How many open carry at home?

[A pause for the COZ]

T

o the OP....do you consider yourself in a rural, urban, or suburban area?

Same question to anyone else who would care to answer.

It really is starting to sound like our notion of rural America as a sanctuary from crime has eroded significantly. But it is not clear what population densities we are dealing with for many posters on this thread.

I would say Rural. Three miles out of town. The closest bigger city is MPLS/ St Paul about 65 mi away.

But the county is the poorest county in the state. 75% below poverty level.

Life out here was not always this bad. Sure there were plenty of poor people.
But then came METH... METH is a plague on civilization.
Once hooked they are hooked for good. They cant keep a job so how do you think they get the stuff?

YUP... They drive the dirt roads looking for a easy grab. You leave it out. Its gone.
I work for the power company... You would be surprised what we see.

The fact is... If you want to keep it. you better protect it.

[buckhorn_cortez]

It's interesting that this question is in "Tactics and Training" and the only security tactic being discussed is whether you carry at home or not.

I don't carry at home, I really have no reason to do that. You would have to climb a 5-1/2 foot high fence to get to my house. Should someone climb the fence, they would have to get past a 6-foot wall with another gate to get to the front door; or climb a second 4-foot high fence to access any other door or window. Criminals are opportunists and if you make it difficult for them, they will choose an easier target.

In 20 years, I've never had a knock at my door that I didn't know who it was, simply because the gate to the driveway is only opened when we know someone is going to be coming to the house.

Now, that doesn't mean we're not unaware of the need for protection. As I'm typing this, there is a SIG P229 within arm's reach, another SIG hidden in a bookcase near the kitchen, a gun in my wife's purse, a 1911 in my briefcase, a shotgun in the bedroom closet, two guns in the nightstand, and another gun hidden on the mantel in the bedroom.

If you feel the need to carry 24/7 - I'd suggest reviewing some other options for increasing your security and lowering your need for constant self defense - it can be done.

[A pause for the COZ]

Thats true enough. Home protection is more than what gun and were its at.

At our place it seemed it was a magnet for any one with a problem, question, need a phone, gas, ride, what ever.

The same things that attracted our gaze every time we drove by this place years before we purchased it were the same things working on the ding bats.

I installed a chain link fence around the road side of our yard. I did that to keep my dogs alive. But it must have also had a psychological effect on the dig bats.
The volume of stops decreased by I guess...... 80%.
I guess we dont look as inviting.. Thats ok with me.

I have also added 6 security cameras and signage letting them know we are looking.
IP Cameras are cheap now. Every one should have them.

Not one thing will keep ya safe, but it all helps.

[JohnKSa]

Why do Americans feel so vulnerable in their own homes. ?

I really don't. I honestly believe, and the statistics support the belief, that I will never have to use a firearm in self-defense.

I don't carry because I believe it's likely I'll need one in my lifetime. I carry for three reasons.

1. In spite of the odds being low, the stakes are high. It's the same reason people play the lottery even though there's virtually zero chance of their winning. Because if they manage to beat the odds, the payoff is incredible. Likewise, although the chance of my being the victim of violent crime is low, the cost of "beating the odds" is extremely undesirable.

2. Because it's so easy to carry. I do many things to be prepared for unlikely and likely events simply because it's easy to do them that it hardly makes sense to NOT do them.

3. Because I know about guns, like shooting, and am proficient with firearms. How stupid (and ironic) would it be for someone like me, who has spent a lot of time and effort becoming proficient with a handgun because I enjoy shooting, to end up being unarmed the one time I might really need a firearm at hand? It would be like being a master mechanic having one single breakdown in your car in your life and not having any tools on hand to deal with the problem.

Guess where I live is safer than where you do........damn windows open all night long.......sometimes the garage door is up all night by accident......same for everyone else where I live and WOW.....no invasions.

Good. I hope that stays true all your life. But you do understand that there are no crime free zones, right? Bad people can go where they like and some are smart enough to go where the pickings are easy. Places where people leave their windows and doors open, etc.

Being prepared to me just means that I don't fall into the trap of believing that nothing bad could possibly happen. In other words, I'm not constantly expecting trouble, I'm just not dismissing the possibility.

I've seen many people who want to dismiss the possibility of trouble and who actually become irate if someone voices a different opinion around them.

One interesting thing I've found to be true is that some people actually intentionally do things like leave windows and doors open or unlocked because it makes them feel safer. I think that they feel, at some level--perhaps subconsciously, that doing so is an affirmation of how safe they really are. People with this attitude tend to become angry and often insulting when dealing with people that take a more cautious approach to security. It's almost as if they feel, again, perhaps subconsciously, that bringing the topic up threatens them. Sort of a "knock on wood" sort of thing--if we don't talk about it, it won't happen.

[serf 'rett]

No open carry at home for me.

[Pond, James Pond]

you have certainly changed my mind, i will no longer carry or move to a bunker......and i am sure i have changed your mind and you have already started carrying at home. i'm glad we had this discussion.

Should we only post if we agree?

Seems a shame to stifle discussion just because of the inconvenience of differing opinions...

[Blackbook]

Originally Posted by A pause for the COZ

I CC when out and about, but at home I did not. I sufficed that I had strategically located fire arms around in case the need arises.

I have since, in the last couple of months changed my tactics.
I live three miles out of a small town, and even here it is getting bad again.
I constantly note dirt balls out scoping some possibilities. Three or four days a week I am at home. You would be surprised who is driving the dirt roads when your at work.

Just in the last month with in 2 miles of me. One place got broke into and they were still in the house when the kids got off the school bus. Kids noted Dad's shot guns against the wall in the entry way. Figured some thing was wrong so hi tailed it to the neighbors. Scruff Muffins were gone by the time the Sheriff dept showed up.

1/2 Mile south of me. An old fella had died. When the kids came up to go through dad's stuff. There was nothing left to go through. They even took the wiring.

Last week at my place. I had a contractor doing some cement work. In between tasks he left his shiny new Bob Cat and a trailer in my yard.
That night around 11pm, we get a knock on the door.
Some jittery looking kid who could not make eye contact asking for directions. ( yea right, just wanted to see if any one was home)
He did note the PT111 on my hip.

Getting bad again:

I have choices for a home carry piece. But I chose my PT11 for one reason. (ok three reasons)
Its reliable, compact, and cheap. I think the new ones can be had for $199 on a good day.
If I scratch the heck out of it, And I will. No biggie....

My goal is not to have to pull it. But I want these dirt bags driving around looking for a mark to see me mowing the yard with a gun strapped to my hip.

" Aint going there. That crazy guy lives there."

I look forward to reading the opinions of those who dislike OC, as this seems to be a clear case supporting the deterrence advantage of OC.

I do always carry at home. Not deliberately, it's just that that my gun is something I have on my person while I'm dressed just as I also have my wallet, phone and keys, too. Exactly the same.

I don't OC at the house only because I favor IWB holsters and my over-shirt covers it. If I were faced with your situation, however, I might invest in a house holster and OC.

[zach_]

Guns are always within reach. I usually wear gym shorts at home. Not good for holsters. This area has gone down hill as well. "Section 8" housing and apartments have taken their toll. Not all section 8 tennants are bad people, but there are lots of them in the mix.

[psalm7]

Being aware of possible threats is not paronia . There are people out there that want what you got , any part of it and there are people out there that are serial minded that you or a famiy mamber may chance meet and it means something eles to them , there are people that may be wondering around under the influance or insane that are a threat to any one they randomly meet . I live in a rural area and there is normaly no trouble of any kind other than a preaditor killing someones live stock or maby a car wreck or something but there is also a ocasional break in or robbery from thoes that drive around looking for a easy target , a couple of times there has been someone become a drug dealer and that brings threats into our area , And as the big family farmes get sold off and broke up there is alot of new people move in and brings alot of baggage with them . I do not sit around armed to the teeth but rely more on sittuational awareness . The multi layer defence mentioned by others is the best defence . I have some of that going on and feel comfortable with my prepps . Also forgot to mention another threat many rural areas face are the weekend drunks and druggies that will leave town and ride around the countryside to get away from the Cops on ocasionas myself and Iv talked to others have had them in the middle of the night knock on the door when they have had car trouble or wrecked . People skills can keep this peaceful but you never know what could happen . Couple of weeks ago I was walking around my yard with a morning cup of coffee ( yes unarmed ) and saw where one of the ride around junkies threw out a sheet of plastic with a used needle , rubber strap , empty bud light can all with blood on them into the middle of the road . I work 60 plus hours a week enjoying my day off and have to look at their garbage . I do carry when answering the door and most of the time when when hikeing or patroling my property .

[buckhorn_cortez]

I will make one suggestion. There is a design concept in security called crime prevention through environmental design (CPTED).

CPTED deals with physical designs for a site to lower the risk of crime at the site. There are a number of disciplines and concepts in CPTED, but three areas can be directly applied to most private houses - natural access control, natural territorial reinforcement, and natural surveillance.

This can be summed up as deterrence through environmental design.

The subject is a bit too involved to get into on an Internet forum, but there are several books available on the subject. If anyone is interested in evaluating their residence for CPTED concepts, a good starting text is, Crime Prevention Through Environmental Design, Third Edition.

[Arizona Fusilier]

Good stuff there, Buckhorn.......thanks!

[orionengnr]

I don't carry because I believe it's likely I'll need one in my lifetime. I carry for three reasons.

1. In spite of the odds being low, the stakes are high. It's the same reason people play the lottery even though there's virtually zero chance of their winning. Because if they manage to beat the odds, the payoff is incredible. Likewise, although the chance of my being the victim of violent crime is low, the cost of "beating the odds" is extremely undesirable.

I don't even need to quote the second and third reasons...The first one is so compelling.

BTW, I don't "Open Carry" at home...I conceal carry at home, just like I do everywhere else.

As a local Texas CHL poster has in his sig line "Carry 24/7 or guess right."

[buckhorn_cortez]

Likewise, although the chance of my being the victim of violent crime is low, the cost of "beating the odds" is extremely undesirable.

That's an awfully broad statement. If you live in a low crime area (which you can find out through local police statistics), apply security measures and design concepts - you're getting to the hit by lightning, or hit by a meteor level of statistics.

If you still believe, even at an extremely low percentage, that you're still at risk and need to carry 24/7 - it begs the question what do you do to avoid being hit by lightning or a meteor as you're still at risk from those two very real threats?

[Blackbook]

Originally Posted by buckhorn_cortez

That's an awfully broad statement. If you live in a low crime area (which you can find out through local police statistics), apply security measures and design concepts - you're getting to the hit by lightning, or hit by a meteor level of statistics.

If you still believe, even at an extremely low percentage, that you're still at risk and need to carry 24/7 - it begs the question what do you do to avoid being hit by lightning or a meteor as you're still at risk from those two very real threats?

Sometimes lightning comes lookin for ya

[bandaid1]

I'm a firm believer that the human brain is the most deadly weapon in the world, so yes, I am armed at all times.

As far as other man-made weapons go. I always carry a knife on me from sun up to sun down, 365 days a year, sometimes several. I do carry a handgun from time to time, when I do, I usually carry it openly. It depends on what I'm doing. In my younger years I carried concealed weapons, but not so much these days. Again, it depends on what I'm doing.

[JohnKSa]

That's an awfully broad statement. If you live in a low crime area (which you can find out through local police statistics), apply security measures and design concepts - you're getting to the hit by lightning, or hit by a meteor level of statistics.

There are certainly things one can do and SHOULD do to reduce the chances of being the victim of violent crime.

I'm sure that some people would feel tremendously secure if they took the precautions you mention. I'm sure of it because clearly many feel tremendously secure without taking such precautions merely because of where they live.

Just for reference, the lifetime odds of being hit by lightning is about one in 6,000 and of being killed by a meteor is about one in 500,000.

Based on at least one study, about 80% of people in the U.S. will be the victim of violent crime in the U.S. at some time in their lifetime.

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/bjs/104274.pdf

Of course, that's a bit misleading since not everyone runs the same risk--as you point out, there are many prudent things one can do to reduce one's risk. However, even taking such measures is unlikely to reduce odds of 5 out of 6 to 1 in 6,000 or 1 in 500,000.

If you still believe, even at an extremely low percentage, that you're still at risk and need to carry 24/7...

Apparently you didn't read very much of my last post because I very clearly said that I was less concerned about the odds than the stakes. In fact, I said quite plainly that I never expect to use a firearm for self-defense in my lifetime.

I also pointed out two other reasons that I carry that have virtually nothing to do with odds or risk.

[BigMikey76]

If you live in a low crime area (which you can find out through local police statistics), apply security measures and design concepts - you're getting to the hit by lightning, or hit by a meteor level of statistics.

Getting hit by lightning is extremely unlikely, but that doesn't mean I'm gonna go golfing in a thunder storm. I firmly fall into the "why take the chance" camp.

[garryc]

I put my pants on and I put my gun on, just what I do.

[dirtd0g]

My Shield is very comfortable CC IWB for me. I wear it everywhere it is lawful to do so, including in my house. Granted, while IN my house I am not "careful" about it popping out at all unless someone knocks on the door or we have visitors.

With teens in the house who are... Well... Typical teens with sketchy friends I am not a fan of staging guns anywhere.

It's on me or in the safe which is in a locked room.

[Blackbook]

Originally Posted by garryc

I put my pants on and I put my gun on, just what I do.

That's how I see it, as normal as having my wallet in my pocket. No extra thought or effort required.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

As rare as being hit by lightning or being in a plane crash.

I've been hit by lightning. I had a friend who survived a DC-8 crash. All in the front were killed. He was in the back his wife and kid and they made it.

In a class, the instructor said " As rare as Blah,blah...".

We both raised our hands!

Petit family and that family in DC recently lived in a low crime area.

[Sharkbite]

The odds, 1in 10...1 in 1000.....heck 1 in 1,000,000,000,000,000. Dont matter if you are the 1 that night

All the advise about hardening your home is sound. The pistol is just a last line of defense for the unexpected knock at the door during family movie night.

As others have stated, it doesn't hurt to carry around the house and there may not be time to retrieve that stashed gun.

[walks with gun]

If you were a gun, would you liked to be locked up in a safe or left laying on the dresser or would you rather be carried, fondled, and spend quality time with the family. keep your gun with you, it could be your best friend if you need it.

[stagpanther]

Interesting question. Although I never advertise the fact, all my neighbors know/knew that I have lots of different weapons and practice very frequently with them. That and a good dog I believe puts me way down the list of desirable hits. I also firmly believe that thieves almost always know what they are after before they hit your home, and I simply don't have much of value or something that could be quickly converted to cash--except maybe the weapons themselves, which are kept in safes except for the ones I have positioned in areas where a quick escape is not an option. I've drawn a weapon twice in my home/yard (though did not point at them) on potential intruders--once in an inner-city high crime area and once in a very rural country area; so from that perspective I don't think you can generalize on what area you may or may not be more likely to need a weapon. The country area I have lived in for decades was a place where nobody ever locked anything--but alas, that has changed. A local police chief has told me small isolated country communities like ours are some of the highest per capita hotspots for heroin and other drugs in the country--which is shocking since I never seem to notice this.

[Blacktimberwolf]

I be astonished how fearfully the sons of the great Nation are, I live in Germany, in the outskirts of a very small town. We don't even lock the door as long as there's daylight.
If a stranger knocks on my door, I don't open with a gun in my hand and fear in my heart, like I read it here so often.
He asks for the way or try to sell something, we never think he is a bad guy and in 99,9 percent he isn't a bad guy.
I open without getting my wife a gun and send her to a backroom.
In Germany we have a population of 80 000 000. Not more than 100000 people have CC permission, not more than 2 000000 people do have a gun-license.
So the bad boy's don't risk much, nevertheless we have a very low crime level.
If I call the police, the are here in 5 minutes.
If I take a walk in the evening I'm never armed,because it's not necessary.
We have no fear of our fellow human beings.
That's so in Germany, Austria, Swiss, France, Great Britain, Italy and many other european country's.
Sure,we do have murders and other crime but a gun would not change the situation, because to carry one is not allowed.
So we don't have any accidently shot victims, like "child shot mother in a mall".
I have a gun in my safe, but I'm sure I will never need it.
Untill now, I was often in the USA, in 25 States, I never carried a gun, because I had no license and there was no need for a gun.
I think it's a matter of personal attitude.
I would never shoot someone for stealing my tv, in Germany my insurance will pay me a new, better one. It's called " Hausratversicherung ".