A good load for a .54 cal. Hawken

seadog28 · April 19, 2012, 03:44 PM

Hi All! I just purchased anice used .54 cal. Hawken by Hastings of Clay Center Ks and I was looking for some advice on a good load for this rifle. Round ball or conical? Black powder of Pyrodex? I'll probably just punch paper for a while but sure would appreciate any help.

I've built two Kentucky flinters in .45 cal. but it's been 20 years since I messed with muzzle loaders. I feel the need to go back to the basics.

Thanks, seadog28

Hawg · April 19, 2012, 03:55 PM

The gun will decide what load it likes. I use 90 grains of Pyrodex RS with a .530 round ball and a .010 patch. Mine has a 1:66 twist. A 1:48 is decent with round ball or conical but not best for either. Anything faster will be conical only.

capper · April 19, 2012, 04:30 PM

Hawg is right. Your rifle will decide what it likes. I have a .56 cal T/C Renegade,smoothebore,that I shoot .54 cal rb's thru,and it loves em'. It doesn't care much for conicals,but I get real good groupings @ 100 yds. with the rb's. I use 100 gr Pyrodex RS,with .530 round ball,and .010 patch. Hope this helps.

seadog28 · April 20, 2012, 04:39 PM

Thanks guys for the info. I am not sure what the rate of twist is for the Hastings barrel, can't seem to find out much info on the hastings Hawkens. I'll report my results as soon as I can get to the range.

Hawg · April 20, 2012, 04:45 PM

Put a tight fitting patch on your ramrod jag and push it to the bottom of the bore. mark the rod at the muzzle even with the front sight, Pull it out letting it turn with the rifling until you get a half turn. Mark it again and measure between the marks. Multiply X 2 and you will be pretty close to actual twist. Or you can do a quarter turn and multiply X 4.

LAH · April 21, 2012, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Hawg is right. Your rifle will decide what it likes. I have a .56 cal T/C Renegade,smoothebore,that I shoot .54 cal rb's thru,and it loves em'. It doesn't care much for conicals,but I get real good groupings @ 100 yds. with the rb's. I use 100 gr Pyrodex RS,with .530 round ball,and .010 patch. Hope this helps.

What is considered good groups @ 100 yards with these smoothebores? I have no experience with these.

Hawg · April 21, 2012, 03:41 PM

A Hawken is not a smooth bore. With a slow twist and a round ball I wouldn't quit till I got at least two inch groups.

LAH · April 21, 2012, 08:59 PM

Quote:

A Hawken is not a smooth bore

Yes I understand but you said:

Quote:

I have a .56 cal T/C Renegade,smoothebore,that I shoot .54 cal rb's thru,and it loves em'. It doesn't care much for conicals,but I get real good groupings @ 100 yds. with the rb's. I use 100 gr Pyrodex RS,with .530 round ball,and .010 patch

I was wondering what real good groupings were at 100 yards from the .56 cal T/C Renegade smoothebore?

Sure Shot Mc Gee · April 21, 2012, 09:48 PM

Quote:

LAH

You might want to check with a guy named Beagle333. He has a 56 smothie too from what I understand.

Hawg · April 21, 2012, 10:16 PM

My bad. FWIW it was Capper with the smooth bore.

Sure Shot Mc Gee · April 21, 2012, 11:23 PM

Quote:

.54 cal. Hawken by Hastings of Clay Center Ks

Question: seadog28: Is this the same manufacture that makes Hastings rifled shotgun barrels too? As I've been unable to find hardly any info about your B/P rifles twist rate for some reason?

capper · April 22, 2012, 01:01 AM

LAH,I average 3"-4" groups @ 100 yds.My eyes are not what they used to be,but I put out a 9" paper plate with a 3" orange dot in the center,and 4 out of 5 will land in,or touch that circle,darn near every time. That's good enough for me.I have also spent a lot of time at the range with all of my weapons,so I have gotten to know them quite well. I feel that is probably why I shoot them well.

LAH · April 22, 2012, 09:21 AM

Thanks Capper. Never owned a smooth bore rifle but always wanted one. Do you cast your own RBs?

Beagle333 · April 22, 2012, 10:25 AM

I have a .56 smoothie.

It is quite fun!! I can't help with data on the 100 yard groups. My range here is only 50 yards, but I can't tell a difference in rifling vs. no rifling at that distance. Several others have told me that it matters more when you get past 70 yards, but I can't personally verify that.
I have been using 70 grains of Pyrodex P (because it's what I have) with a .550 round ball.

seadog28 · April 22, 2012, 11:49 AM

Yes, Sure Shot the gun was made by the shotgun barrel maker. As I understand it they were supposed to do a run of 1000 especially for Cabelas but only wound up making 250. I think that was back in the late 90's. It is a very high quality rifle with browned furniture and barrel and a curly maple stock. It is in the original hawken style. Looks are good but if it doesn't shoot it's only wood and metal.

Hawg · April 22, 2012, 12:30 PM

Got pics?

Sure Shot Mc Gee · April 22, 2012, 12:54 PM

Quote:

It is a very high quality rifle

Well we got one piece of the puzzle solved. Is it a cap or flinter? Your original post doesn't say. I don't know for sure Seadog28. Maybe Haug Haggen does. On a flintlock. If one were to pull its vent liner. Could a bright light show its bore condition providing it has a pretty clean breech area not needing to be scraped? Otherwise a simple drop down its barrel type of bore light is required. It sure would be nice to try it out._

capper · April 22, 2012, 02:57 PM

No LAH, I don't cast my own rb's.(not yet anyway) Someday, I would like to try my hand at it.

Hawg · April 22, 2012, 03:47 PM

If it's a rendition of a true Hawken it's percussion. There's only one original Hawken flinter known to exist and none referred to historically. Not to my knowledge anyway. There probably were a few more but given the low production numbers of the percussion's I doubt it would have more than a handful if that many.

Rifleman1776 · April 23, 2012, 08:41 AM

Quote:

I average 3"-4" groups @ 100 yds.My eyes are not what they used to be

Capper, that is top notch championship shooting. I'll bet you are the record holder for every big match coast to coast. What were your groups when your eyes were good? Must have been one hole.
Is that bench rest or offhand shooting you are talking about?
I know even the bench rest guys with the big guns often don't group like that.
Is your house big enough to hold all your trophies?

capper · April 23, 2012, 08:50 AM

Ok Rifleman 1776. Maybe my memory is fading like my eyes.Groupings are in actuallity, more in the 6"-9" range. I get better accuracy with my T/C Encore,209/50,w/320gr. maxi-ball.MY bad.

Hawg · April 23, 2012, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Capper, that is top notch championship shooting. I'll bet you are the record holder for every big match coast to coast. What were your groups when your eyes were good? Must have been one hole.
Is that bench rest or offhand shooting you are talking about?
I know even the bench rest guys with the big guns often don't group like that.
Is your house big enough to hold all your trophies?

I can do better than that with my Hawken benched and I dang sure ain't no competitor.

capper · April 23, 2012, 12:59 PM

I'm sure you can Hawg. Some people just don't put the time in @ the range,and actually quite suck at shooting.I actually am quite good with ALL of my weapons.I'm not a championship shooter,but I can hold my own pretty darn well.I guess some people have nothing better to do,than sit around and critisize other people. Pretty sad. Oh well, I know what I can,and can't do.No need to explain it to anybody,and that's all I have to say about that.Any more negative comments will be ignored.I know who my friends are.

bdhuntr · April 23, 2012, 01:21 PM

My most accurate load out of my Traditions Deerhunter .54 (not a true Hawken, but close enough) is 90 grains FFg Goex and a 425 grain Hornady Great Plains conical, or (better yet) a 425 grain Buffalo Bullet. The sights are crude on this rifle, but I can normally get about a 5" group at 75 yards, which is about as far as I will shoot with it.

Sure Shot Mc Gee · April 23, 2012, 02:58 PM

Well Sir's I shoot like I golf. "Many holes in one!!"

__ Anybody got the Nickers to beat that one? I am waiting.

April 19, 2012, 03:44 PM	#1
seadog28 Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2012 Posts: 7	A good load for a .54 cal. Hawken Hi All! I just purchased anice used .54 cal. Hawken by Hastings of Clay Center Ks and I was looking for some advice on a good load for this rifle. Round ball or conical? Black powder of Pyrodex? I'll probably just punch paper for a while but sure would appreciate any help. I've built two Kentucky flinters in .45 cal. but it's been 20 years since I messed with muzzle loaders. I feel the need to go back to the basics. Thanks, seadog28

April 19, 2012, 04:30 PM	#3
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	Hawg is right. Your rifle will decide what it likes. I have a .56 cal T/C Renegade,smoothebore,that I shoot .54 cal rb's thru,and it loves em'. It doesn't care much for conicals,but I get real good groupings @ 100 yds. with the rb's. I use 100 gr Pyrodex RS,with .530 round ball,and .010 patch. Hope this helps. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning! Last edited by capper; April 19, 2012 at 04:32 PM. Reason: omission

April 20, 2012, 04:39 PM	#4
seadog28 Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2012 Posts: 7	.54 cal. load Thanks guys for the info. I am not sure what the rate of twist is for the Hastings barrel, can't seem to find out much info on the hastings Hawkens. I'll report my results as soon as I can get to the range.

April 22, 2012, 01:01 AM	#12
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	Hawg is right. Your rifle will decide what it likes. I have a .56 cal T/C Renegade,sm LAH,I average 3"-4" groups @ 100 yds.My eyes are not what they used to be,but I put out a 9" paper plate with a 3" orange dot in the center,and 4 out of 5 will land in,or touch that circle,darn near every time. That's good enough for me.I have also spent a lot of time at the range with all of my weapons,so I have gotten to know them quite well. I feel that is probably why I shoot them well. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!

April 22, 2012, 10:25 AM	#14
Beagle333 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2012 Location: Auburn, AL. Posts: 2,332	Renegade I have a .56 smoothie. It is quite fun!! I can't help with data on the 100 yard groups. My range here is only 50 yards, but I can't tell a difference in rifling vs. no rifling at that distance. Several others have told me that it matters more when you get past 70 yards, but I can't personally verify that. I have been using 70 grains of Pyrodex P (because it's what I have) with a .550 round ball.

April 19, 2012, 03:55 PM	#2
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	The gun will decide what load it likes. I use 90 grains of Pyrodex RS with a .530 round ball and a .010 patch. Mine has a 1:66 twist. A 1:48 is decent with round ball or conical but not best for either. Anything faster will be conical only.

April 20, 2012, 04:45 PM	#5
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Put a tight fitting patch on your ramrod jag and push it to the bottom of the bore. mark the rod at the muzzle even with the front sight, Pull it out letting it turn with the rifling until you get a half turn. Mark it again and measure between the marks. Multiply X 2 and you will be pretty close to actual twist. Or you can do a quarter turn and multiply X 4.

April 21, 2012, 03:41 PM	#7
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	A Hawken is not a smooth bore. With a slow twist and a round ball I wouldn't quit till I got at least two inch groups.

April 21, 2012, 10:16 PM	#10
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	My bad. FWIW it was Capper with the smooth bore.

April 22, 2012, 09:21 AM	#13
LAH Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2002 Location: In The Hardwoods Posts: 1,188	Thanks Capper. Never owned a smooth bore rifle but always wanted one. Do you cast your own RBs?

April 22, 2012, 11:49 AM	#15
seadog28 Junior Member Join Date: April 18, 2012 Posts: 7	Yes, Sure Shot the gun was made by the shotgun barrel maker. As I understand it they were supposed to do a run of 1000 especially for Cabelas but only wound up making 250. I think that was back in the late 90's. It is a very high quality rifle with browned furniture and barrel and a curly maple stock. It is in the original hawken style. Looks are good but if it doesn't shoot it's only wood and metal.

April 22, 2012, 12:30 PM	#16
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Got pics?

April 22, 2012, 02:57 PM	#18
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	Thanks Capper. Never owned a smooth bore rifle but always wanted one. Do you cast you No LAH, I don't cast my own rb's.(not yet anyway) Someday, I would like to try my hand at it. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!

April 22, 2012, 03:47 PM	#19
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	If it's a rendition of a true Hawken it's percussion. There's only one original Hawken flinter known to exist and none referred to historically. Not to my knowledge anyway. There probably were a few more but given the low production numbers of the percussion's I doubt it would have more than a handful if that many.

April 23, 2012, 08:50 AM	#21
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	I average 3"-4" groups @ 100 yds.My eyes are not what they used to be Ok Rifleman 1776. Maybe my memory is fading like my eyes.Groupings are in actuallity, more in the 6"-9" range. I get better accuracy with my T/C Encore,209/50,w/320gr. maxi-ball.MY bad. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!

April 23, 2012, 12:59 PM	#23
capper Member Join Date: April 2, 2012 Location: Turners Falls, MA Posts: 63	I'm sure you can Hawg. Some people just don't put the time in @ the range,and actually quite suck at shooting.I actually am quite good with ALL of my weapons.I'm not a championship shooter,but I can hold my own pretty darn well.I guess some people have nothing better to do,than sit around and critisize other people. Pretty sad. Oh well, I know what I can,and can't do.No need to explain it to anybody,and that's all I have to say about that.Any more negative comments will be ignored.I know who my friends are. __________________ Mmmm, how I love the smell of black powder in the morning!

April 23, 2012, 01:21 PM	#24
bdhuntr Member Join Date: February 26, 2012 Location: Abingdon, Maryland Posts: 40	My most accurate load out of my Traditions Deerhunter .54 (not a true Hawken, but close enough) is 90 grains FFg Goex and a 425 grain Hornady Great Plains conical, or (better yet) a 425 grain Buffalo Bullet. The sights are crude on this rifle, but I can normally get about a 5" group at 75 yards, which is about as far as I will shoot with it.

April 23, 2012, 02:58 PM	#25
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	I just don't know anymore?? Can't we all just get along Well Sir's I shoot like I golf. "Many holes in one!!"__ Anybody got the Nickers to beat that one? I am waiting.

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