Small base dies/tips or recommendations

bernardo · January 18, 2011, 01:04 PM

I am looking for tips on reloading some ammo for a Browning BAR in .30-06, and have RCBS Small base dies. any tips on what to do, or not to do?
Thanks
Bernardo

jmorris · January 18, 2011, 01:25 PM

I have never had a firearm with a small base chamber, so I have never used small base dies. I adjust the dies to size the case to properly fit a case gauge and stop.

F. Guffey · January 18, 2011, 03:50 PM

Back to the M1 Garand,, it used the same ammo as the 03, 03A3, the M1917 Enfield and a few MGs, the chamber of the M1 was .00025 smaller in diameter ahead of the web, then came the BAR, Browning Automatic Rifle. RCBS made dies designed for the BAR, I have 4 sets of RCBS BAR dies and standard dies, when measuring the difference between cases sized with BAR dies and standard dies the person doing the measurements must have micrometers that are capable of measuring thicknesses less than .0005 AND the person doing the measuring must be able to read the micrometer.

I would suggest purchasing a Speers reloading manuel and then look in the definitions of terms for small base dies. The small base die is described as being a more accurate full length sizer die and does not make the base smaller, but back to those that measure, they tell me they get as much as .0003 thousands difference.

I took a picture of my micrometers a few months ago, the picture weighed 400 lbs.

F. Guffey

700cdl · January 20, 2011, 01:15 AM

Hey there F. Guffy,
As you stated, small base dies produce less sizing stress above the case head. They still re-set the shoulder like a FL die does. I use them for the first resizing on brass not yet fired through the rifle I intend to load that brass for, and then I go to a neck die after that. I also will use the small base die if my necked brass begins to get too tight for that chamber.

F. Guffey · January 21, 2011, 02:25 PM

700CDL,

"I would suggest purchasing a Speers reloading manuel and then look in the definitions of terms for small base dies. The small base die is described as being a more accurate full length sizer die and does not make the base smaller, but back to those that measure, they tell me they get as much as .0003 thousands difference"

and some claim a difference of .003 thousands, I do not have micrometers like that.

F. Guffey

Lemmon · January 21, 2011, 04:17 PM

I have a set of SB RCBS dies that I load my BAR 30-06 and have never had a problem with the reloads. Need to make sure you lube the case properly. A friend borrowed some of my 7MM Mag loads for his BAR and they did not work for him. The dies I used were standard and worked great for my 700 ADL. It might just be that the BAR likes small base dies.... Lemmon

Mike / Tx · January 22, 2011, 02:02 AM

Best tip I can think of is to use Imperial Sizing Wax.

Other than that, set them up like you would any other die. I have three individual SB dies that I use .223, .308, and 30-06. They bring the case back to as close to the initial factory dimensions or minimum specs as possible. This is a great thing when used in some auto loading rifles where chambers can run a bit on the large side of specs. This is also a great aid when purchasing surplus brass as quite a bit of the mil surp stuff is fired in fully auto guns where the chambers DO run larger.

I purchased a bunch of .308 cases once, ran them through my standard dies, loaded some up and headed to the woods for a hog hunt. First couple of rounds chambered fine, then bolt jammed up to the point I had to knock it open. The case simply wedged in the chamber as I was rocking through the rounds on a pack of hogs. After checking the rest of the 50 rounds I found more than half would not chamber. After getting the SB die in and pulling them all, and resizing, they all chamber fine now. I usually just set the die up on my progressive, then run through the whole lot of brass. This at least gives me a good start on them once I am loading to make sure they will at least all chamber.

For the 06' I use it on all mil surp and range brass. I load several calibers based off the '06 case and use them quite a bit for these rifles. Since they are cheap and easily found at most ranges, I pick up the new looking ones and set them aside for hunting rounds that I know will have the great possibility of being lost. Once sized with the SB die they will chamber in everything I own that is based off that case from then on out.

If your loading for that one particular rifle, you might not have to bottom them out every time for it to function reliably. You might get by with only having to fully size them every three or four loads depending on your loads. I would size a few and mic them to see how much difference there is between the fired case and sized case. If it's more than a couple of thousands, I might be more inclined to fully size than to let it ride a couple of times. However the actual feeding of the rifle will for sure let you know.

hope this helps.

January 18, 2011, 01:04 PM	#1
bernardo Member Join Date: April 29, 2010 Posts: 21	Small base dies/tips or recommendations I am looking for tips on reloading some ammo for a Browning BAR in .30-06, and have RCBS Small base dies. any tips on what to do, or not to do? Thanks Bernardo

January 18, 2011, 01:25 PM	#2
jmorris Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2006 Posts: 3,077	I have never had a firearm with a small base chamber, so I have never used small base dies. I adjust the dies to size the case to properly fit a case gauge and stop.

January 18, 2011, 03:50 PM	#3
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	Back to the M1 Garand,, it used the same ammo as the 03, 03A3, the M1917 Enfield and a few MGs, the chamber of the M1 was .00025 smaller in diameter ahead of the web, then came the BAR, Browning Automatic Rifle. RCBS made dies designed for the BAR, I have 4 sets of RCBS BAR dies and standard dies, when measuring the difference between cases sized with BAR dies and standard dies the person doing the measurements must have micrometers that are capable of measuring thicknesses less than .0005 AND the person doing the measuring must be able to read the micrometer. I would suggest purchasing a Speers reloading manuel and then look in the definitions of terms for small base dies. The small base die is described as being a more accurate full length sizer die and does not make the base smaller, but back to those that measure, they tell me they get as much as .0003 thousands difference. I took a picture of my micrometers a few months ago, the picture weighed 400 lbs. F. Guffey

January 20, 2011, 01:15 AM	#4
700cdl Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2010 Posts: 216	Hey there F. Guffy, As you stated, small base dies produce less sizing stress above the case head. They still re-set the shoulder like a FL die does. I use them for the first resizing on brass not yet fired through the rifle I intend to load that brass for, and then I go to a neck die after that. I also will use the small base die if my necked brass begins to get too tight for that chamber.

January 21, 2011, 02:25 PM	#5
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	700CDL, "I would suggest purchasing a Speers reloading manuel and then look in the definitions of terms for small base dies. The small base die is described as being a more accurate full length sizer die and does not make the base smaller, but back to those that measure, they tell me they get as much as .0003 thousands difference" and some claim a difference of .003 thousands, I do not have micrometers like that. F. Guffey

January 21, 2011, 04:17 PM	#6
Lemmon Senior Member Join Date: December 25, 2009 Location: Rural South Carolina Posts: 445	I have a set of SB RCBS dies that I load my BAR 30-06 and have never had a problem with the reloads. Need to make sure you lube the case properly. A friend borrowed some of my 7MM Mag loads for his BAR and they did not work for him. The dies I used were standard and worked great for my 700 ADL. It might just be that the BAR likes small base dies.... Lemmon

January 22, 2011, 02:02 AM	#7
Mike / Tx Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2000 Posts: 2,101	Best tip I can think of is to use Imperial Sizing Wax. Other than that, set them up like you would any other die. I have three individual SB dies that I use .223, .308, and 30-06. They bring the case back to as close to the initial factory dimensions or minimum specs as possible. This is a great thing when used in some auto loading rifles where chambers can run a bit on the large side of specs. This is also a great aid when purchasing surplus brass as quite a bit of the mil surp stuff is fired in fully auto guns where the chambers DO run larger. I purchased a bunch of .308 cases once, ran them through my standard dies, loaded some up and headed to the woods for a hog hunt. First couple of rounds chambered fine, then bolt jammed up to the point I had to knock it open. The case simply wedged in the chamber as I was rocking through the rounds on a pack of hogs. After checking the rest of the 50 rounds I found more than half would not chamber. After getting the SB die in and pulling them all, and resizing, they all chamber fine now. I usually just set the die up on my progressive, then run through the whole lot of brass. This at least gives me a good start on them once I am loading to make sure they will at least all chamber. For the 06' I use it on all mil surp and range brass. I load several calibers based off the '06 case and use them quite a bit for these rifles. Since they are cheap and easily found at most ranges, I pick up the new looking ones and set them aside for hunting rounds that I know will have the great possibility of being lost. Once sized with the SB die they will chamber in everything I own that is based off that case from then on out. If your loading for that one particular rifle, you might not have to bottom them out every time for it to function reliably. You might get by with only having to fully size them every three or four loads depending on your loads. I would size a few and mic them to see how much difference there is between the fired case and sized case. If it's more than a couple of thousands, I might be more inclined to fully size than to let it ride a couple of times. However the actual feeding of the rifle will for sure let you know. hope this helps.