Progressives, Factory Crimp Die, Plinking Ammo

Kframe · April 15, 2001, 04:56 AM

Hi All,
A couple questions.
I am going to get into a progressive, and have almost decided on the Lee Pro 1000.

(Please don't try to talk me into a Dillon, I don't have the cash and will not wait.)

Okay, so I'm only going to load .38/.357 for plinking (my target stuff is loaded on a single stage).

The Pro 1000 has a three-hole turret.

So, we have the sizer/decapper, the expander/powder-filler, and the seater.
No more room for a factory crimp die.

#1.Do I take all my loaded ammo and run it through the factory crimp die on my single stage...
OR
#2.Do I skip the factory crimp die since this is just plinking ammo...
OR
#3.Do I get a press that has four or five holes on the turret.

Is the factory crimp die even necessary on handgun ammo?
I have only used it on the .222Rem, and .223Rem.

Thanks in advance for the help!
-Kframe

saands · April 15, 2001, 11:16 AM

I swear by the factory crimp die for all my semi-auto ammo ... but I don't think the factory crimp does anything for .38/.357 that isn't redundant ... you already sized the case when you deprimed it and the factory crimp on the .357 is a roll crimp like the seating die that comes with the 3-die set. The addition of another station is a $130 step up to the next press (actually get two more stations with the LoadMaster). If it is just .38/.357, IMHO it isn't an issue.
Saands

Johnny Guest · April 15, 2001, 02:23 PM

Kframe--

I understand not wanting to wait. Plenty of time to upgrade to the Dillon later on. I loaded for over 20 years on single stage presses.

That said, I use a Dillon 550B and really like applying the crimp separately. On stage three, I ONLY seat the bullet and this also takes most of the bell off the case. I seated and crimped on single stage presses for years before I became tired of shaving minute amounts of lead off in the final tiny fraction of movement. The bullet keeps pressing into the case as you turn in the case mouth, so it appears unavoidable.

Even on the single stage, I ended up adding another step, for roll crimp for revolver cartridges, or taper crimp for auto. pistol cartridges. Now I simply use another die at station four. The crimp goes nicely into place without shaving any lead.

I believe you'll be happy with running your loaded rounds into either the Lee factory crimp die or applying a standard roll crimp in a separate step, even though this is a little time consuming. As you stated, it probably makes little difference in pure plinking ammo. The more powerful the loads become, though, the more difference I think you'll see. The .357 mag loads, especially with larger amounts of slower-burning powder, need a certain amount of resistance to develop uniform pressures. Sorry I can't cite references, but I've read a couple of articles on bullet pull/uniform pressure/velocity correlation, and I am convinced.

Best,
Johnny

Coolray · April 15, 2001, 06:05 PM

The 4 Hole Lee Turrett press is almost as fast. I use the Lee 3 hole turret and hand prime a bunch watching TV and have the expanderdie,bullet seater die and the Factory crimp in the turret. Just an Idea

LilJoe · April 15, 2001, 08:28 PM

Lee LoadMaster over the Pro1000.
Station 1) resize and deprime.
Station 2) empty turret, prime casing
Station 3) expander and charging die
Station 4) Bullet seater
Station 5) Factory crimp die. Taper for Semi's and roll for Revolver. No jams and misfeeds.
Station 6) round ready to be boxxed up and set away waiting for you to enjoy some plinking.

Only have to spend one night reloading during the week to keep up with our weekend shooting. Or when waiting for dinner everynight to keep up this the wifes shooting during the week.

Coolray, when do you resize?

JNewhouse · April 17, 2001, 02:24 PM

crimp plinking ammo?? BAH!!
Don't get me wrong, I love to precisely create a .308 round that will give me tiny tiny groups. BUT, when I am loading plinking rounds for my 9mm, my philosophy is economy and speed. If you don't need to crimp it, why bother? It's just more work.

P.S. If you went with a tapered cartridge, like the far superior-to-all-other-rounds 9mm, you wouldn't have to crimp.

P.P.S If you had the-best-gun-ever-made (Glock 17) you wouldn't need to crimp.

LilJoe · April 17, 2001, 04:25 PM

No crimp on any of my rounds and I can't get them to feed in the Barretta. It's like trying to get Wolf 9mm to feed. Just doesn't work for me.

muzzletalk · April 17, 2001, 04:36 PM

If you have at least 4 stages, than I don't see why you wouldn't crimp. Its not like it takes any more time.

WalterGAII · April 17, 2001, 11:01 PM

I crimp every 9mm round that goes through my G17. Also crimp every other handgun caliber that I load.

slo_dog · April 18, 2001, 06:35 AM

Crimp

tonyz · April 18, 2001, 07:43 AM

I use a Dillon SDB and also have a single Stage Press.
For 9mm plinking rounds I use station #4, dillon crimp die and use a heavey crimp. For the match ammo I use the Single Stage Press to add my Crimp with a Lee Factory crimp die or a Redding Profile Die.

Good Shooting,

Tony Z

Master Blaster · April 18, 2001, 08:14 AM

I have a 550b and for 9mm and .45 I must crimp or it will not chamber in any of my guns, including my glock.

April 15, 2001, 08:28 PM	#5
LilJoe Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2001 Location: North Eastern Ohio Posts: 185	LoadMaster Lee LoadMaster over the Pro1000. Station 1) resize and deprime. Station 2) empty turret, prime casing Station 3) expander and charging die Station 4) Bullet seater Station 5) Factory crimp die. Taper for Semi's and roll for Revolver. No jams and misfeeds. Station 6) round ready to be boxxed up and set away waiting for you to enjoy some plinking. Only have to spend one night reloading during the week to keep up with our weekend shooting. Or when waiting for dinner everynight to keep up this the wifes shooting during the week. Coolray, when do you resize?

April 17, 2001, 02:24 PM	#6
JNewhouse Member Join Date: April 30, 2000 Location: Anaheim CA USA Posts: 41	Bah! crimp plinking ammo?? BAH!! Don't get me wrong, I love to precisely create a .308 round that will give me tiny tiny groups. BUT, when I am loading plinking rounds for my 9mm, my philosophy is economy and speed. If you don't need to crimp it, why bother? It's just more work. P.S. If you went with a tapered cartridge, like the far superior-to-all-other-rounds 9mm, you wouldn't have to crimp. P.P.S If you had the-best-gun-ever-made (Glock 17) you wouldn't need to crimp.

April 17, 2001, 04:25 PM	#7
LilJoe Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2001 Location: North Eastern Ohio Posts: 185	No crimp. No crimp on any of my rounds and I can't get them to feed in the Barretta. It's like trying to get Wolf 9mm to feed. Just doesn't work for me.

April 18, 2001, 07:43 AM	#11
tonyz Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2000 Location: Wa Posts: 922	For Plinking (CRIMP) I use a Dillon SDB and also have a single Stage Press. For 9mm plinking rounds I use station #4, dillon crimp die and use a heavey crimp. For the match ammo I use the Single Stage Press to add my Crimp with a Lee Factory crimp die or a Redding Profile Die. Good Shooting, Tony Z

April 15, 2001, 04:56 AM	#1
Kframe Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 1999 Location: MN Posts: 640	Hi All, A couple questions. I am going to get into a progressive, and have almost decided on the Lee Pro 1000. (Please don't try to talk me into a Dillon, I don't have the cash and will not wait.) Okay, so I'm only going to load .38/.357 for plinking (my target stuff is loaded on a single stage). The Pro 1000 has a three-hole turret. So, we have the sizer/decapper, the expander/powder-filler, and the seater. No more room for a factory crimp die. #1.Do I take all my loaded ammo and run it through the factory crimp die on my single stage... OR #2.Do I skip the factory crimp die since this is just plinking ammo... OR #3.Do I get a press that has four or five holes on the turret. Is the factory crimp die even necessary on handgun ammo? I have only used it on the .222Rem, and .223Rem. Thanks in advance for the help! -Kframe

April 15, 2001, 11:16 AM	#2
saands Senior Member Join Date: November 14, 1999 Posts: 1,573	I swear by the factory crimp die for all my semi-auto ammo ... but I don't think the factory crimp does anything for .38/.357 that isn't redundant ... you already sized the case when you deprimed it and the factory crimp on the .357 is a roll crimp like the seating die that comes with the 3-die set. The addition of another station is a $130 step up to the next press (actually get two more stations with the LoadMaster). If it is just .38/.357, IMHO it isn't an issue. Saands

April 15, 2001, 02:23 PM	#3
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	Kframe-- I understand not wanting to wait. Plenty of time to upgrade to the Dillon later on. I loaded for over 20 years on single stage presses. That said, I use a Dillon 550B and really like applying the crimp separately. On stage three, I ONLY seat the bullet and this also takes most of the bell off the case. I seated and crimped on single stage presses for years before I became tired of shaving minute amounts of lead off in the final tiny fraction of movement. The bullet keeps pressing into the case as you turn in the case mouth, so it appears unavoidable. Even on the single stage, I ended up adding another step, for roll crimp for revolver cartridges, or taper crimp for auto. pistol cartridges. Now I simply use another die at station four. The crimp goes nicely into place without shaving any lead. I believe you'll be happy with running your loaded rounds into either the Lee factory crimp die or applying a standard roll crimp in a separate step, even though this is a little time consuming. As you stated, it probably makes little difference in pure plinking ammo. The more powerful the loads become, though, the more difference I think you'll see. The .357 mag loads, especially with larger amounts of slower-burning powder, need a certain amount of resistance to develop uniform pressures. Sorry I can't cite references, but I've read a couple of articles on bullet pull/uniform pressure/velocity correlation, and I am convinced. Best, Johnny

April 15, 2001, 06:05 PM	#4
Coolray Senior Member Join Date: August 10, 2000 Location: Spokane ,wa Posts: 290	The 4 Hole Lee Turrett press is almost as fast. I use the Lee 3 hole turret and hand prime a bunch watching TV and have the expanderdie,bullet seater die and the Factory crimp in the turret. Just an Idea __________________ Hello My name is Coolray.............And I'm an Addict

April 17, 2001, 04:36 PM	#8
muzzletalk Member Join Date: January 3, 2001 Posts: 85	If you have at least 4 stages, than I don't see why you wouldn't crimp. Its not like it takes any more time.

April 17, 2001, 11:01 PM	#9
WalterGAII Junior member Join Date: November 7, 1999 Posts: 1,516	I crimp every 9mm round that goes through my G17. Also crimp every other handgun caliber that I load.

April 18, 2001, 06:35 AM	#10
slo_dog Member Join Date: February 20, 2001 Location: Mi. Posts: 23	Crimp

April 18, 2001, 08:14 AM	#12
Master Blaster Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 1999 Location: One of the original 13 Colonies Posts: 2,281	I have a 550b and for 9mm and .45 I must crimp or it will not chamber in any of my guns, including my glock.