.45 Caliber...264 gr @ 1,200 FPS VS. 362 gr @ 950 FPS

Southern Shooter · May 21, 2012, 09:18 AM

From a revolver, if you had to choose between these two for convenient woods protection in the lower 48 states, which would you choose??

Top:
.454
264 grains
Round Flat-nose
@1,200 FPS
90358-250x250.jpg

OR

Bottom:
.454
362 grains
Wide Flat-nose
@950 FPS
Accurate Molds 45-360C.png

Wyosmith · May 21, 2012, 10:08 AM

Your question is way too vague.
"Woods" can be in Arkansas and in Georgia. They can also be in Wyoming or Alaska.
Arkansas and Georgia have no Grizzly bears!
However you may have a run-in with a 2 legged predator in the south more often than you would in Alaska or Wyoming.
Protection from what?

Secondly, bullet weight is only a small part of the question. How about bullet construction and bullet shape?

Again, the question is "What is the target"?
A 225 grain Hollow Point is vastly superior for defending yourself against human predators compared to a 360 grain round nose. But a 335 Grain LBT Flat nose is going to be a LOT better than a hollow point if you need to shoot a large bear, a moose, a buffalo, and so on. If you get an LBT flat nose over 1250 FPS it will make as large or even larger a hole in flesh (cavitation) then most hollow points and do it about 400% to 500% deeper.

Again, what do you need to shoot?

What I recommended as an "all around load" (when I was running cast Performance bullet Co I got that question probably 20 times a week) is a 325 grain LBT Bullet at about 1200 FPS zeroed at 50 yards. That load leaves 1.25" permanent wound channels through flesh and bone, and will shoot clear through a large elk from a quartering angle. In most Ruger revolvers it also will shoot 50 yard groups of 2 1/2". That would do for killing a bob cat, and also is ok for a mad moose. The only down side is that you MUST know what is behind your target because unless it has tracks on it, the bullet is probably going right through it.

Southern Shooter · May 21, 2012, 10:11 AM

Well, the pictures should tell a lot of the needed information. I will add that water-quenched clip-on wheel weights are the material used.

Wyosmith · May 21, 2012, 10:13 AM

Ahh I am having a senior moment.
I now see you DID show the bullets in question. My mistake.
Sorry

So...back to it;
Given the velocities you list with those bullets I would have to say you probably are not going to see a lot of difference in most of your targets. If you could get the larger bullet up to 1100 or 1200 you will see a difference, but I don't know what gun you will be using so it's had to say what would be "better"
If you have the bullets (not just waiting on the molds) I'd shoot 300 of each with different powders and see which one your gun shoots better, and go with it.
If you are asking what mold to buy, I'd ask you what gun you have first.
PM me and I'll give you a phone numebr and we can talk. I made a living doing this kind of thing for a long time, so i do know something about it.

Southern Shooter · May 21, 2012, 10:26 AM

Ha ha...that is ok. I am starting to have those moments, too.

I actually do have both of those molds.

If I load 24 grains of W296 the 362 grain boolit will go between 1,070 and 1,100 FPS. But, to be honest with you, it is a beast to shoot from the Ruger SRH Alaskan with the short barrel. The first 20 shots are ok. But, then I start to pay the price.

So, that is why I was looking for something a bit easier to shoot more frequently. Something I could protect myself in the woods with and also shoot for fun when the moment arises. I have been loading that lighter bullet up to around 1,200 FPS and it is not too bad to shoot. But, really wanted a comparison between the two.

And, honestly, I would like to simplify my life, here...one bullet that I can become very familiar with its behavior under various conditions. One that I can adjust the charge back and forth as needed.

chewie146 · May 21, 2012, 12:55 PM

362 grain

black mamba · May 21, 2012, 05:50 PM

I would split the difference and go with a 315 grainer at 1100 fps.

But between those two, I'd go with the lighter bullet higher velocity combo--
plenty of oomph and better trajectory.

Art Eatman · May 21, 2012, 07:40 PM

"The first 20 shots are ok. But, then I start to pay the price."

Seems to me that shots numbers 1 and maybe 2 are the most important...

farmerboy · May 21, 2012, 07:59 PM

I'd choose after I got through shooting and see which my gun likes better as in accuracy. If one is printing 2" groups at 25 yds and the other is 7". I'd go with the one that you can do the 2" with. But keep playing with all components and charges and you'll find a really good recipe I'm sure.

Buzzcook · May 21, 2012, 10:50 PM

Sweet Jimminy Crickets are you planning on running into loup garou?

Either load will do fine for everything you're likely to run into in the lower 48. So pick the one you're more accurate with.

Old Grump · May 22, 2012, 12:56 PM

Most accurate ones, all else is details. I can shoot my 950 fps, 250 gr LSWC into a one hole group at 50' so it beats the dickens out of the giddy up go 185 gr loads or the 325 gr stuff. I might change my mind if I was in a herd of irritated bison but for anything you are likely to see get the most accurate load you can shoot. The extra boom don't mean a thing if all you do is make a hole in the wind.

mavracer · May 22, 2012, 01:13 PM

Either would be more than enough for me. I'd have no problems walkin anywhere in the lower 48 with some 255gr SWC @950fps

jmr40 · May 22, 2012, 02:25 PM

Quote:

for convenient woods protection in the lower 48 states,

For your intended purpose, in the lower 48 either are WAY more than I'd be interested in. My personal choice is a Glock 20, with a quality 4" 357 mag revolver a close 2nd choice.

Despite all the hype protecion from 2 legged predators is a far more serious concern. I'd make my choice with that in mind, and actually carrry my Glock26 most of the time. If there is a possibility of bear, then either a properly loaded 357 or 10mm is more than adequate for the job, without being too big and cumbersome to carry around.

If I were in areas with really large bears I might make the same choices, and for the same reasons, but would rather carry a lightweight carbine in a suitable chambering. They aren't much larger and heavier than those hand cannons.

1tfl · May 23, 2012, 09:55 AM

I picked up a 4 5/8" Ruger Flattop in 45Colt/45ACP recently for carrying around in the woods. I've tried couple different loads in it but decided to stick with 265gr WFN @ 1,000 fps. I can hit clay birds with it out to about 40 yards with every shot and I can shoot 50+ rounds at a time.
This compact combo will do anything I need done around here.

Southern Shooter · May 23, 2012, 10:37 AM

1tfl,
Which section of the country are you from?

1tfl · May 23, 2012, 10:56 AM

I'm in Central Florida.

May 21, 2012, 09:18 AM	#1
Southern Shooter Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2005 Location: central Louisiana Posts: 469	.45 Caliber...264 gr @ 1,200 FPS VS. 362 gr @ 950 FPS From a revolver, if you had to choose between these two for convenient woods protection in the lower 48 states, which would you choose?? Top: .454 264 grains Round Flat-nose @1,200 FPS 90358-250x250.jpg OR Bottom: .454 362 grains Wide Flat-nose @950 FPS Accurate Molds 45-360C.png __________________ "My plea is that we stop seeking out the storm and enjoy more fully sunlight. I am suggesting that as we go through life we accentuate the positive. I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still our voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment and endorse virtue and effort." Gordon B. Hinckley Last edited by Southern Shooter; May 21, 2012 at 11:31 AM.

May 21, 2012, 10:11 AM	#3
Southern Shooter Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2005 Location: central Louisiana Posts: 469	Design and contruction Well, the pictures should tell a lot of the needed information. I will add that water-quenched clip-on wheel weights are the material used. __________________ "My plea is that we stop seeking out the storm and enjoy more fully sunlight. I am suggesting that as we go through life we accentuate the positive. I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still our voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment and endorse virtue and effort." Gordon B. Hinckley

May 21, 2012, 10:26 AM	#5
Southern Shooter Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2005 Location: central Louisiana Posts: 469	362 grain @1,070-1,100 FPS Ha ha...that is ok. I am starting to have those moments, too. I actually do have both of those molds. If I load 24 grains of W296 the 362 grain boolit will go between 1,070 and 1,100 FPS. But, to be honest with you, it is a beast to shoot from the Ruger SRH Alaskan with the short barrel. The first 20 shots are ok. But, then I start to pay the price. So, that is why I was looking for something a bit easier to shoot more frequently. Something I could protect myself in the woods with and also shoot for fun when the moment arises. I have been loading that lighter bullet up to around 1,200 FPS and it is not too bad to shoot. But, really wanted a comparison between the two. And, honestly, I would like to simplify my life, here...one bullet that I can become very familiar with its behavior under various conditions. One that I can adjust the charge back and forth as needed. __________________ "My plea is that we stop seeking out the storm and enjoy more fully sunlight. I am suggesting that as we go through life we accentuate the positive. I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still our voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment and endorse virtue and effort." Gordon B. Hinckley Last edited by Southern Shooter; May 21, 2012 at 03:15 PM.

May 22, 2012, 12:56 PM	#11
Old Grump Member in memoriam Join Date: April 9, 2009 Location: Blue River Wisconsin, in Posts: 3,144	Most accurate ones, all else is details. I can shoot my 950 fps, 250 gr LSWC into a one hole group at 50' so it beats the dickens out of the giddy up go 185 gr loads or the 325 gr stuff. I might change my mind if I was in a herd of irritated bison but for anything you are likely to see get the most accurate load you can shoot. The extra boom don't mean a thing if all you do is make a hole in the wind. __________________ Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern will, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters. --Daniel Webster--

May 23, 2012, 10:37 AM	#15
Southern Shooter Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2005 Location: central Louisiana Posts: 469	1tfl 1tfl, Which section of the country are you from? __________________ "My plea is that we stop seeking out the storm and enjoy more fully sunlight. I am suggesting that as we go through life we accentuate the positive. I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still our voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment and endorse virtue and effort." Gordon B. Hinckley

May 21, 2012, 10:08 AM	#2
Wyosmith Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2010 Location: Shoshoni Wyoming Posts: 2,713	Your question is way too vague. "Woods" can be in Arkansas and in Georgia. They can also be in Wyoming or Alaska. Arkansas and Georgia have no Grizzly bears! However you may have a run-in with a 2 legged predator in the south more often than you would in Alaska or Wyoming. Protection from what? Secondly, bullet weight is only a small part of the question. How about bullet construction and bullet shape? Again, the question is "What is the target"? A 225 grain Hollow Point is vastly superior for defending yourself against human predators compared to a 360 grain round nose. But a 335 Grain LBT Flat nose is going to be a LOT better than a hollow point if you need to shoot a large bear, a moose, a buffalo, and so on. If you get an LBT flat nose over 1250 FPS it will make as large or even larger a hole in flesh (cavitation) then most hollow points and do it about 400% to 500% deeper. Again, what do you need to shoot? What I recommended as an "all around load" (when I was running cast Performance bullet Co I got that question probably 20 times a week) is a 325 grain LBT Bullet at about 1200 FPS zeroed at 50 yards. That load leaves 1.25" permanent wound channels through flesh and bone, and will shoot clear through a large elk from a quartering angle. In most Ruger revolvers it also will shoot 50 yard groups of 2 1/2". That would do for killing a bob cat, and also is ok for a mad moose. The only down side is that you MUST know what is behind your target because unless it has tracks on it, the bullet is probably going right through it.

May 21, 2012, 10:13 AM	#4
Wyosmith Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2010 Location: Shoshoni Wyoming Posts: 2,713	Ahh I am having a senior moment. I now see you DID show the bullets in question. My mistake. Sorry So...back to it; Given the velocities you list with those bullets I would have to say you probably are not going to see a lot of difference in most of your targets. If you could get the larger bullet up to 1100 or 1200 you will see a difference, but I don't know what gun you will be using so it's had to say what would be "better" If you have the bullets (not just waiting on the molds) I'd shoot 300 of each with different powders and see which one your gun shoots better, and go with it. If you are asking what mold to buy, I'd ask you what gun you have first. PM me and I'll give you a phone numebr and we can talk. I made a living doing this kind of thing for a long time, so i do know something about it.

May 21, 2012, 12:55 PM	#6
chewie146 Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2010 Location: New Mexico Posts: 853	362 grain

May 21, 2012, 05:50 PM	#7
black mamba Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2011 Location: SW Florida Posts: 890	I would split the difference and go with a 315 grainer at 1100 fps. But between those two, I'd go with the lighter bullet higher velocity combo-- plenty of oomph and better trajectory.

May 21, 2012, 07:40 PM	#8
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	"The first 20 shots are ok. But, then I start to pay the price." Seems to me that shots numbers 1 and maybe 2 are the most important...

May 21, 2012, 07:59 PM	#9
farmerboy Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 1,343	I'd choose after I got through shooting and see which my gun likes better as in accuracy. If one is printing 2" groups at 25 yds and the other is 7". I'd go with the one that you can do the 2" with. But keep playing with all components and charges and you'll find a really good recipe I'm sure.

May 21, 2012, 10:50 PM	#10
Buzzcook Senior Member Join Date: November 29, 2007 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 6,126	Sweet Jimminy Crickets are you planning on running into loup garou? Either load will do fine for everything you're likely to run into in the lower 48. So pick the one you're more accurate with.

May 23, 2012, 09:55 AM	#14
1tfl Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2007 Posts: 287	I picked up a 4 5/8" Ruger Flattop in 45Colt/45ACP recently for carrying around in the woods. I've tried couple different loads in it but decided to stick with 265gr WFN @ 1,000 fps. I can hit clay birds with it out to about 40 yards with every shot and I can shoot 50+ rounds at a time. This compact combo will do anything I need done around here.

May 23, 2012, 10:56 AM	#16
1tfl Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2007 Posts: 287	I'm in Central Florida.

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