Trail Boss... anyone use this stuff ??? thoughts ???

[Cult .44]

I like it for slinging lead at low velocity from my Super Blackhawk. My only issue is that it smells bad when you fire it. It doesn't have that satisfying love-the-smell-of-gunpowder-in-the-morning aroma of, say, 2400.

[B.L.E.]

The way I understand it, lighter bullets generally impact lower because of reduced dwell time (being lighter, they move faster). To bring POI up, reducing velocity, which increases dwell, will cause it to spend more time in the barrel as that barrel rises from recoil.

My experience is that heavy bullets impact high and light bullets impact low regardless of velocity. It's not just the barrel time, it's also how hard it kicks during the barrel time. A light bullet with a light load may have just as long a barrel time as a heavy bullet with a heavy load and similar muzzle velocitys but it still impacts low because the gun kicked less during its barrel time.

[bluetopper]

Besides filling up a case, of which I pay close attention to anyway, what will TB do that Clays or Bullseye can't do?

[Mike Irwin]

"Besides filling up a case"

That's its most important attribute, and that's why it was developed in the first place - to give those who load the old, high capacity, low pressure rounds a powder more suitable to those cases. I get FAR better ballistic uniformity with TB in my .44 Special than I ever did with WW 231.

What will it do that Clays and Bullseye won't do?

How about rifle rounds, from .32-20 all the way to .50-70?

I've said it many, many times about TB... It's the closest thing we have to bulk smokeless powder, the last of which was discontinued in the 1950s.

[mtnbkr]

My experience is that heavy bullets impact high and light bullets impact low regardless of velocity. It's not just the barrel time, it's also how hard it kicks during the barrel time. A light bullet with a light load may have just as long a barrel time as a heavy bullet with a heavy load and similar muzzle velocitys but it still impacts low because the gun kicked less during its barrel time.

If that's the case, then increasing the velocity of a given load shouldn't have any effect on POI, but I have seen a difference in factory and handloads. My own 180gr 357mag load was hitting too high for the factory sights. Increasing the velocity (and increasing felt recoil) brought the POI down.

I've seen the same effect in 22lr between two loads using the same weight bullet, but one being HV and the other being standard velocity (HV impacts lower).

Maybe it's just me, but it's something I can reproduce. I've seen a relationship between velocity and POI and bullet weight and POI. Using the two, I've been able to come up with "light and slow" loads that have the same POI as "fast and heavy" loads.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

To further expand on the concept...

Two things impact POI: Dwell time and recoil.

Recoil affects POI by the amount of rise it induces in the barrel during firing.
Dwell affects POI by affecting the amount of time the bullet is in the barrel during recoil induced rise.

To bring POI down, you decrease recoil by reducing bullet weight (which causes the barrel to rise less) or you decrease dwell (causing the bullet to exit the barrel at a lower point in the recoil induced rising).

To bring POI up, you increase bullet weight (with the expected increase in recoil), which means the barrel is pointing higher when the bullet exits. Or, you decrease velocity, which gives recoil forces more time to affect the rise of the barrel before the bullet exits.

By using both variables, bullet weight and velocity, you can craft two loads that have similar POIs, but very different shooting characteristics (heavy and fast load for hunting, light and slow load for target shooting).

It takes a significant change in both variables to create a matching POI though. In my 44magnum, I need a 240gr bullet at 1000fps to match a 300gr bullet at 1300fps (both numbers from chrono). For my 357mag, it was a 180gr bullet at 1200 matching up with a 158gr bullet at 800ish. The 357mag load didn't match quite as well as the 44, but it was close enough.

Chris

[charlie-6]

Use it in several cowboy cal. also in 45acp, clean burning and easy to load.

[Mal H]

For my 357mag, it was a 180gr bullet at 1200 matching up with a 158gr bullet at 800ish.

Chris, did you mistype that? It seems to be the opposite of what you are saying.

[mtnbkr]

No, that is exactly what I'm saying.

The 180gr@1200 load was my standard, a load that printed fairly high compared to standard 357mag loads. I wanted a low pressure load for target shooting, plinking, etc. I reduced the bullet weight (reduced recoil, but also lowered POI) and decreased velocity (reduced dwell, raised POI).

Chris

[Paochow]

I've used almost a pound now reloading .44Mag and .500 S&W. Works great at turning both of these guns into pussycats for painfree plinking. Muzzle energy and felt recoil are in the .40 S&W range and in both calibers it has been very accurate and close to point of aim as a standard load. The only downside I've noted is that it dirties the cases more than a standard load as it doesn't have the pressure to seal the case.

The 9oz container usually equals the equivalent of a pound of regular powder as the Trailboss requires half the grains to fill a case.

If you wanted to use a .500 S&W for home defense, this would be a good powder as overpenetration wouldn't be an issue.

[Rodentman]

I use TB in light .38 and .44 sp loads. My only complaint is that it takes a long time for the Lyman scale to measure each charge since it is light and airy. But I like the powder and the fact that it fills much more of the case than denser powders.

[daleo8803]

i use trail boss in my 357 mag. i shoot lead boolits only. works great! you cant over charge a case and the stuff burns great!

dale

[Magnum Wheel Man]

Just for fun, I tried a case full in my fast twist 22 Hornet this weekend... 3 grains filled the case to just below the bullet base... I loaded 8 rounds & got an average through the chrony of around 950 fps with a 45 grain Barnes bullet, & a Remington small rifle primer, this was out of my 6" barreled revolver...

shooting it was a good break between 45 Colt +P loads out of my 10" Contender, which is "almost" painfull, & seems to make my knuckle bleed every time I shoot it more than 20 rounds... but I finally got my deer hunting load dialed in, so I don't see shooting it 30-40 rounds a day anymore...

velocities on the Hornet with Trailboss varried quite a bit within the 8 rounds, but the revolver still shot to point of aim... I think I'm going to try a few lighter loads with a bit more air space in the case, ( this load wasn't compact, but was "full" ) & try the Sierra 55 grain spitzer boat tail Game Kings which seem to shoot very well in this gun... along with some hot loads, for distance shooting, I'd like some light & quiet squirrel loads, if they'll shoot to the same point of aim...