Ruger Old Army / Howell conversion issue

noelf2 · November 10, 2016, 10:08 AM

Got my Howell conversion cylinder for the new to me (still unfired) ROA. It is a bit tight, but does slide into the frame. I see barely a sliver of a barrel/cylinder gap. The cylinder will cycle normally for all except one chamber. Seems to bind while the hand is pushing it, and I can't pull the hammer all the way back. Will go just a bit past half cock. I can lower the hammer back down to half cock and the cylinder is free to manually turn it a bit more while fully cocking the hammer over that binding chamber. For now, it works good mechanically if I use the binding chamber as the unloaded "safety" chamber for the hammer to rest on. Will this loosen up after several rounds have been fired?

Ricklin · November 10, 2016, 03:03 PM

I think i would send the ROA to howell. Get started on the rigbt foot so to speak.

Easy to ship black powder guns. I would think they would do the job for little or nothing...likely nothing if you bought the cylinder new.

g.willikers · November 10, 2016, 03:11 PM

Yeah, send it back.
Have you called the manufacturer to ask if they need anything other than the cylinder?
They might only need the cylinder to see if the machining is correct.
There could be more wrong than just the end gap and its surface.
Like maybe the center pin hole being off center, for example.
Chances are this one will go back into the melting pot and a new one will be sent.

noelf2 · November 10, 2016, 04:56 PM

Everything aligns so well that I'm hesitant to send it back. I'm thinking it'll probably break in. Don't want my gun adjusted because the C&B cylinder is a perfect fit. I read a couple other places that the cylinders are a bit tight, and some people taking .002 off the breech end. Just strange that it's just one spot. I got out my calipers and it all seems even.

g.willikers · November 11, 2016, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Just strange that it's just one spot.

That's why the machining seems suspect.
Calipers, even the best ones generally aren't anywhere nearly accurate enough to catch that kind of error.
You might try a good quality set of feeler gauges instead, measuring each chamber clearance front and back at the barrel and at the rear of the frame, as the cylinder is rotated.

foolzrushn · November 11, 2016, 01:05 PM

Not familiar with this, but since it's just one cylinder ( one position in the cylinder's rotation), could it be a problem where the hand tip hits the cylinder notch? Not as deep, or a burr or something in the notch different from the others?

If the hand/cylinder fit was a smidge too tight, it might bind the hand and rotation. Would removing a thousandth from the front of the cylinder, by polishing that front face on a flat surface with emory cloth free it up? Perhaps.

As you say, all mods would be on the new cylinder, so the fit with the original one would not change. This is also providing you don't see any out-of-round runout in the gap between the cylinder and frame when the cylinder is turned.

noelf2 · November 11, 2016, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Would removing a thousandth from the front of the cylinder, by polishing that front face on a flat surface with emory cloth free it up? Perhaps.

This is exactly what I plan to try. Don't have any emory cloth, but plan to get some. For now, it works fine, and I can keep the binding chamber under the hammer as the empty safety chamber. l should be able to get all 5 shots off with no problem. I'm also thinking that after firing some 45 colt, the recoil of the cylinder cap against the back plate might just fix it on it's own. Vid of what it's doing now:

https://youtu.be/X5qq2ecj8M0

44 Dave · November 11, 2016, 06:47 PM

Does the ROA conversion cylinder have the chambers bored at a slight angle to accommodate 6 .45 Colt rims? May be a slight machining issue I like the feeler gauge suggestion.

noelf2 · November 11, 2016, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Does the ROA conversion cylinder have the chambers bored at a slight angle to accommodate 6 .45 Colt rims?

Think that's only on the 1858's.

noelf2 · November 11, 2016, 08:16 PM

Remembered I have a large very fine grit sharpening stone and worked on the entire flat on the back of the cylinder cap. The flat wasn't very flat. I could tell by the fact that the bluing didn't sand off evenly. I basically stoned it until the entire flat was in the white, no bluing left. Then I cleaned it, and put the cylinder back in the ROA. It was better, but not yet right. I stoned a bit more, and bit more, cleaning and checking for fit several times. I finally got it perfect. All chambers advance with no problem. Now i just need to flitz polish the flat area, and re-blue it. So, if you get a howell convo cylinder for your ROA, and it jams a bit, you know what to do.

**4V50 Gary** · November 11, 2016, 09:40 PM

Good job!

foolzrushn · November 12, 2016, 12:26 AM

Great. And that's better than working the cylinder face.....less rebluing to do.

November 10, 2016, 10:08 AM	#1
noelf2 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2008 Location: Stuart, VA Posts: 2,473	Ruger Old Army / Howell conversion issue Got my Howell conversion cylinder for the new to me (still unfired) ROA. It is a bit tight, but does slide into the frame. I see barely a sliver of a barrel/cylinder gap. The cylinder will cycle normally for all except one chamber. Seems to bind while the hand is pushing it, and I can't pull the hammer all the way back. Will go just a bit past half cock. I can lower the hammer back down to half cock and the cylinder is free to manually turn it a bit more while fully cocking the hammer over that binding chamber. For now, it works good mechanically if I use the binding chamber as the unloaded "safety" chamber for the hammer to rest on. Will this loosen up after several rounds have been fired? __________________ Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.

November 10, 2016, 03:03 PM	#2
Ricklin Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2008 Location: SW Washington state Posts: 2,029	Ship it I think i would send the ROA to howell. Get started on the rigbt foot so to speak. Easy to ship black powder guns. I would think they would do the job for little or nothing...likely nothing if you bought the cylinder new. __________________ ricklin Freedom is not free

November 10, 2016, 04:56 PM	#4
noelf2 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2008 Location: Stuart, VA Posts: 2,473	Everything aligns so well that I'm hesitant to send it back. I'm thinking it'll probably break in. Don't want my gun adjusted because the C&B cylinder is a perfect fit. I read a couple other places that the cylinders are a bit tight, and some people taking .002 off the breech end. Just strange that it's just one spot. I got out my calipers and it all seems even. __________________ Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.

November 11, 2016, 08:16 PM	#10
noelf2 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2008 Location: Stuart, VA Posts: 2,473	FIXED IT !!! Remembered I have a large very fine grit sharpening stone and worked on the entire flat on the back of the cylinder cap. The flat wasn't very flat. I could tell by the fact that the bluing didn't sand off evenly. I basically stoned it until the entire flat was in the white, no bluing left. Then I cleaned it, and put the cylinder back in the ROA. It was better, but not yet right. I stoned a bit more, and bit more, cleaning and checking for fit several times. I finally got it perfect. All chambers advance with no problem. Now i just need to flitz polish the flat area, and re-blue it. So, if you get a howell convo cylinder for your ROA, and it jams a bit, you know what to do. __________________ Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.

November 11, 2016, 09:40 PM	#11
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,870	Good job! __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

November 10, 2016, 03:11 PM	#3
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Yeah, send it back. Have you called the manufacturer to ask if they need anything other than the cylinder? They might only need the cylinder to see if the machining is correct. There could be more wrong than just the end gap and its surface. Like maybe the center pin hole being off center, for example. Chances are this one will go back into the melting pot and a new one will be sent.

November 11, 2016, 01:05 PM	#6
foolzrushn Senior Member Join Date: April 29, 2015 Location: middle of the Santa Fe Trail Posts: 396	Not familiar with this, but since it's just one cylinder ( one position in the cylinder's rotation), could it be a problem where the hand tip hits the cylinder notch? Not as deep, or a burr or something in the notch different from the others? If the hand/cylinder fit was a smidge too tight, it might bind the hand and rotation. Would removing a thousandth from the front of the cylinder, by polishing that front face on a flat surface with emory cloth free it up? Perhaps. As you say, all mods would be on the new cylinder, so the fit with the original one would not change. This is also providing you don't see any out-of-round runout in the gap between the cylinder and frame when the cylinder is turned.

November 11, 2016, 06:47 PM	#8
44 Dave Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2013 Posts: 584	Does the ROA conversion cylinder have the chambers bored at a slight angle to accommodate 6 .45 Colt rims? May be a slight machining issue I like the feeler gauge suggestion.

November 12, 2016, 12:26 AM	#12
foolzrushn Senior Member Join Date: April 29, 2015 Location: middle of the Santa Fe Trail Posts: 396	Great. And that's better than working the cylinder face.....less rebluing to do.