Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr

Unkei · April 28, 2016, 10:34 AM

Hi,
I bought an Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr, at a local gunshow. The finish is totally gone..but no rust. I checked the breaktop mechanism at the show and though a bit sticky, it worked ok. The gunshow required nylon tie was holding the hammer tightly shut, and I didn't have the sense to ask him to remove it...dumb me! LOL! But I paid a bit less than the asking price. I just love breaktops! Got the breaktop mechanism working smoothly, but when I removed the plastic security tie from the hammer..boy was I pissed! About a hundred pound trigger pull!!! The gun locks up tight and seems to be properly timed. I have tried using WD40 on the action in the hope that the trigger pull would loosen up, but did so only slightly. Not being a gunsmith...is there any lube or spray of any kind that would help free up this trigger pull?
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Unkei

Lohman446 · April 28, 2016, 10:40 AM

I had one of those in 32 once. I think that trigger pull is normal.

James K · April 28, 2016, 07:16 PM

Since I don't know your experience, I can't judge what might seem to you to be a hard trigger pull. I can tell you that those .22's normally have a hard pull, a lot harder than the same gun in .32 S&W because the light hammer requires a hard blow to set off the .22 rimfire round.

I will advise not using WD-40 inside a gun, since it can gum up the works if left in for a long period of time. Also, that gun should be set up so the firing pin won't contact the cylinder, but with rimfires it is never a bad idea to use snap caps when dry firing not only to preserve the breech face, but also to cushion the firing pin and prevent breakage.

Jim

Unkei · April 28, 2016, 08:51 PM

Hi Jim K,
Well I was a Deputy Sheriff for 35 years, and have collected and fired many handguns including both Semi-Autos and Revolvers. When I say it has what seems to be a hundred pound trigger pull, I do not exagerate. The only way I can get it to point of release is place my finger nearly through the trigger guard and exert great force. I kept my left index finger between hammer and firing pin to prevent any dry fire as I had no empty brass or snapcaps. It is almost as if the trigger mechanism was welded in place. But that is not so as I can actuate the trigger when sufficient force is applied.
Just looking for a product that might help to loosen it up. Failing that, I will take it to my gunsmith for repair.
Unkei

James K · April 29, 2016, 01:30 PM

I have had good success with G96 Gun Treatment as a penetrant and cleaner. I would try just spraying the heck out of the insides and see what happens. I have opened up a lot of those old guns and the problem has often been home repairs, in one instance a mainspring replaced with a piece cut from an industrial hacksaw blade. Now that was a trigger pull and a half!

Jim

Unkei · April 29, 2016, 07:31 PM

Hey Jim K,
Thanks for that! I am going to a gunshow tomorrow and will see if anyone has the G96 Gun Treatment there. If not..I'm sure I can get some at my local range. They have a full (Large) gun shop there with just about anything you can imagine. It's a great range also, and both my wife and I are members in the retired LEO catagory. It gets us free range time Mon thru Friday and reduced rates on weekends. They even provide free shooting glasses and ears, though we have our own gear. The only thing I have trouble I have is figuring out the computerized target programs! LOL!
Thanks again,
Dave

thibaultfelix40 · May 10, 2016, 05:18 AM

I have had luck softening da revolver pulls by just letting them sit on the shelf with the hammer fully cocked. You can smooth one up by cocking the hammer, grabbing the barrel in one hand , push the hammer down into a table top and pull the trigger. This has worked for me with Winchester 94 rifles.

gyvel · May 10, 2016, 12:03 PM

Just go to Walmart and get a can or two of Supertech carb cleaner. It is a degreaser and degummer. I suspect someone may have already used WD 40 on the innards and it has turned to varnish as it is prone to do. That will definitely cause a "hundred pound" trigger pull.

Bill DeShivs · May 10, 2016, 01:15 PM

thibaultfelix40-
Don't quit your day job. Your future in gunsmithing is in doubt.
Neither of your suggestions are good ones. Leaving a gun cocked won't help the trigger pull, and your second recommendation can ruin the sear.

reddog81 · May 10, 2016, 01:53 PM

Any good solvent should clean up a gummed up old action - Mineral spirits, acetone, brake cleaner, kerosene, CLP spray. Make sure to not let the solvent touch the wood or plastic grips.

James K · May 10, 2016, 04:00 PM

Many products will de-grease or de-gum guns, but will leave the surface bare, inviting rust. I suggested G96 because it leaves a protective film (though it is NOT a lubricant) and won't harm wood, wood finish, hard rubber or plastic.

Jim

thibaultfelix40 · May 10, 2016, 09:31 PM

Bill Deshivs have you ever tried my reccomendations? I only made them because I tried them and they worked. I got a useable da trigger on my Nagant revolver and Hopkins and Allen No 6. Both of these revolvers are notorious for stiff triggers. The trigger burnishing trick was published in Gun Tests. I have had no trouble with the few I have done this to. Works for me.

Bill DeShivs · May 10, 2016, 10:54 PM

No, I haven't tried your methods, nor am I likely to.

I work on guns properly and I make springs-lots of springs.

Gun Tests magazine is useless- it's too rough for toilet paper, and it's articles are generally sophomoric at best.

James K · May 10, 2016, 10:59 PM

I honestly doubt that either a cleaner or thibaultfelix40's recommendations will help. The only way to tell what is wrong will be for someone who knows what he is looking at to take the gun apart and see what is wrong. And that can be a problem because those old guns always come apart easier than they go back together.

I hope a gunsmith can and will help. I say that because many smiths just won't work on old IJ's and H&R's; the frustration factor is very high, parts are scarce, and few people want to pay more for repairs than the gun is worth.

Jim

johnwilliamson062 · May 13, 2016, 08:03 PM

Quote:

I hope a gunsmith can and will help.

I know one just on the other side of springfield who can probably help you out. The problem is, even though I consider his rates very fair, it would probably cost you more than you paid for the gun.

James K · May 13, 2016, 10:04 PM

Many smiths have been "stung" (as I have) when a customer asked them to work on an old gun, often claiming that it had sentimental value and price was no object. When the work was done, and the bill presented, the customer replied, "Hell, that's more than the old junker is worth, keep the darned thing", and walked out the door.

I finally took on those guns on a basis of "no guarantee" and a non-refundable deposit. I had few takers, which was fine by me.

Jim

EvilE · May 27, 2016, 12:39 AM

Try Ballistol. Love that stuff!

April 28, 2016, 10:34 AM	#1
Unkei Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2010 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 8	Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr Hi, I bought an Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr, at a local gunshow. The finish is totally gone..but no rust. I checked the breaktop mechanism at the show and though a bit sticky, it worked ok. The gunshow required nylon tie was holding the hammer tightly shut, and I didn't have the sense to ask him to remove it...dumb me! LOL! But I paid a bit less than the asking price. I just love breaktops! Got the breaktop mechanism working smoothly, but when I removed the plastic security tie from the hammer..boy was I pissed! About a hundred pound trigger pull!!! The gun locks up tight and seems to be properly timed. I have tried using WD40 on the action in the hope that the trigger pull would loosen up, but did so only slightly. Not being a gunsmith...is there any lube or spray of any kind that would help free up this trigger pull? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Unkei __________________ “Hell…there’s only one fight.” David L. (Bigfoot) Green Deputy Sheriff 1976-2010…Ret

April 28, 2016, 08:51 PM	#4
Unkei Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2010 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 8	Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr Hi Jim K, Well I was a Deputy Sheriff for 35 years, and have collected and fired many handguns including both Semi-Autos and Revolvers. When I say it has what seems to be a hundred pound trigger pull, I do not exagerate. The only way I can get it to point of release is place my finger nearly through the trigger guard and exert great force. I kept my left index finger between hammer and firing pin to prevent any dry fire as I had no empty brass or snapcaps. It is almost as if the trigger mechanism was welded in place. But that is not so as I can actuate the trigger when sufficient force is applied. Just looking for a product that might help to loosen it up. Failing that, I will take it to my gunsmith for repair. Unkei __________________ “Hell…there’s only one fight.” David L. (Bigfoot) Green Deputy Sheriff 1976-2010…Ret

April 29, 2016, 07:31 PM	#6
Unkei Junior Member Join Date: December 23, 2010 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 8	Iver Johnson 7 shot breaktop 22 lr Hey Jim K, Thanks for that! I am going to a gunshow tomorrow and will see if anyone has the G96 Gun Treatment there. If not..I'm sure I can get some at my local range. They have a full (Large) gun shop there with just about anything you can imagine. It's a great range also, and both my wife and I are members in the retired LEO catagory. It gets us free range time Mon thru Friday and reduced rates on weekends. They even provide free shooting glasses and ears, though we have our own gear. The only thing I have trouble I have is figuring out the computerized target programs! LOL! Thanks again, Dave __________________ “Hell…there’s only one fight.” David L. (Bigfoot) Green Deputy Sheriff 1976-2010…Ret

May 10, 2016, 05:18 AM	#7
thibaultfelix40 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2011 Posts: 154	I have had luck softening da revolver pulls by just letting them sit on the shelf with the hammer fully cocked. You can smooth one up by cocking the hammer, grabbing the barrel in one hand , push the hammer down into a table top and pull the trigger. This has worked for me with Winchester 94 rifles. __________________ olafhardt

May 10, 2016, 12:03 PM	#8
gyvel Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2009 Location: Northern AZ Posts: 7,172	Just go to Walmart and get a can or two of Supertech carb cleaner. It is a degreaser and degummer. I suspect someone may have already used WD 40 on the innards and it has turned to varnish as it is prone to do. That will definitely cause a "hundred pound" trigger pull. __________________ As always, YMMV. __________________________________________ MIIAA SIFE

April 28, 2016, 10:40 AM	#2
Lohman446 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 2016 Posts: 2,192	I had one of those in 32 once. I think that trigger pull is normal.

April 28, 2016, 07:16 PM	#3
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Since I don't know your experience, I can't judge what might seem to you to be a hard trigger pull. I can tell you that those .22's normally have a hard pull, a lot harder than the same gun in .32 S&W because the light hammer requires a hard blow to set off the .22 rimfire round. I will advise not using WD-40 inside a gun, since it can gum up the works if left in for a long period of time. Also, that gun should be set up so the firing pin won't contact the cylinder, but with rimfires it is never a bad idea to use snap caps when dry firing not only to preserve the breech face, but also to cushion the firing pin and prevent breakage. Jim

April 29, 2016, 01:30 PM	#5
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I have had good success with G96 Gun Treatment as a penetrant and cleaner. I would try just spraying the heck out of the insides and see what happens. I have opened up a lot of those old guns and the problem has often been home repairs, in one instance a mainspring replaced with a piece cut from an industrial hacksaw blade. Now that was a trigger pull and a half! Jim

May 10, 2016, 01:15 PM	#9
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,982	thibaultfelix40- Don't quit your day job. Your future in gunsmithing is in doubt. Neither of your suggestions are good ones. Leaving a gun cocked won't help the trigger pull, and your second recommendation can ruin the sear. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

May 10, 2016, 01:53 PM	#10
reddog81 Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	Any good solvent should clean up a gummed up old action - Mineral spirits, acetone, brake cleaner, kerosene, CLP spray. Make sure to not let the solvent touch the wood or plastic grips.

May 10, 2016, 04:00 PM	#11
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Many products will de-grease or de-gum guns, but will leave the surface bare, inviting rust. I suggested G96 because it leaves a protective film (though it is NOT a lubricant) and won't harm wood, wood finish, hard rubber or plastic. Jim

May 10, 2016, 09:31 PM	#12
thibaultfelix40 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2011 Posts: 154	Bill Deshivs have you ever tried my reccomendations? I only made them because I tried them and they worked. I got a useable da trigger on my Nagant revolver and Hopkins and Allen No 6. Both of these revolvers are notorious for stiff triggers. The trigger burnishing trick was published in Gun Tests. I have had no trouble with the few I have done this to. Works for me. __________________ olafhardt

May 10, 2016, 10:54 PM	#13
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,982	No, I haven't tried your methods, nor am I likely to. I work on guns properly and I make springs-lots of springs. Gun Tests magazine is useless- it's too rough for toilet paper, and it's articles are generally sophomoric at best. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

May 10, 2016, 10:59 PM	#14
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I honestly doubt that either a cleaner or thibaultfelix40's recommendations will help. The only way to tell what is wrong will be for someone who knows what he is looking at to take the gun apart and see what is wrong. And that can be a problem because those old guns always come apart easier than they go back together. I hope a gunsmith can and will help. I say that because many smiths just won't work on old IJ's and H&R's; the frustration factor is very high, parts are scarce, and few people want to pay more for repairs than the gun is worth. Jim

May 13, 2016, 10:04 PM	#16
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Many smiths have been "stung" (as I have) when a customer asked them to work on an old gun, often claiming that it had sentimental value and price was no object. When the work was done, and the bill presented, the customer replied, "Hell, that's more than the old junker is worth, keep the darned thing", and walked out the door. I finally took on those guns on a basis of "no guarantee" and a non-refundable deposit. I had few takers, which was fine by me. Jim

May 27, 2016, 12:39 AM	#17
EvilE Member Join Date: June 13, 2014 Location: Sonoran desert Posts: 93	Try Ballistol. Love that stuff! __________________ CRIMINALS PREFER UNARMED VICTIMS!