Would you refuse to sell a gun to someone you think is shady? - Page 4

5whiskey · January 21, 2014, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Most of them are in the outlaws. Not all the chapters of the outlaws or hells angels are like they are portrayed in the news and various tv shows. Just because they are labeled a one percent club does not mean they are out killing people!

I understand that they may not be getting into knife fights on a daily basis, are professional "hit men," or are involved in some of the things that the stereotype says they are involved in. I know first hand what they are, what they do, how the stereotypes are false, and how they are true. The point is, the club comes first and a large percentage of 1% club presidents and senior members are not allowed to legally purchase (or own) a firearm. I could not in good conscience sell a firearm to any member.

Justice06RR · January 21, 2014, 11:09 PM

I don't know if you verified the "kid's" age or not. Some people just look young but in reality they are over 21.

A simple ID check can verify this. If he is indeed underage, then they should not sell to him (other than accesories).

Toolman · January 23, 2014, 10:00 AM

When I received my FFL in 2006, the BATFE sent me 3 books listing all state & federal laws regarding fireams. There is one section that addresses the OP topic. That section tells the FFL holder that 'gut feeling & appearance' is important and even has a graphic to that effect.

Garycw · January 23, 2014, 10:11 AM

That would be an interesting graphic to see. Was it clothes? Tattoos, piercings , turban with long beard? Diff ineptly profiling. I go mostly by what comes out of there mouth and body language. In not a ffl, but have bought & sold at least 30 firearms. I've been very lucky and only had one instance where I wouldn't even meet the guy by what he was saying.
Maybe I'm the shady one?

DOD didn't seem to think so though

MikeNice81 · January 23, 2014, 10:41 AM

I've been to a range with the following posted on the door.

Quote:

GANG MEMBERS: ANY PERSON having the appearance, actions or suspected of being associated with any type of GANG ACTIVITY is denied entrance.

ALIEN: Anyone from another country other than the United States is required to present their required LEGAL DOCUMENTATION WITH PHOTO granting them legal entrance into America immediately upon entering to the range officer in charge. If no documentation is presented service is denied. No exceptions.

So, there are FFLs that take appearance very seriously. Unfortunately with the heat heaped on the dealers that complied with the ATF in Fast and Furious, it is to be expected.

MikeNice81 · January 23, 2014, 10:47 AM

Quote:

I am well aware of the difference between one percent clubs and 99 percent clubs. Like I said I know many people that are in one percent clubs. Most of them are in the outlaws. Not all the chapters of the outlaws or hells angels are like they are portrayed in the news and various tv shows. Just because they are labeled a one percent club does not mean they are out killing people!

Some of the nicest guys I've ever met were 1% or rode in support clubs. When my dad was kidnapped and robbed it was his old MC buddies that found the guy and turned him over to the cops. I still wouldn't sell to them. It goes back to the old saying, play stupid games and you win stupid prizes. I'm not facilitating the lifestyle or supporting it.

Like Jimmy Smitts said on SOA, "You can't keep the uniform on and expect to never get in the game."

Crankgrinder · January 23, 2014, 06:32 PM

Ive never sold any firearms outside of ffl dealers and coworkers whom I had known for ten years. On the other side of that unless I have reason to believe someone may be a violent felon, or I find their behavior suspicious, I reserve the right to sell, or refuse to sell to anybody and aside from that I would sell to biker before I sell to a blood or a crip.

Panfisher · January 24, 2014, 05:04 PM

Would I listen to my "gut instinct". Dang right I would. I don't care about the dress or smell etc., but when someone starts giving off body language or clues that makes you get that hair on the back of your neck standing up feeling, listen to it. At the absolute worst you have denied a sale to a great person who was simply dirty and poorly dressed, I can live with that on my conscience. I have also refused to buy guns from dealers at shows simply based on their actions, there are plenty of firearms to buy I don't need to buy (or sell) one to a dealer who is an jerk.

Now lets add a twist, suppose you had a firearm on consignment at a LGS and that same person who tried to buy it from you (and you turned him down) came into the store while you were looking around, passed every background check etc. and the LGS dealer was preparing to sell it to him, would you say anything then.?

Mainah · January 24, 2014, 05:27 PM

IMHO- if you believe in less government regulation then it's up to you as an individual to make good choices.

January 23, 2014, 10:00 AM	#78
Toolman Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 514	When I received my FFL in 2006, the BATFE sent me 3 books listing all state & federal laws regarding fireams. There is one section that addresses the OP topic. That section tells the FFL holder that 'gut feeling & appearance' is important and even has a graphic to that effect. __________________ Crime Control. NOT Gun Control.

January 21, 2014, 11:09 PM	#77
Justice06RR Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2010 Location: Central FL Posts: 1,360	I don't know if you verified the "kid's" age or not. Some people just look young but in reality they are over 21. A simple ID check can verify this. If he is indeed underage, then they should not sell to him (other than accesories).

January 23, 2014, 10:11 AM	#79
Garycw Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2011 Location: Ohio-Kentucky - florida Posts: 1,221	That would be an interesting graphic to see. Was it clothes? Tattoos, piercings , turban with long beard? Diff ineptly profiling. I go mostly by what comes out of there mouth and body language. In not a ffl, but have bought & sold at least 30 firearms. I've been very lucky and only had one instance where I wouldn't even meet the guy by what he was saying. Maybe I'm the shady one? DOD didn't seem to think so though

January 23, 2014, 06:32 PM	#82
Crankgrinder Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 917	Ive never sold any firearms outside of ffl dealers and coworkers whom I had known for ten years. On the other side of that unless I have reason to believe someone may be a violent felon, or I find their behavior suspicious, I reserve the right to sell, or refuse to sell to anybody and aside from that I would sell to biker before I sell to a blood or a crip.

January 24, 2014, 05:04 PM	#83
Panfisher Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2010 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,337	Would I listen to my "gut instinct". Dang right I would. I don't care about the dress or smell etc., but when someone starts giving off body language or clues that makes you get that hair on the back of your neck standing up feeling, listen to it. At the absolute worst you have denied a sale to a great person who was simply dirty and poorly dressed, I can live with that on my conscience. I have also refused to buy guns from dealers at shows simply based on their actions, there are plenty of firearms to buy I don't need to buy (or sell) one to a dealer who is an jerk. Now lets add a twist, suppose you had a firearm on consignment at a LGS and that same person who tried to buy it from you (and you turned him down) came into the store while you were looking around, passed every background check etc. and the LGS dealer was preparing to sell it to him, would you say anything then.?

January 24, 2014, 05:27 PM	#84
Mainah Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2007 Posts: 1,119	IMHO- if you believe in less government regulation then it's up to you as an individual to make good choices.