I'm pulling to the left

Slateman · September 2, 2005, 07:42 PM

Why? I know someone had a chart, can they please post it again?

I shoot a HK P2000 in 9mm. I have the large backstrap on there.

I think it has to do with my trigger pull. I don't think I'm putting enough pressure on it. I get tired trying to ease it back and end up yanking a lil. I noticed when I applied more pressure, quicker, I got better shots. Though sometimes my second shot seemed a little quick.

Dwight55 · September 2, 2005, 08:51 PM

This is a copy of the one Xavier Breath posted as answer to another poster.

May God bless,
Dwight

HighValleyRanch · September 2, 2005, 10:14 PM

You're either flinching and pushing against the recoil in anticipations,
or you are "snatching" the trigger instead of a nice surprise trigger break.

Is each shot a total surprise? or are you in your mind saying to yourself, pull the trigger now? Either way, go back to holding on the target, take your mind OFF the trigger, let it happen on its own, and have every shot be a surprise.

Take three magazines, load two and leave one empty. Have the slide racked back when the gun is empty. toss the three magazines into a range bag, mix them up without looking at them. Load one of the mags without thinking about the weight, so you do not know whether it is one of the loaded mags or the empty one. Drop the slide and take your shot. If the gun is loaded with the empty mag, and you are flinching, it will show up FAST! My buddy shoots 90% of his shots left, and when I dummy load for him, there is a big flinch! Drops left and down. Yanks the trigger too.
You can load a dummy round in one of the mags too, and when the gun goes off on the dummy, you will get the surprise. If your hold is rock steady through the dry fire, you are doing good!

Slateman · September 2, 2005, 10:51 PM

Snatching is a good way to put it. Thats what I was doing. Its almost like I pull too lightly and then feel I have to hurry up while I'm still sighted on the target.

That sounds good HighValley. Think I'll try that and mixing a couple snap caps in with my loads.

On the positive side, at least I'm not shooting low anymore

HighValleyRanch · September 2, 2005, 11:08 PM

Trigger pull should not be a conscious effort. Never say now and pull the trigger.
But when shooting fast, it is more of a super fast condensed surprise trigger break. Just keep pulling faster, but concentrate only on the hold and forget about the break point.

Also, when pulling the trigger faster, concentrate on keeping your trigger finger middle knuckle "out". don't hinge from the first knuckle, otherwise you will be moving the whole finger left. Keep the middle joint in line with the back of the palm and break from the middle knuckle. It should not move at all.

I just showed this training trick from my bullseye training to my friend who is pulling left:
cut a short dowel the same length as the distance from your trigger to the backstrap. Place the dowel in the web of your hand where the backstrap ould hit and your trigger finger tip, or pad on the other end of the dowel. Practice pulling the dowel BACK in a straight line. If you are pivoting from the knuckle you will see the dowel move left. It should move perfectly straight back. This is a neat practice tool as you can carry the dowel anywhere and practice your trigger pull.

Ozzieman · September 3, 2005, 04:20 PM

Is a very simple test.
BUt it takes a relvolver!
You take a 6 shot somthing at least a 38 and have another person load it for you and only load 4 or 5 rounds. They need to load it so you cannot see where the empties are and then you fire the gun.
When you hit that empty cylinder YOU will see what your doing wrong.
Charts are nice but to much depends on how the gun fits your hand.
If your pulling left you dont know if your pulling some how or pushing intill you try it on a gun that dosent fire.
Also try changing the grip angle, wrap your hand a little farther around the gun and see how it does, it might not be comfortable but it might tell you somthing.
I would also like to add here that every ones imput is good sound advice.

alpineman · September 4, 2005, 04:26 PM

Personally, I shoot down & left when I flinch/anticipate recoil. As a relatively new shooter, it's gonna take me forever to work that out... Wasn't it Yoda who said something like, "you must unlearn that which you have learned".

aspen1964 · September 4, 2005, 05:01 PM

..that scared me after reading the title...for a second, I thought the liberals had another convet...

HighValleyRanch · September 4, 2005, 05:15 PM

aspen1964,
here is a good exercise for you.
Shoot some shots without a target and see if you still flinch.

You must determine if your flinch is in reaction to the noise and recoil, or in anticipation of trying too hard to hit the target.
By shooting at the backstop without aiming, you can focus only on the physical aspects of shooting and see if your flinch is recoil or noise related. If you are still flinching without any specific target in front of you, then it is noise/recoil related.

Also, if you tend to flinch more as the target gets further away, then it usually is trying to hit the target type flinch.

I said this before, but flinch can be from:
1. noise
2. recoil
3. trying too hard and snatching the trigger
4. lack of surprise shot theory
5. any combo of above

MeekAndMild · September 4, 2005, 07:00 PM

Slateman, what stance are you using? The Modified Weaver with firm weak hand counterpressure hides a lot of sins.

Slateman · September 4, 2005, 07:40 PM

Stance?? Whatever is in the NRA guide I got. I didn't know there was more than one . . .

3 weelin geezer · September 5, 2005, 10:15 AM

Do or do not. There is no try. - Yoda 5:30

Slateman · September 5, 2005, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Do or do not. There is no try. - Yoda 5:30

Yoda didn't shoot. Too "uncivilized"

Ozzieman · September 5, 2005, 02:27 PM

Shoot a 22.
I had simular problems back 20 years ago. And a good friend with a lot of experance told me to get a good 22 and shoot and shoot and shoot.
22's are little tiny pop guns, but it taught me one thing.
If you cant shoot a 22 you sure as H--L cant shoot any thing else.
It helped me get past the flinching from recoil and noise.
Ruger Mark II cured me.
I shot it 3 times a week a box of ammo each time.
One other good thing about 22's, your mistakes cost much less.

September 2, 2005, 07:42 PM	#1
Slateman Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2005 Location: Northern VA Posts: 323	I'm pulling to the left Why? I know someone had a chart, can they please post it again? I shoot a HK P2000 in 9mm. I have the large backstrap on there. I think it has to do with my trigger pull. I don't think I'm putting enough pressure on it. I get tired trying to ease it back and end up yanking a lil. I noticed when I applied more pressure, quicker, I got better shots. Though sometimes my second shot seemed a little quick.

September 2, 2005, 10:14 PM	#3
HighValleyRanch Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2005 Posts: 4,066	You're either flinching and pushing against the recoil in anticipations, or you are "snatching" the trigger instead of a nice surprise trigger break. Is each shot a total surprise? or are you in your mind saying to yourself, pull the trigger now? Either way, go back to holding on the target, take your mind OFF the trigger, let it happen on its own, and have every shot be a surprise. Take three magazines, load two and leave one empty. Have the slide racked back when the gun is empty. toss the three magazines into a range bag, mix them up without looking at them. Load one of the mags without thinking about the weight, so you do not know whether it is one of the loaded mags or the empty one. Drop the slide and take your shot. If the gun is loaded with the empty mag, and you are flinching, it will show up FAST! My buddy shoots 90% of his shots left, and when I dummy load for him, there is a big flinch! Drops left and down. Yanks the trigger too. You can load a dummy round in one of the mags too, and when the gun goes off on the dummy, you will get the surprise. If your hold is rock steady through the dry fire, you are doing good! __________________ From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail"

September 2, 2005, 11:08 PM	#5
HighValleyRanch Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2005 Posts: 4,066	Trigger pull should not be a conscious effort. Never say now and pull the trigger. But when shooting fast, it is more of a super fast condensed surprise trigger break. Just keep pulling faster, but concentrate only on the hold and forget about the break point. Also, when pulling the trigger faster, concentrate on keeping your trigger finger middle knuckle "out". don't hinge from the first knuckle, otherwise you will be moving the whole finger left. Keep the middle joint in line with the back of the palm and break from the middle knuckle. It should not move at all. I just showed this training trick from my bullseye training to my friend who is pulling left: cut a short dowel the same length as the distance from your trigger to the backstrap. Place the dowel in the web of your hand where the backstrap ould hit and your trigger finger tip, or pad on the other end of the dowel. Practice pulling the dowel BACK in a straight line. If you are pivoting from the knuckle you will see the dowel move left. It should move perfectly straight back. This is a neat practice tool as you can carry the dowel anywhere and practice your trigger pull. __________________ From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail"

September 3, 2005, 04:20 PM	#6
Ozzieman Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 6,117	The best way I found out what problem a person is causing Is a very simple test. BUt it takes a relvolver! You take a 6 shot somthing at least a 38 and have another person load it for you and only load 4 or 5 rounds. They need to load it so you cannot see where the empties are and then you fire the gun. When you hit that empty cylinder YOU will see what your doing wrong. Charts are nice but to much depends on how the gun fits your hand. If your pulling left you dont know if your pulling some how or pushing intill you try it on a gun that dosent fire. Also try changing the grip angle, wrap your hand a little farther around the gun and see how it does, it might not be comfortable but it might tell you somthing. I would also like to add here that every ones imput is good sound advice.

September 4, 2005, 04:26 PM	#7
alpineman Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 2005 Location: Kentucky Posts: 227	Personally, I shoot down & left when I flinch/anticipate recoil. As a relatively new shooter, it's gonna take me forever to work that out... Wasn't it Yoda who said something like, "you must unlearn that which you have learned". __________________ Alpinespew http://www.alpinespew.blogspot.com/

September 2, 2005, 10:51 PM	#4
Slateman Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2005 Location: Northern VA Posts: 323	Snatching is a good way to put it. Thats what I was doing. Its almost like I pull too lightly and then feel I have to hurry up while I'm still sighted on the target. That sounds good HighValley. Think I'll try that and mixing a couple snap caps in with my loads. On the positive side, at least I'm not shooting low anymore

September 4, 2005, 05:01 PM	#8
aspen1964 Senior Member Join Date: August 20, 2005 Posts: 1,030	..that scared me after reading the title...for a second, I thought the liberals had another convet...

September 4, 2005, 05:15 PM	#9
HighValleyRanch Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2005 Posts: 4,066	aspen1964, here is a good exercise for you. Shoot some shots without a target and see if you still flinch. You must determine if your flinch is in reaction to the noise and recoil, or in anticipation of trying too hard to hit the target. By shooting at the backstop without aiming, you can focus only on the physical aspects of shooting and see if your flinch is recoil or noise related. If you are still flinching without any specific target in front of you, then it is noise/recoil related. Also, if you tend to flinch more as the target gets further away, then it usually is trying to hit the target type flinch. I said this before, but flinch can be from: 1. noise 2. recoil 3. trying too hard and snatching the trigger 4. lack of surprise shot theory 5. any combo of above __________________ From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail"

September 4, 2005, 07:00 PM	#10
MeekAndMild Senior Member Join Date: August 2, 2001 Posts: 4,988	Slateman, what stance are you using? The Modified Weaver with firm weak hand counterpressure hides a lot of sins. __________________ In a few years when the dust finally clears and people start counting their change there is a pretty good chance that President Obama may become known as The Great Absquatulator. You heard it first here on TFL.

September 4, 2005, 07:40 PM	#11
Slateman Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2005 Location: Northern VA Posts: 323	Stance?? Whatever is in the NRA guide I got. I didn't know there was more than one . . .

September 5, 2005, 10:15 AM	#12
3 weelin geezer Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2004 Posts: 438	Do or do not. There is no try. - Yoda 5:30

September 5, 2005, 02:27 PM	#14
Ozzieman Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 6,117	Lots of good advice here but you might try one other thing Shoot a 22. I had simular problems back 20 years ago. And a good friend with a lot of experance told me to get a good 22 and shoot and shoot and shoot. 22's are little tiny pop guns, but it taught me one thing. If you cant shoot a 22 you sure as H--L cant shoot any thing else. It helped me get past the flinching from recoil and noise. Ruger Mark II cured me. I shot it 3 times a week a box of ammo each time. One other good thing about 22's, your mistakes cost much less.