Shooting faster, and better

golfnutrlv · February 24, 2009, 01:41 PM

Hello everyone,

Do you have any tips, tricks, etc to help me learn to shoot better at higher speed?

The situation I am after is a tactical fun shoot, similar to IDPA, or USPSA. I love running these tactical shoots for training and fun, but my accuracy suffers unless I am very slow and deliberate, and if I do that, my time suffers.

I am not looking to become Todd Jarett by any means, I wuld just like to do a better and rank a little higher up the list. I would say that the biggest thing I need work on is trigger pull, but I am open to other suggestions.

Thanks all!

hogdogs · February 24, 2009, 01:49 PM

Video shooting games can help with hand eye co-ordination as well as target acquisition and peripheral vision as you learn to seek out the target earlier which in your case allows you to mentally prepare for the next target as soon as you plink the last.
In unpopulated areas I like to tack gobs of paper targets to trees and "run the course" with a .22. Then run it backwards etc.
But I am not a very good/fast shooter. I settled on the slow=fast theory to offset my inadequacies...

Brent

kraigwy · February 24, 2009, 02:15 PM

Nothing works like rounds down range

BikerRN · February 24, 2009, 02:43 PM

Put a laser on your gun and dry-fire at home using your laser. This will help you to learn to point and shoot the gun. Make sure you don't "jerk" the trigger, which the laser will show if you are.

Stay smooth and concentrate on smooth. "Fast is smooth, smooth is fast."

Biker

Japle · February 24, 2009, 03:21 PM

Lots of good information here:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?act=idx

NRAhab · February 24, 2009, 04:21 PM

"How do I shoot faster" is probably the most commonly asked question in action shooting. A lot of people say "practice", which is good advice but only if you know what to practice. A more complete answer would include an examination of what techniques will help you shoot faster.

1. The first item that will help you shoot faster is to develop your recoil control skills, which are primarily a function of your grip and stance. For stance, all of the top competitive pros use the modified isosceles stance, which keeps your knees soft (bent) and your body "forward" so you're "on the gun". The second component of recoil control is your grip. Todd Jarrett likes to say "grip the gun 20% tighter", a technique which (I think) Mas Ayoob refers as the "crush grip". To establish your optimum grip pressure, hold the gun in your firing grip and grip the pistol until the front sight starts to bounce and shake from your grip pressure, then relax your grip until the sight stops bouncing rapidly - that's your "ideal" grip pressure for rapid shooting. The 3rd aspect of recoil control is strength - holding the gun that tight takes a considerable amount of grip strength, so I recommend looking into training exercises for your upper body/forearms.

2. The second aspect of "shooting faster" is trigger control. Your average semi-auto cycles in something like 0.06 seconds, which means that the gun is always waiting on you. When you're shooting fast, you want your trigger finger to come all the way off the trigger of the gun, and then re-engage the trigger, especially if you're using a revolver or striker-fired pistol. Jerry Miculek keeps the return springs in his revolver at an "unusually" high weight, as he wants his finger to come just off the trigger in between shots. Some guys feel like you should "ride the reset" on the trigger, which means let just enough off for the gun to reset and keep constant contact with the trigger. The problem with riding the reset is that you're depending on an extremely fine muscle skill to know when that trigger's reset, and for speed it's much easier to just come off the trigger in between shots.

3. The third aspect of effective speed shooting is the draw. Back to quoting Todd Jarrett: "If you blow the draw, you blog the string". So true. Practice your draw at home, using a "progressive draw drill". That will allow you to up your speed on the draw in a controlled environment.

There are a lot more tips and tricks to shooting fast and accurate, however these three fundamentals never get old, and are always areas in which you can go faster.

Jimlakeside · February 24, 2009, 04:28 PM

There is a world of information about shooting faster and more accurate at this forum: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/

Brian even has a book which I have found to be very helpful. Use the search function.

Japle · February 24, 2009, 08:26 PM

Trigger control
Follow-through
Calling the shot
Prepping the trigger
Seeing the sight lift
Mastering grip and stance

Once you have all that down pat, you can teach the rest of us!!

raimius · February 24, 2009, 10:16 PM

Get cheap, mid-sized targets (IPSC "A" zone size preferably), then practice firing as quick as you can while NOT missing. You will notice, there is a speed where you lose the ability to hit the A zone (too fast for your current ability). Practice this drill at multiple distances to find how perfect your sight picture needs to be for different distances.
At a distance of 5yds or less, you can easily hit an 8.5x11 inch piece of paper without even using the sights, if you practice a little and have a consistent grip and stance.

Many of the above mentioned tips are also very important.

Keltyke · February 24, 2009, 10:45 PM

It's all practice, practice, practice.

fastforty · February 24, 2009, 11:26 PM

I'd add that it's perfect practice & that speed comes with repetition.

jrothWA · February 24, 2009, 11:57 PM

bowling pins!

Go for accuracy firdt and speed will develop.

golfnutrlv · February 25, 2009, 12:02 AM

Good info all. Thanks for the help so far.

The Great Mahoo · February 25, 2009, 08:41 AM

One very important thing here, the infamous "take-your-time-in-a-hurry."

Make sure you take enough time to find your sights from the draw before you shoot. At the action shoots I've seen, and even just shooting in general for some people, they just point and shoot without taking time to properly line up the gun first. As you can imagine, their shots are all over the place. You want to make sure you line up the first shot and then roll from there. Once you have the gun in proper grip/pointing, you'll have a much better chance.

Most action shoots penalize you for every non-center hit, and really hit you for misses. You'll score much better by slowing down a bit and making good/decent hits than trying to blaze through as quick as possible.

Develop good recoil management, learn to point shoot, and always be aware of your front sight to start.

hogdogs · February 25, 2009, 08:51 AM

I AM MAD AS HECK!!! I think Mrs.hogdogs added to my post! I would never admit inadequacy!

Brent

pax · February 25, 2009, 12:21 PM

NRAhab nailed it. Nice post, Ahab.

It is amazing to me, the number of experienced shooters who believe they have good trigger control, but who either don't understand what is meant by that, or simply cannot control the trigger when the action speeds up.

pax

February 24, 2009, 01:41 PM	#1
golfnutrlv Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 1,347	Shooting faster, and better Hello everyone, Do you have any tips, tricks, etc to help me learn to shoot better at higher speed? The situation I am after is a tactical fun shoot, similar to IDPA, or USPSA. I love running these tactical shoots for training and fun, but my accuracy suffers unless I am very slow and deliberate, and if I do that, my time suffers. I am not looking to become Todd Jarett by any means, I wuld just like to do a better and rank a little higher up the list. I would say that the biggest thing I need work on is trigger pull, but I am open to other suggestions. Thanks all! __________________ ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ VIGILIA PRETIUM LIBERTATIS "The price of liberty is vigilance" America is at an awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.

February 24, 2009, 02:15 PM	#3
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	Nothing works like rounds down range __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

February 24, 2009, 04:21 PM	#6
NRAhab Senior Member Join Date: August 20, 2005 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 683	"How do I shoot faster" is probably the most commonly asked question in action shooting. A lot of people say "practice", which is good advice but only if you know what to practice. A more complete answer would include an examination of what techniques will help you shoot faster. 1. The first item that will help you shoot faster is to develop your recoil control skills, which are primarily a function of your grip and stance. For stance, all of the top competitive pros use the modified isosceles stance, which keeps your knees soft (bent) and your body "forward" so you're "on the gun". The second component of recoil control is your grip. Todd Jarrett likes to say "grip the gun 20% tighter", a technique which (I think) Mas Ayoob refers as the "crush grip". To establish your optimum grip pressure, hold the gun in your firing grip and grip the pistol until the front sight starts to bounce and shake from your grip pressure, then relax your grip until the sight stops bouncing rapidly - that's your "ideal" grip pressure for rapid shooting. The 3rd aspect of recoil control is strength - holding the gun that tight takes a considerable amount of grip strength, so I recommend looking into training exercises for your upper body/forearms. 2. The second aspect of "shooting faster" is trigger control. Your average semi-auto cycles in something like 0.06 seconds, which means that the gun is always waiting on you. When you're shooting fast, you want your trigger finger to come all the way off the trigger of the gun, and then re-engage the trigger, especially if you're using a revolver or striker-fired pistol. Jerry Miculek keeps the return springs in his revolver at an "unusually" high weight, as he wants his finger to come just off the trigger in between shots. Some guys feel like you should "ride the reset" on the trigger, which means let just enough off for the gun to reset and keep constant contact with the trigger. The problem with riding the reset is that you're depending on an extremely fine muscle skill to know when that trigger's reset, and for speed it's much easier to just come off the trigger in between shots. 3. The third aspect of effective speed shooting is the draw. Back to quoting Todd Jarrett: "If you blow the draw, you blog the string". So true. Practice your draw at home, using a "progressive draw drill". That will allow you to up your speed on the draw in a controlled environment. There are a lot more tips and tricks to shooting fast and accurate, however these three fundamentals never get old, and are always areas in which you can go faster. __________________ Join the community at GunUp!

February 24, 2009, 11:26 PM	#11
fastforty Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 1999 Location: In a kornfield in kalifornia Posts: 1,161	I'd add that it's perfect practice & that speed comes with repetition. __________________ When Banjos are outlawed, only Outlaws will have Banjos The Bible is my lawbook. I turn the other cheek when applicable, and spend the rest of my days resisting evil at every front, until I have breathed my last breath.

February 24, 2009, 11:57 PM	#12
jrothWA Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2006 Posts: 2,519	Two words.. bowling pins! Go for accuracy firdt and speed will develop.

February 24, 2009, 01:49 PM	#2
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	Video shooting games can help with hand eye co-ordination as well as target acquisition and peripheral vision as you learn to seek out the target earlier which in your case allows you to mentally prepare for the next target as soon as you plink the last. In unpopulated areas I like to tack gobs of paper targets to trees and "run the course" with a .22. Then run it backwards etc. But I am not a very good/fast shooter. I settled on the slow=fast theory to offset my inadequacies... Brent

February 24, 2009, 02:43 PM	#4
BikerRN Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2007 Location: "State of Discombobulation" Posts: 1,333	Put a laser on your gun and dry-fire at home using your laser. This will help you to learn to point and shoot the gun. Make sure you don't "jerk" the trigger, which the laser will show if you are. Stay smooth and concentrate on smooth. "Fast is smooth, smooth is fast." Biker

February 24, 2009, 03:21 PM	#5
Japle Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2004 Location: Viera, Florida Posts: 1,340	Lots of good information here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?act=idx

February 24, 2009, 04:28 PM	#7
Jimlakeside Member Join Date: May 13, 2008 Location: Pottsboro, Texas Posts: 33	There is a world of information about shooting faster and more accurate at this forum: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/ Brian even has a book which I have found to be very helpful. Use the search function.

February 24, 2009, 08:26 PM	#8
Japle Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2004 Location: Viera, Florida Posts: 1,340	Trigger control Follow-through Calling the shot Prepping the trigger Seeing the sight lift Mastering grip and stance Once you have all that down pat, you can teach the rest of us!!

February 24, 2009, 10:16 PM	#9
raimius Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2008 Posts: 2,199	Get cheap, mid-sized targets (IPSC "A" zone size preferably), then practice firing as quick as you can while NOT missing. You will notice, there is a speed where you lose the ability to hit the A zone (too fast for your current ability). Practice this drill at multiple distances to find how perfect your sight picture needs to be for different distances. At a distance of 5yds or less, you can easily hit an 8.5x11 inch piece of paper without even using the sights, if you practice a little and have a consistent grip and stance. Many of the above mentioned tips are also very important.

February 24, 2009, 10:45 PM	#10
Keltyke Junior member Join Date: April 6, 2008 Location: Spartanburg, SC Posts: 2,933	It's all practice, practice, practice.

February 25, 2009, 12:02 AM	#13
golfnutrlv Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 1,347	Good info all. Thanks for the help so far. __________________ ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ VIGILIA PRETIUM LIBERTATIS "The price of liberty is vigilance" America is at an awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.

February 25, 2009, 08:41 AM	#14
The Great Mahoo Senior Member Join Date: June 3, 2008 Location: Pennsylvania, USA Posts: 1,269	One very important thing here, the infamous "take-your-time-in-a-hurry." Make sure you take enough time to find your sights from the draw before you shoot. At the action shoots I've seen, and even just shooting in general for some people, they just point and shoot without taking time to properly line up the gun first. As you can imagine, their shots are all over the place. You want to make sure you line up the first shot and then roll from there. Once you have the gun in proper grip/pointing, you'll have a much better chance. Most action shoots penalize you for every non-center hit, and really hit you for misses. You'll score much better by slowing down a bit and making good/decent hits than trying to blaze through as quick as possible. Develop good recoil management, learn to point shoot, and always be aware of your front sight to start.

February 25, 2009, 08:51 AM	#15
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	I AM MAD AS HECK!!! I think Mrs.hogdogs added to my post! I would never admit inadequacy! Brent

February 25, 2009, 12:21 PM	#16
pax Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2000 Location: In a state of flux Posts: 7,520	NRAhab nailed it. Nice post, Ahab. It is amazing to me, the number of experienced shooters who believe they have good trigger control, but who either don't understand what is meant by that, or simply cannot control the trigger when the action speeds up. pax __________________ Kathy Jackson My personal website: Cornered Cat