6.5 Arisaka ammo

tahunua001 · December 2, 2012, 12:23 PM

hello all,
I am currently negotiating the trade of one of my rifles and a gentleman on armslist has offered a pair of arisakas in trade. one is a type 99 which I have been looking for for some time and the other is a type 44 carbine which I am not particularly looking for however with the relatively low numbers it was made in I feel as if I would be a fool to pass up on the opportunity to own one. I see that it uses a standard 6.5 round .264 diameter so reloading components would not be hard to to come by however pre loaded or current production brass are very hard to locate. midway advertises norma but it has been discontinued and is out of stock and there are no other places I'm seeing any online. anybody know where a feller could find brass and reloading data for this round?

Tidewater_Kid · December 2, 2012, 12:58 PM

I think Gun Broker is your best bet.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=318977231

TK

**Mike Irwin** · December 2, 2012, 04:40 PM

Privi Partizan, or PPU, is loading a lot of the old military rifle cartridges.

A friend and I were at a rather crappy local gunshow today and the one dealer had a bunch...

Crud. I just checked their website and they don't list it.

Graf and Sons lists both PPU and Norma brass -- Norma is in stock, PPU is not.

http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/...ategoryId/700?

tahunua001 · December 2, 2012, 04:44 PM

thanks Mike. PRVI was my first stop as they were my only option when I was researching 7.5 french and 8.56R hungarian ammo. apparently they have made it in the past as there is some PRVI 6.5 being sold on gunbroker but it is not in their current catalog and none of the usual carriers of PRVI are listing any 6.5 jap ammo. I never thought about grafs though. I'll check them out.

EDIT: Grafs also has a number of brands of pre loaded listed including hornady, wasn't expecting that but all of them are out of stock.

Pukindog · December 2, 2012, 05:31 PM

You can make it from .35 Remington brass. Run the .35's through a 6.5 jap die and you have it. It will be a tad short but it will function just fine. Use a reduced load to fire form the first time.

Jeff

Famas · December 2, 2012, 05:42 PM

Didn't Norma manufacture Japanese rifle ammunition in the not-so-distant past?

tahunua001 · December 2, 2012, 11:08 PM

that information was already in the OP, FAMAS.

running 35 remington brass through a 6.5x50 die? I know very little about making my own brass but that sounds deceptively simple. is it really as easy as just ramming it through or is there other stuff involved?

F. Guffey · December 3, 2012, 05:09 AM

Deceptive? If we are talking about using 35 Remington cases when forming 6.5mm50 cases I would be concerned with the .010” difference in case head diameter.

Then there is the Model 99, the bore diameter is .311”, not 6.5mm (6.5mm50 fits the Model 38), if we are talking about a model 99 we should be talking about forming 7.7mm58 from 30/06.

I use a 308 Winchester form/trim die to form 7.7 cases. Using the 308 W forming/trim die is deceptively simple........for me, reloaders believe it is too short to form long cases, goes back to that old saying, “it is one thing to know how to hammer, it is another matter when knowing where to hammer”.

“other stuff involved?” Yes, I am not the fan of repeating what I have heard on the Internet, There is 21” of brass to trim when forming 100 7.7mm57 cases from 30/06, I use the man tool, the hack saw, when used with a forming tool trimming is simple and almost effortless.

F. Guffey

Pukindog · December 3, 2012, 08:06 AM

The .010 difference in the head diameter does not make a concernable difference except when forming and reloading the brass. Make sure you use a .35 Rem shell holder. I have shot my Type 38 hundreds of times with this brass and it works just fine. I also keep it separate from the "real" 6.6 Jap brass.
If you have any concerns don't do it.

Jeff

F. Guffey · December 3, 2012, 11:52 AM

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/160...s-35-remington

35 Remington cases @.65 cents each ($65.00 per 100), my opinion, I would not use work hardened/fired cases, I would use new unfired brass.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/734...panese-arisaka

#58123 RCBS kit for forming 6.5mm50 Arisaka from 30/06 Group G price? $374.95

1 800 533 5000, order a special order catalog, it’s free.

F. Guffey

tahunua001 · December 3, 2012, 12:04 PM

I am well aware that the type 99 is 7.7 which is readily available from PRVI. I am inquiring about the type 44 which uses 6.5mm ammo.

James K · December 3, 2012, 05:31 PM

I have been told (I have not done it myself) that 6.5 Japanese cases can also be made from .30-40 Krag or .303 British by resizing and trimming and then reducing the rim diameter and thickness. Based on similar work I have done, the necks would also have to be reamed to prevent excess pressures.

Jim

**Mike Irwin** · December 3, 2012, 06:39 PM

Donnelly's book on cartridge conversions says to use the .270 and head swage it.

Yet, on the very next page, for the 6.5x52 Mannlicher Carcano, he says use the .220 Swift.

Given that the Italian and Japanese cartridges are VERY similar dimensionally, I don't see why you couldn't make a stab at using either .220 Swift OR even 6.5 Mannlicher cases.

The rim might be a bit small, but the Japanese rifles had quite a bit of bite so it might well work.

December 2, 2012, 12:23 PM	#1
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	6.5 Arisaka ammo hello all, I am currently negotiating the trade of one of my rifles and a gentleman on armslist has offered a pair of arisakas in trade. one is a type 99 which I have been looking for for some time and the other is a type 44 carbine which I am not particularly looking for however with the relatively low numbers it was made in I feel as if I would be a fool to pass up on the opportunity to own one. I see that it uses a standard 6.5 round .264 diameter so reloading components would not be hard to to come by however pre loaded or current production brass are very hard to locate. midway advertises norma but it has been discontinued and is out of stock and there are no other places I'm seeing any online. anybody know where a feller could find brass and reloading data for this round? __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

December 2, 2012, 04:40 PM	#3
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	Privi Partizan, or PPU, is loading a lot of the old military rifle cartridges. A friend and I were at a rather crappy local gunshow today and the one dealer had a bunch... Crud. I just checked their website and they don't list it. Graf and Sons lists both PPU and Norma brass -- Norma is in stock, PPU is not. http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/...ategoryId/700? __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

December 2, 2012, 04:44 PM	#4
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	thanks Mike. PRVI was my first stop as they were my only option when I was researching 7.5 french and 8.56R hungarian ammo. apparently they have made it in the past as there is some PRVI 6.5 being sold on gunbroker but it is not in their current catalog and none of the usual carriers of PRVI are listing any 6.5 jap ammo. I never thought about grafs though. I'll check them out. EDIT: Grafs also has a number of brands of pre loaded listed including hornady, wasn't expecting that but all of them are out of stock. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin Last edited by tahunua001; December 2, 2012 at 04:49 PM.

December 2, 2012, 11:08 PM	#7
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	that information was already in the OP, FAMAS. running 35 remington brass through a 6.5x50 die? I know very little about making my own brass but that sounds deceptively simple. is it really as easy as just ramming it through or is there other stuff involved? __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

December 3, 2012, 08:06 AM	#9
Pukindog Member Join Date: December 10, 2009 Posts: 90	6.5 Jap from .35 Rem brass The .010 difference in the head diameter does not make a concernable difference except when forming and reloading the brass. Make sure you use a .35 Rem shell holder. I have shot my Type 38 hundreds of times with this brass and it works just fine. I also keep it separate from the "real" 6.6 Jap brass. If you have any concerns don't do it. Jeff

December 2, 2012, 12:58 PM	#2
Tidewater_Kid Senior Member Join Date: July 3, 2005 Location: Alabama Posts: 925	I think Gun Broker is your best bet. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=318977231 TK

December 2, 2012, 05:31 PM	#5
Pukindog Member Join Date: December 10, 2009 Posts: 90	6.5 Japanese brass You can make it from .35 Remington brass. Run the .35's through a 6.5 jap die and you have it. It will be a tad short but it will function just fine. Use a reduced load to fire form the first time. Jeff

December 2, 2012, 05:42 PM	#6
Famas Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Location: French, currently living in US Posts: 162	Didn't Norma manufacture Japanese rifle ammunition in the not-so-distant past?

December 3, 2012, 05:09 AM	#8
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	Deceptive? If we are talking about using 35 Remington cases when forming 6.5mm50 cases I would be concerned with the .010” difference in case head diameter. Then there is the Model 99, the bore diameter is .311”, not 6.5mm (6.5mm50 fits the Model 38), if we are talking about a model 99 we should be talking about forming 7.7mm58 from 30/06. I use a 308 Winchester form/trim die to form 7.7 cases. Using the 308 W forming/trim die is deceptively simple........for me, reloaders believe it is too short to form long cases, goes back to that old saying, “it is one thing to know how to hammer, it is another matter when knowing where to hammer”. “other stuff involved?” Yes, I am not the fan of repeating what I have heard on the Internet, There is 21” of brass to trim when forming 100 7.7mm57 cases from 30/06, I use the man tool, the hack saw, when used with a forming tool trimming is simple and almost effortless. F. Guffey

December 3, 2012, 11:52 AM	#10
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	http://www.midwayusa.com/product/160...s-35-remington 35 Remington cases @.65 cents each ($65.00 per 100), my opinion, I would not use work hardened/fired cases, I would use new unfired brass. http://www.midwayusa.com/product/734...panese-arisaka #58123 RCBS kit for forming 6.5mm50 Arisaka from 30/06 Group G price? $374.95 1 800 533 5000, order a special order catalog, it’s free. F. Guffey

December 3, 2012, 12:04 PM	#11
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	I am well aware that the type 99 is 7.7 which is readily available from PRVI. I am inquiring about the type 44 which uses 6.5mm ammo. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

December 3, 2012, 05:31 PM	#12
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I have been told (I have not done it myself) that 6.5 Japanese cases can also be made from .30-40 Krag or .303 British by resizing and trimming and then reducing the rim diameter and thickness. Based on similar work I have done, the necks would also have to be reamed to prevent excess pressures. Jim

December 3, 2012, 06:39 PM	#13
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	Donnelly's book on cartridge conversions says to use the .270 and head swage it. Yet, on the very next page, for the 6.5x52 Mannlicher Carcano, he says use the .220 Swift. Given that the Italian and Japanese cartridges are VERY similar dimensionally, I don't see why you couldn't make a stab at using either .220 Swift OR even 6.5 Mannlicher cases. The rim might be a bit small, but the Japanese rifles had quite a bit of bite so it might well work. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

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