looking to reload for the first time, what do i need?

Rogueone · October 18, 2007, 10:37 AM

Hi,

So a friend and I are looking to split the costs of setting up a reloading operation for our rapidly growing shooting. And we need advice as to what all we need besides just a press

Thanks to people here, we are settling on the Dillon 650 press. I plan to get all the automated accessories, like the case feeders, bullet feeders etc., so the process becomes as automated as possible once I'm comfortable with it (I'll be the one doing the reloading which is why I keep saying I and not we

)

We'll likely be getting some new or once fired, precleaned brass, but also have access to buckets of brass from our club range. And we will be shooing mainly glocks, with some M&P, Taurus 24/7 Pro, and some 1911's. Mainly 9mm right now, but we are looking at likely picking up Glock 35's to use in competition, as it looks like reloading .40 and 9mm is only about .005 or .01 difference per bullet. And everyone says we need to get into major PF for USPSA, so the g35 allows us to load Major for those matches while also loading minor for IDPA

But I've read some comments, several years old though, about how Glock stock barrels don't support the brass well and cause a "bulge" that impacts reloading. I don't quite know what this is nor how noticeable, but the brass my g19 gen 4 ejects doesn't look funny in any way, so is it something I wouldn't notice being a novice, or has Glock maybe redesigned their barrels?

So, with that in mind, we'll be using plenty of used brass, so how much work do we need to do to get that brass ready for reloading? Do we need a machine for cleaning the brass? and for ejecting used primers, is there something special we need? That's something the press does or doesn't do?

Basically, I don't want to get to the point we figure out our costs, order the press and dies, then find out we need $300 more stuff we didn't know about

As to why not get a single stage first, don't want to waste the money. I'll run the 650 very slow and step by step at first as i get used to it, but once I'm up to speed, I need to reload for 4 people, so a single stage just isn't going to cut it, and we want to get this press over the winter for next year's competition season. I've always been the handy worker type, whether it be building computers, or replacing the engine in my car, so I'm not worried about reloading being hard, just that I do it right

So any help would be much appreciated, so we can lay out a list of items to procure and we can know how much to set aside for this initial cost along with the bullets and powder and such.

totalloser · October 19, 2007, 11:59 PM

I would say buy a few good books before you get started. I really like the Lee "Modern Reloading" Very informative, lots of load specs. They toot their horn a bit, but in my experience, it's justified.
I am really happy with my Load master. Buy a kit, and everything is there. Just need components to get started.
It is really handy to have a second press (especially a turret) for dealing with pulling bullets/dealing with goofs. It WILL happen no matter how slow and careful you are.
Lots of little parts and pieces to keep working properly, takes a while to get it down, but pistol stuff is a lot easier.
Read up first. Save yourself a lot of headache. I'm rolling out 900 .223 per hour and about 1500 .40 with my setup. Fairly good accuracy, but my volume requires a going over to watch for goofed primers and such. Really accurate pistol ammo.
I have read the Glock bulge thing, and didn't really see much. I have 2, and have been blasting .40 and .375 sig homebrews, and haven't seen a problem. I only do factory loads, tho.
You don't NEED a tumbler and seperator, but they are nice for cleaning up nasty looking brass.
I'm gonna get roasted for this, but I would get the loadmaster first. Cheap experiment. You gotta keep on top of all the little adjustments, but the flexibility of this machine is REALLY cool. 5 stages; 1. lube/decap/insert 2.prime 3.charge/flare 4.seat 5.factory crimp.
With rifle it seems to be better to just have one turret for processing brass, and one for loading. I really like the rcbs x sizers combined with the Dillon trimmer. NEVER have deal with the brass. That is the worst job. Lee says pistol brass is pretty much a waste of time to trim. Wears out before it stretches far enough to cause trouble.
Boy, I really went off. Get some books. Best advice I could ever give.

Silentarmy · October 20, 2007, 12:57 AM

Here comes the fire for the last poster!

I'm kidding!
You will absolutely Love the 650! I ended up spending well over a Grand to get it ready though! There are so many parts you can buy for it that will simplify life so here you go.
Start with you 650 and choose the setup in one of the calibers you intend to load. (it comes with one conversion kit in your choice of caliber.) $485.95
Case feeder. Very nice indeed but don't forget casefeed plates as they are different for large and small pistol as well as large and small rifle $194.95 + extra plates @ $36.95 each
You will need Toolheads for each caliber. $20.95 each or $19.29 in 3 pack. You will waste more than twice this amount of $$ in time Dicking with your dies if you only have one toolhead so pony up for as many as you need!
Primer tubes and a pickup tray are necessary (yes, they are) you will find yourself cursing profanity without them $6.95 each or $17.95 for a 4 pack of each primer size (2) The tray is $14.95
Conversion Kits for each caliber you intend to load (only one caliber comes with the press.$69.95 each caliber.
Dies. You can use other brands of dies with this press but why? Dillon dies are $57.95 and include a taper crimp die. Combination seat/crimp dies are junk and will make a hell of a mess if you load cast bullets. I personally like a powder die for each toolhead/caliber and at $8.95 each, once again, what is your time worth to you?
Now for optional accessories. The Strong mount is optional but in my opinion necessary! It puts your press at correct height and mounts it securely which is worth the cost $36.95. Aluminum roller handle is the cats meow. Comfort is key and you can certainly wear a blister on your strong hand with the stock ball handle. $37.95. Aluminum Bullet tray. Puts the bullets right where you need them to set them on the case for seating (the only thing this press won't do for you). $35.95. Low powder sensor is kinda cool i guess but if you can't see that youre running low(its right in front of your face) then you are loading too fast and that is dangerous and stupid.
Scale. You will need a scale whether it be a balance or digital to weigh your powder charge. This is Very important so don't go cheap! I have an expensive digital but a balance is more reliable and less effected by air current or temperature/vibration. $49.95 Dillon Eliminator or $139.95 digital D-terminator.
Expect to spend about $1200.00 to get set up for 3 calibers without the powder sensor! Now before you clutch your chest with sticker shock, think of loading more of a single caliber in an hour (1000-1400) than you will shoot in a weekend! Unless you have a huge ammo budget! Read a few books as suggested to grasp the concept and the dillon instructions will take you from there! They are very detailed and if all else fails, their tech support and warranty is above all. Lastly, if you ever decide to sell the "Blue stuff", I have seen 10 yr old setups sell for within a few dollars of new retail (even considering price increases) on ebay. You can't lose man!

totalloser · October 22, 2007, 12:18 AM

Lots of good advice. Just thought I should have mentioned that those #s I quoted were when all the little doodads are working right. And I have a lot of goodies to make it go fast. Gotta have 'em to go fast-more time working less time reloading! Can't believe the wife went for that one!
One thing I really like about the Loadmaster over other stuff is the primer handling. I have no experience with the quality of other machines, though. Maybe mine is junkier than I know...

Rogueone · October 22, 2007, 08:50 AM

wow thanks, nice advice. gotta say I wasn't expecting it to be twice the press or more to get fully setup

Guess i'll need to order those books since it's still a couple months before we plan to look at buying the gear.

Army mentioned the one thing the 650 didn't do, and it sounded like that was it doesn't set the bullet in place? Is that normal? I suppose once I read the books I'll have a better understanding huh

haha

CrustyFN · October 22, 2007, 05:37 PM

I don't own one but from people I know, it will cost $1,000 to $1,400 to get one set up with all of the extras.
Rusty

swmike · October 23, 2007, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Army mentioned the one thing the 650 didn't do, and it sounded like that was it doesn't set the bullet in place? Is that normal? I suppose once I read the books I'll have a better understanding huh haha

It's pretty much standard for a press like the Dillon 650 to still require that the bullet be set by hand. You can buy a K.I.S.S. Bullet feeder for about $550 that will set a bullet in place. Then all you have to do is pull the handle.

I have an XL-650 and still prefer to set a bullet in place by hand. It gives me a moment to check that there is powder in the case when loading my 9mm. It doesn't really slow me down as I can go through a tube of primers (100) in just a few minutes. I bolted the XL-650 with case feeder set up for 9mm for $1,000 from Brian Enos (www.brianenos.com). Another $100 got me set up for .223.

totalloser · October 24, 2007, 12:41 AM

I could have got a bullet feeder for my Loadmaster, but since you have to place it in a tube, why not just place it on a shell? I don't think it really saves any time once you figure loading the tubes. Now a CASE feeder, I couldn't live without THAT! Plus it's more widgets to adjust & screw up. Just my view on it.

October 18, 2007, 10:37 AM	#1
Rogueone Senior Member Join Date: July 12, 2007 Location: Northern Virginia, DC Metro area Posts: 204	looking to reload for the first time, what do i need? Hi, So a friend and I are looking to split the costs of setting up a reloading operation for our rapidly growing shooting. And we need advice as to what all we need besides just a press Thanks to people here, we are settling on the Dillon 650 press. I plan to get all the automated accessories, like the case feeders, bullet feeders etc., so the process becomes as automated as possible once I'm comfortable with it (I'll be the one doing the reloading which is why I keep saying I and not we ) We'll likely be getting some new or once fired, precleaned brass, but also have access to buckets of brass from our club range. And we will be shooing mainly glocks, with some M&P, Taurus 24/7 Pro, and some 1911's. Mainly 9mm right now, but we are looking at likely picking up Glock 35's to use in competition, as it looks like reloading .40 and 9mm is only about .005 or .01 difference per bullet. And everyone says we need to get into major PF for USPSA, so the g35 allows us to load Major for those matches while also loading minor for IDPA But I've read some comments, several years old though, about how Glock stock barrels don't support the brass well and cause a "bulge" that impacts reloading. I don't quite know what this is nor how noticeable, but the brass my g19 gen 4 ejects doesn't look funny in any way, so is it something I wouldn't notice being a novice, or has Glock maybe redesigned their barrels? So, with that in mind, we'll be using plenty of used brass, so how much work do we need to do to get that brass ready for reloading? Do we need a machine for cleaning the brass? and for ejecting used primers, is there something special we need? That's something the press does or doesn't do? Basically, I don't want to get to the point we figure out our costs, order the press and dies, then find out we need $300 more stuff we didn't know about As to why not get a single stage first, don't want to waste the money. I'll run the 650 very slow and step by step at first as i get used to it, but once I'm up to speed, I need to reload for 4 people, so a single stage just isn't going to cut it, and we want to get this press over the winter for next year's competition season. I've always been the handy worker type, whether it be building computers, or replacing the engine in my car, so I'm not worried about reloading being hard, just that I do it right So any help would be much appreciated, so we can lay out a list of items to procure and we can know how much to set aside for this initial cost along with the bullets and powder and such.

October 20, 2007, 12:57 AM	#3
Silentarmy Senior Member Join Date: August 13, 2007 Location: Bountiful, Utah Posts: 355	Blue Press Here comes the fire for the last poster! I'm kidding! You will absolutely Love the 650! I ended up spending well over a Grand to get it ready though! There are so many parts you can buy for it that will simplify life so here you go. Start with you 650 and choose the setup in one of the calibers you intend to load. (it comes with one conversion kit in your choice of caliber.) $485.95 Case feeder. Very nice indeed but don't forget casefeed plates as they are different for large and small pistol as well as large and small rifle $194.95 + extra plates @ $36.95 each You will need Toolheads for each caliber. $20.95 each or $19.29 in 3 pack. You will waste more than twice this amount of $$ in time Dicking with your dies if you only have one toolhead so pony up for as many as you need! Primer tubes and a pickup tray are necessary (yes, they are) you will find yourself cursing profanity without them $6.95 each or $17.95 for a 4 pack of each primer size (2) The tray is $14.95 Conversion Kits for each caliber you intend to load (only one caliber comes with the press.$69.95 each caliber. Dies. You can use other brands of dies with this press but why? Dillon dies are $57.95 and include a taper crimp die. Combination seat/crimp dies are junk and will make a hell of a mess if you load cast bullets. I personally like a powder die for each toolhead/caliber and at $8.95 each, once again, what is your time worth to you? Now for optional accessories. The Strong mount is optional but in my opinion necessary! It puts your press at correct height and mounts it securely which is worth the cost $36.95. Aluminum roller handle is the cats meow. Comfort is key and you can certainly wear a blister on your strong hand with the stock ball handle. $37.95. Aluminum Bullet tray. Puts the bullets right where you need them to set them on the case for seating (the only thing this press won't do for you). $35.95. Low powder sensor is kinda cool i guess but if you can't see that youre running low(its right in front of your face) then you are loading too fast and that is dangerous and stupid. Scale. You will need a scale whether it be a balance or digital to weigh your powder charge. This is Very important so don't go cheap! I have an expensive digital but a balance is more reliable and less effected by air current or temperature/vibration. $49.95 Dillon Eliminator or $139.95 digital D-terminator. Expect to spend about $1200.00 to get set up for 3 calibers without the powder sensor! Now before you clutch your chest with sticker shock, think of loading more of a single caliber in an hour (1000-1400) than you will shoot in a weekend! Unless you have a huge ammo budget! Read a few books as suggested to grasp the concept and the dillon instructions will take you from there! They are very detailed and if all else fails, their tech support and warranty is above all. Lastly, if you ever decide to sell the "Blue stuff", I have seen 10 yr old setups sell for within a few dollars of new retail (even considering price increases) on ebay. You can't lose man! __________________ "No one will Ever buy that PLASTIC gun!" Steve Gallenson, Early 1980's "Those Who live by the sword get Shot by those of us who don't" "What we learn from History is that we do not learn from History!"

October 22, 2007, 05:37 PM	#6
CrustyFN Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2006 Location: West Virginia Posts: 2,258	I don't own one but from people I know, it will cost $1,000 to $1,400 to get one set up with all of the extras. Rusty __________________ I don't ever remember being absent minded.

October 19, 2007, 11:59 PM	#2
totalloser Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2007 Location: Fort Bragg, CA Posts: 679	I would say buy a few good books before you get started. I really like the Lee "Modern Reloading" Very informative, lots of load specs. They toot their horn a bit, but in my experience, it's justified. I am really happy with my Load master. Buy a kit, and everything is there. Just need components to get started. It is really handy to have a second press (especially a turret) for dealing with pulling bullets/dealing with goofs. It WILL happen no matter how slow and careful you are. Lots of little parts and pieces to keep working properly, takes a while to get it down, but pistol stuff is a lot easier. Read up first. Save yourself a lot of headache. I'm rolling out 900 .223 per hour and about 1500 .40 with my setup. Fairly good accuracy, but my volume requires a going over to watch for goofed primers and such. Really accurate pistol ammo. I have read the Glock bulge thing, and didn't really see much. I have 2, and have been blasting .40 and .375 sig homebrews, and haven't seen a problem. I only do factory loads, tho. You don't NEED a tumbler and seperator, but they are nice for cleaning up nasty looking brass. I'm gonna get roasted for this, but I would get the loadmaster first. Cheap experiment. You gotta keep on top of all the little adjustments, but the flexibility of this machine is REALLY cool. 5 stages; 1. lube/decap/insert 2.prime 3.charge/flare 4.seat 5.factory crimp. With rifle it seems to be better to just have one turret for processing brass, and one for loading. I really like the rcbs x sizers combined with the Dillon trimmer. NEVER have deal with the brass. That is the worst job. Lee says pistol brass is pretty much a waste of time to trim. Wears out before it stretches far enough to cause trouble. Boy, I really went off. Get some books. Best advice I could ever give.

October 22, 2007, 12:18 AM	#4
totalloser Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2007 Location: Fort Bragg, CA Posts: 679	Lots of good advice. Just thought I should have mentioned that those #s I quoted were when all the little doodads are working right. And I have a lot of goodies to make it go fast. Gotta have 'em to go fast-more time working less time reloading! Can't believe the wife went for that one! One thing I really like about the Loadmaster over other stuff is the primer handling. I have no experience with the quality of other machines, though. Maybe mine is junkier than I know...

October 22, 2007, 08:50 AM	#5
Rogueone Senior Member Join Date: July 12, 2007 Location: Northern Virginia, DC Metro area Posts: 204	wow thanks, nice advice. gotta say I wasn't expecting it to be twice the press or more to get fully setup Guess i'll need to order those books since it's still a couple months before we plan to look at buying the gear. Army mentioned the one thing the 650 didn't do, and it sounded like that was it doesn't set the bullet in place? Is that normal? I suppose once I read the books I'll have a better understanding huh haha

October 24, 2007, 12:41 AM	#8
totalloser Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2007 Location: Fort Bragg, CA Posts: 679	I could have got a bullet feeder for my Loadmaster, but since you have to place it in a tube, why not just place it on a shell? I don't think it really saves any time once you figure loading the tubes. Now a CASE feeder, I couldn't live without THAT! Plus it's more widgets to adjust & screw up. Just my view on it.