10ga. o/u shotgun

mike6975 · June 20, 2010, 05:24 PM

i would like to make one for a home defense,has anyone done this,and what mods if any have you done?.also doesn't the 12ga. 3-1/2" magnum kick harder than the 10ga.?,or is that a myth?.any feedback woul be appreciated.

Respectfully,

mike

zippy13 · June 20, 2010, 06:50 PM

Given equivalent (same load, same velocity) ammo, a 10-ga may have less kick than a 12-ga 3-1/2" because a 10-ga gun is typically heaver than a 12 and the 10-ga loads operate a lower pressures. As I mentioned in Low recoil 12 gauge ammo? #17: Lower pressures equate to less acceleration, less acceleration means a longer internal event time, and a longer event time means less perceived recoil, or kick. In other words, for loads to be equivalent, the charges leave the barrels at the same velocity; however, one load took longer in the barrel to get up to speed. That's the load that will kick less.

Scottmkiv · June 20, 2010, 09:22 PM

Why not just get a semi-auto or pump and get more capacity?

Rampant_Colt · June 20, 2010, 11:07 PM

why a 10ga?
why an over & under?
wouldn't an exposed-hammer SxS be cooler?

both kick like the proverbial mule and are not well-suited for home defense

also

buckshot for bad guys - birdshot for birdies - repeat

the rifleer · June 21, 2010, 12:04 AM

I agree, there is no point. Over Unders are used mostly for shooting clays and birds. The can be used for other things, but generally aren't.

As for the recoil question, you can have a 20 gauge kick much harder than a 12 gauge and vice versa, it totally depends on what load you are shooting and out of what gun.

Just buy a pump or semi...

PS- my names not Surely

Dave McC · June 21, 2010, 10:42 AM

It can be done,Mike. But......

Even a 28 gauge packs enough ME to be a good HD tool, and the 10 kicks hard in any configuration. 10s also tend to be ponderous and slow to handle.

Long ago, a gunsmith/mad scientist I knew sawed off a Greener SxS 10 and l
loaded up some BP loads in all brass 2 7/8" cases using .375" round balls. Call it 5/0 buck. We fired off some and marveled at the ensuing damage. It kicked harder than the 375 H&H we also fired that day.

IMO, not worth the hassle.....

BigJimP · June 21, 2010, 11:44 AM

I think considering a 10ga - O/U, pump or semi-auto ... is a huge mistake ...

I think you'll end up with a lot more recoil than you want / and the whole idea just isn't going to be very effecitve ....vs any number of 12ga options - if you really think you need a defensive shotgun.

I don't subscribe to the idea that everyone needs a "tactical shotgun" ...but if you want one / then you should get one...but there are so many good options in a 12ga pump or semi-auto ...why go the 10ga route ??

I guess I'd like to hear what you're trying to accomplish with a 10ga that a 12ga won't do in your opinion / or is it ...just bigger has to be better ..and I will admit I fall into that trap often. I might suggest you go to a range / put 25 shells of "OO" buck thru a 10ga and 25 shells thru a 12ga ...and see which one you like the best.

jbaham · June 21, 2010, 12:34 PM

I personally own 2 10 ga guns a browning bps 10 ga and a remington sp-10 10 ga shotgun. They are both fairly heavy. the recoil is not bad in the sp-10. the browning also is not super bad but look into getting a gun for the specific purpose that you want it for. If you have to have a 10 ga then the remington sp-10 is probably the best route to go but expect to pay at least 1300-1400. I paid 1700 for the model with the thumbhole stock and this is my turkey gun. These 2 guns I have weigh in around 11 lbs.

jbaham

Rampant_Colt · June 21, 2010, 01:55 PM

For pure intimidation value i suggest an Ithaca Roadblocker 10 gauge autoloader [i believe the Remington SP-10 is based on it]

photo courtesy of Ammo Oracle

10 gauge 3-1/2" magnum shotshell capacity:

12-pellet 0000 buckshot
14-pellet 000 buckshot
18-pellet 00 buckshot
24-pellet 1 buckshot
54-pellet 4 buckshot
766gr slugs 1-3/4oz

not for the faint of heart LoL

JNewell · June 21, 2010, 02:08 PM

I'd reconsider, if only because the most effective defensive loads around, by a large margin, are loaded in 12 gauge. With a 10 gauge, I'd guess you are going to wind up handloading with inferior components (I am thinking especially of the wad) or shooting duck/goose loads. Twelve gauge "tactical"/low recoil loads are more than enough for any defensive application that doesn't involve shooting through walls or vehicles, honestly.

darkgael · June 21, 2010, 02:39 PM

Are there any 10 gauge O/Us to be had?
Pete

BigJimP · June 21, 2010, 02:44 PM

I think he should look around for an 8 ga ......( in a coach gun ...) ....

**Mike Irwin** · June 21, 2010, 03:27 PM

Dave,

I was on the receiving end of both barrels of an old SxS 10 gauge going off at the same time. I'm still kind of hazy on what happened (hell, I'm hazy about the whole frigging day), but I either tripped both triggers at the same time somehow, or the recoil from the first barrel dislodged the hammer on the second one.

All I know is that there was this HUGE ringing in my ears, new and unexplored universes of stars circling my head, and blood running out of my nose where my wrist, or the shotgun's wrist, had smashed into it.

Of course, my friends, being the concerned 20somethings that we all were back then, were busy staining their shorts yellow they were laughing so hard.

Of course, none of them were brave enough (or stupid enough) to load both barrels after that.

Dave McC · June 21, 2010, 10:38 PM

I'm glad you survived, Mike. I had a Parker 20 gauge double on me and found it unpleasant, though an order of magnitude less than what you describe.

A 10 doubling in PGC will probably register on the seismograph at College Park.

mike6975 · June 22, 2010, 02:27 PM

i thought i'd throw the 10ga. o/u out there to get responses(and did)many thanks guys.i like the remmi sp-10,and was wondering why our armed forces guy didn't utilize these more at roadblocks/checkpoints?,yes,there is more "specialized" ammo for the 12ga.,but couldn't those same man. do the same for the 10ga.?especially to utilize in a anti-material/disabiling manner on cars and trucks.doesn't "duplot" or something similar make a galv.steel lathed 12ga. round that is vicious?,a 10ga. like that would be even more devastating,or anything creative that they could come up with nowadays.and with "blackhawks recoil reducing stocks/muzzlebreaks/porting barrels,we could make it manageable for even smaller framed individuals nowadays.

Respectfully,

mike

(thank you again for everyones input,you are some of the nicest,non-arrogant men i've dealt with on the forums yet.)

JNewell · June 22, 2010, 02:38 PM

They have things like Ma Deuce and SAWs for roadblocks and the like (I am not being funny), and these are far more effective than a 10-ga shotgun would ever be.

Part of the weakness in your line of thinking is that there's sort of no terminal point, no?

8 gauge would be better than 10 gauge...4 gauge would be better than 8 gauge...but pretty soon you need a tripod or a wheels kit...

...one of the great virtues of 12 gauge is that it is so incredibly flexible and offers more than adequate performance for a wide range of uses.

Just a thought!

June 20, 2010, 11:07 PM	#4
Rampant_Colt Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 2006 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 1,478	surely you can't be serious why a 10ga? why an over & under? wouldn't an exposed-hammer SxS be cooler? both kick like the proverbial mule and are not well-suited for home defense also buckshot for bad guys - birdshot for birdies - repeat __________________ member of an elite paramilitary organization: Eagle Scouts

June 21, 2010, 12:04 AM	#5
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	I agree, there is no point. Over Unders are used mostly for shooting clays and birds. The can be used for other things, but generally aren't. As for the recoil question, you can have a 20 gauge kick much harder than a 12 gauge and vice versa, it totally depends on what load you are shooting and out of what gun. Just buy a pump or semi... PS- my names not Surely __________________ There is no such thing as a stupid question, only stupid people.

June 21, 2010, 01:55 PM	#9
Rampant_Colt Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 2006 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 1,478	For pure intimidation value i suggest an Ithaca Roadblocker 10 gauge autoloader [i believe the Remington SP-10 is based on it] photo courtesy of Ammo Oracle 10 gauge 3-1/2" magnum shotshell capacity: 12-pellet 0000 buckshot 14-pellet 000 buckshot 18-pellet 00 buckshot 24-pellet 1 buckshot 54-pellet 4 buckshot 766gr slugs 1-3/4oz not for the faint of heart LoL __________________ member of an elite paramilitary organization: Eagle Scouts

June 21, 2010, 02:39 PM	#11
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	10 Are there any 10 gauge O/Us to be had? Pete __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

June 21, 2010, 03:27 PM	#13
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,388	Dave, I was on the receiving end of both barrels of an old SxS 10 gauge going off at the same time. I'm still kind of hazy on what happened (hell, I'm hazy about the whole frigging day), but I either tripped both triggers at the same time somehow, or the recoil from the first barrel dislodged the hammer on the second one. All I know is that there was this HUGE ringing in my ears, new and unexplored universes of stars circling my head, and blood running out of my nose where my wrist, or the shotgun's wrist, had smashed into it. Of course, my friends, being the concerned 20somethings that we all were back then, were busy staining their shorts yellow they were laughing so hard. Of course, none of them were brave enough (or stupid enough) to load both barrels after that. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

June 20, 2010, 05:24 PM	#1
mike6975 Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2008 Posts: 104	10ga. o/u shotgun i would like to make one for a home defense,has anyone done this,and what mods if any have you done?.also doesn't the 12ga. 3-1/2" magnum kick harder than the 10ga.?,or is that a myth?.any feedback woul be appreciated. Respectfully, mike

June 20, 2010, 06:50 PM	#2
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Given equivalent (same load, same velocity) ammo, a 10-ga may have less kick than a 12-ga 3-1/2" because a 10-ga gun is typically heaver than a 12 and the 10-ga loads operate a lower pressures. As I mentioned in Low recoil 12 gauge ammo? #17: Lower pressures equate to less acceleration, less acceleration means a longer internal event time, and a longer event time means less perceived recoil, or kick. In other words, for loads to be equivalent, the charges leave the barrels at the same velocity; however, one load took longer in the barrel to get up to speed. That's the load that will kick less.

June 20, 2010, 09:22 PM	#3
Scottmkiv Member Join Date: December 10, 2002 Posts: 28	Why not just get a semi-auto or pump and get more capacity?

June 21, 2010, 10:42 AM	#6
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	It can be done,Mike. But...... Even a 28 gauge packs enough ME to be a good HD tool, and the 10 kicks hard in any configuration. 10s also tend to be ponderous and slow to handle. Long ago, a gunsmith/mad scientist I knew sawed off a Greener SxS 10 and l loaded up some BP loads in all brass 2 7/8" cases using .375" round balls. Call it 5/0 buck. We fired off some and marveled at the ensuing damage. It kicked harder than the 375 H&H we also fired that day. IMO, not worth the hassle.....

June 21, 2010, 11:44 AM	#7
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	I think considering a 10ga - O/U, pump or semi-auto ... is a huge mistake ... I think you'll end up with a lot more recoil than you want / and the whole idea just isn't going to be very effecitve ....vs any number of 12ga options - if you really think you need a defensive shotgun. I don't subscribe to the idea that everyone needs a "tactical shotgun" ...but if you want one / then you should get one...but there are so many good options in a 12ga pump or semi-auto ...why go the 10ga route ?? I guess I'd like to hear what you're trying to accomplish with a 10ga that a 12ga won't do in your opinion / or is it ...just bigger has to be better ..and I will admit I fall into that trap often. I might suggest you go to a range / put 25 shells of "OO" buck thru a 10ga and 25 shells thru a 12ga ...and see which one you like the best.

June 21, 2010, 12:34 PM	#8
jbaham Junior member Join Date: March 13, 2010 Posts: 34	I personally own 2 10 ga guns a browning bps 10 ga and a remington sp-10 10 ga shotgun. They are both fairly heavy. the recoil is not bad in the sp-10. the browning also is not super bad but look into getting a gun for the specific purpose that you want it for. If you have to have a 10 ga then the remington sp-10 is probably the best route to go but expect to pay at least 1300-1400. I paid 1700 for the model with the thumbhole stock and this is my turkey gun. These 2 guns I have weigh in around 11 lbs. jbaham

June 21, 2010, 02:08 PM	#10
JNewell Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2000 Posts: 1,092	I'd reconsider, if only because the most effective defensive loads around, by a large margin, are loaded in 12 gauge. With a 10 gauge, I'd guess you are going to wind up handloading with inferior components (I am thinking especially of the wad) or shooting duck/goose loads. Twelve gauge "tactical"/low recoil loads are more than enough for any defensive application that doesn't involve shooting through walls or vehicles, honestly.

June 21, 2010, 02:44 PM	#12
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	I think he should look around for an 8 ga ......( in a coach gun ...) ....

June 21, 2010, 10:38 PM	#14
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	I'm glad you survived, Mike. I had a Parker 20 gauge double on me and found it unpleasant, though an order of magnitude less than what you describe. A 10 doubling in PGC will probably register on the seismograph at College Park.

June 22, 2010, 02:27 PM	#15
mike6975 Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2008 Posts: 104	replies i thought i'd throw the 10ga. o/u out there to get responses(and did)many thanks guys.i like the remmi sp-10,and was wondering why our armed forces guy didn't utilize these more at roadblocks/checkpoints?,yes,there is more "specialized" ammo for the 12ga.,but couldn't those same man. do the same for the 10ga.?especially to utilize in a anti-material/disabiling manner on cars and trucks.doesn't "duplot" or something similar make a galv.steel lathed 12ga. round that is vicious?,a 10ga. like that would be even more devastating,or anything creative that they could come up with nowadays.and with "blackhawks recoil reducing stocks/muzzlebreaks/porting barrels,we could make it manageable for even smaller framed individuals nowadays. Respectfully, mike (thank you again for everyones input,you are some of the nicest,non-arrogant men i've dealt with on the forums yet.)

June 22, 2010, 02:38 PM	#16
JNewell Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2000 Posts: 1,092	They have things like Ma Deuce and SAWs for roadblocks and the like (I am not being funny), and these are far more effective than a 10-ga shotgun would ever be. Part of the weakness in your line of thinking is that there's sort of no terminal point, no? 8 gauge would be better than 10 gauge...4 gauge would be better than 8 gauge...but pretty soon you need a tripod or a wheels kit......one of the great virtues of 12 gauge is that it is so incredibly flexible and offers more than adequate performance for a wide range of uses. Just a thought!