or getting out of there quickly).

If they seem to be on the up-and-up, I'll ask a question to see if they have any background or a good story about the firearm. If they have nothing... I get a little uncomfortable and probably won't go through with the sale.

But if I ask, "So, do you have any good stories about this rifle?" and the response is, "Oh man... I went out with my dad, just before he passed away, and I made the best running shot I've ever pulled off. This nasty, mangy coyote had to have been running 40 mph, left to right, and I smacked him right in the chest at about 325 yards. He went head over heels like a rag doll, four times, before he piled up on some sagebrush, stone dead!..."
...Then I'm probably going to go through with it.

Part of the background questions are curiosity, and getting a feeling for the seller. But, part of it is just me - I really like having as many stories as possible attached to my firearms. They become more than tools. They talk to me, every time I pick them up.
My old Winchester shotguns, in particular... They've got some stories to tell. If they could talk...


But in today's technology-saturated world, I don't, exactly, walk away from a face-to-face transfer with "nothing" either. When I buy, sell, or trade face-to-face, I type up a little record when I get home, for my 'firearm transfers' file. It includes: The name I was given. Any contact information that I have (home, work, and/or cell numbers, email addresses, home addresses, etc.). The exact item(s) bought, sold, or traded. A description of the other party, and any other people at the transfer. The location and time of the transfer. And a photograph of the other party's license plate and vehicle.
And, now that I run dash cameras in my vehicles, I'll have full video of future transfers, as well. ...In full HD. And if they're okay with it, I can record the audio with the press of a button on the camera.

[Garycw]

The only thing I potentially get nervous about is being robbed of gun or money. With a few email exchanges & public meet setting is comforting. Used guns at flea markets & shows is safer than parking lots though.
I got a bad feeling about selling to a guy once and simply told him it was sold before meeting.

[Husqvarna]

so far so good

both private sales and bought sight unseen (except pictures) from stores

but yeah until you shoot it it is a gamble

[g.willikers]

Some states do have databases listing stolen guns, cars, boats, bikes, just about anything with an identifiable serial number.
Considering all the ways our privacy has already been invaded, there's probably no greater risk with these databases than any other.

[jmr40]

If in doubt you can get a LE officer to run the SN for you. This is the only accurate database. I've purchased, traded or sold hundreds of guns over the years. About half or more of the purchases were used and obviously all that I sold or traded were used. Most were in pawnshops or gunshops, but a few have been FTF. Just to be safe I've had LE friends run the numbers on a few.

I realize that if one comes up as stolen I'll lose it. But long term the risk is worth the reward to me. The price difference between used and new is just too great, and many of the guns I want are no longer produced. Used is the only way. I've saved enough over the years that if I lost 3-4 of them I'd still be money ahead.

[Scorpion8]

Do you ever get nervous buying used guns?

Nope. That's a legal issue aside from my desire or want for that particular piece. Besides, I have very little interest in today's plastic and prefer all-metal vintage hammer-fired "real" guns, and those will almost all be used. I can repair most about anything if I can find parts, so the rest is just a challenge.

[CajunBass]

Never thought about it for a second.

Probably never will again.

[Snyper]

If you pushed the issue, you might have been able to get a refund. As I understand the situation, nobody can legally own stolen property. That means that the Pawn Shop didn't really own the gun at the time they "sold" it to you. That means the sale wasn't legal and they should refund your money.

The first "illegal sale" was when the pawn shop bought it, at which time it hadn't been reported stolen

The only one responsible for making restitutions is the one who stole or pawned it.

Everyone else involved is another victim

[lamarw]

I have only had one unfortunate situation which resulted in a minor windfall. I bought a used rifle off GunBroker from a nearby firearms dealer who handles predominately law enforcement sales and police trade-ins.

The purchase went well, I picked the used rifle up locally and a FFL was processed. Just short of a year after the purchase the seller contacted me stating they need the rifle back. Actually the law enforcement agency trading it in needed it back. I never found out the reason.

The seller was very gracious and apologetic. They in return presented me with a new in the box upgraded version of the same rifle. It was somewhat of a hassle for me but not close to the extra couple of hundred in upgraded value I received. I understand mistakes can be made and happy to support any law enforcement activity.

The answer the "thread question" - No, I am not shy of purchasing used and do so when I can score a fair deal on what I will enjoy owning.

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

No disappointments. No buyer's remorse. No shipping back and forth either. I buy new or up front in person when it concerns used weaponry. That's just the way (I) operate.

[JohnKSa]

The first "illegal sale" was when the pawn shop bought it, at which time it hadn't been reported stolen

The only one responsible for making restitutions is the one who stole or pawned it.

Everyone else involved is another victim.

I get that. But the issue remains that if the pawn shop did not own the gun, they did not have the right to sell it. If they did not have the right to sell it, the transaction was not legal and therefore the buyer is entitled to a refund.

In like manner, the pawn shop is entitled to a refund from the person who pawned/sold the gun since that person also had no right to sell it.

In one sense it may seem unfair to the pawn shop, but if any other approach is taken, it creates a situation where there's no reason for a pawn shop (or anyone else) to avoid purchasing stolen merchandise. As long as they can sell it quickly enough (before it is discovered to be stolen) they can profit from the situation and not be penalized.