Taurus Model 44 jamming during firing?

[ryan1985]

Hello everyone this is my first post here and I have a lot of questions. Took my ar15 and my .44mag revolver to the range recently. I've put around a 1000 rounds through my ar that I made myself with absolutely no hiccups but suprisingly my supposed reliable revolver is jamming? It's a Taurus Model 44 with a 4 inch barrel and it has only fired around 50 shots since I bought it in 2008.

The problem occurs when trying to fire it in single action mode and doesn't seem to affect the double action mechanism at all. I usually use single action as I can aim better that way since the trigger pull of the double action can cause my aim to be off. What usually happens is after firing the first shot the mechanism gets immediately locked up when I try to pull the hammer back to fire a second shot. At that point I have to manually turn the cylinder myself to free the mechanism or fire it normally as a double action revolver. The double action seems to work just fine and I can fire all 6 rounds in quick succession just fine. The single action seems to only lock up after the first shot and then will work for a couple shots and then lock up again randomly so I'm perplexed here.

Can anyone point me in a direction of what to look at here? I have decent mechanical skills I've rebuilt engines, transmissions, rear axles, made my own ammo and built my own ar15 from spare parts so with a little guidance I'm sure I can fix this myself. Thanks for any help on this

[ryan1985]

I should also mention that these are not handloads I've only handloaded for my ar15 so far. It has happended with several different brands of ammo and several different loads.

[spacecoast]

There are Youtube videos available that show you how to disassemble a S&W revolver, presumably Tauri are very similiar since I believe they copy many if not all of the design elements of the S&W. Note - DO NOT PRY the side plate, after the screws are removed use a screwdriver handle to rap on the frame handle and the side plate will loosen and work itself off.

It could be that there is some debris inside, or poorly finished moving parts that could benefit from cleanup or a bit of polishing. More shooting will also help to polish any rough spots on the parts, but taking the side plate off a revolver once in a while to inspect and clean out gunk is a good idea.

Note - SA is fine from time to time (and would be used for hunting), but all defensive shooting should be practiced DA. Learning how to hold the sight picture all the way through the long DA trigger pull is a big part of learning to shoot a revolver.

I hesitate to recommend that you send it back to Taurus, but others undoubtedly will. There are reasons I don't own any Taurus firearms, and dealing with service hassles reported here by others is one of them.

[jad0110]

Sounds like either a problem with the single action sear and/or engagement surfaces on the trigger and hammer. If say, the sear angle is rough or it isn't cut to the proper angle, it can result in many different problems. Just curious, with an unloaded gun obviously, have you tried pushing or wiggling the hammer when it is cocked to see if it lets off? That could provide more clues.

I've owned 3 Tauri, and had to send one back under warranty. I wouldn't recommend doing that (not only are they unlpleasant to deal with, Taurus actuallly made the gun worse). It's pretty easy to screw up a revolver's internal workings by removing too much metal, or not getting engagement surface angles just right. If you find it's not something you want to mess with, my recommendation would be to take it to a reputable gunsmith.

[jrinne0430]

I had a very simular problem with my M44 years back. There where some rough spots/poorly finished internals (cant remember which parts in particular). As stated above, Taurus' customer service needs more to be desired. I eneded up sending it back to Taurus for repair (you have to pay for the overnight shipping). After numerous calls to their customer service, 6 months later I they sent it back. Problem was fixed but was not pleasent dealing with them.

[g.willikers]

It could also be a problem with the hand and the extractor on the back of the cylinder, the parts that rotate the cylinder.
Since sending it back to Taurus seems to be unpopular, and since you have strong mechanical skills, it would be best to start learning how the thing works and what all the parts do.
Youtube videos, web searches, service manuals, 'etc.
Maybe you can figure it out just by looking inside and moving parts around.
Check for Taurus and Smith and Wesson, as they are very similar.

[ryan1985]

Ok spacecoast from what you just said I think I made a big mistake in the past. I DID pry that plate off in the past this was my first gun and I'll just be honest here I DID pry it off a couple times to clean the mechanism. I pryed against the hammer with a small flat blade screwdriver and am pretty embarrassed that I did so in hindsight. I didn't mess with or try to take apart the mechanism at all though I just sprayed it real good with some powder blast and oiled it a couple times. What problems might have been caused by this? I'm at work now but I'll take it apart as soon as I get home and take a look at it. This time of course I WILL TAP it off instead. I know a whole lot about ar's but I admit I put no real effort into learning about my revovler as I've been concentrated on learning about my rifle instead. Hopefully all isn't lost and I can fix whatever I screwed up here.

[g.willikers]

If the side plate has been damaged, like it's bowed, it will be obvious as to how it fits or not on the frame.
If it has, that alone can cause misalignment of essential parts.
Take a look at it before even taking it off, again.
If memory serves, the side plate is not just a cover, but holds some parts in place.

[spacecoast]

Well, what's done is done, if you had done serious damage to the side plate it wouldn't fit correctly and you would notice it when reassembling so you may be OK. I don't know if that in itself would cause an issue with the internals, but I suppose it's possible. I would look for any fresh tool marks inside.

[ryan1985]

Ok other than a nick on the plate where the screwdriver pryed against it still fit tight and seemed pretty flush to me. Are replacement parts hard to come by for this revolver? I mean if worst comes to worst could I replace the plate and any damaged internals? Are the pins that attach to the frame replaceable if they got bent or anything? Thanks for the help guys

[spacecoast]

I don't know about Taurus replacement parts but replacement parts are readily available for S&Ws. Numrich and Brownells are two places to check if you think you have a problem with a part. A bent pin would I think require a gunsmith, but would interfere with DA as well so I doubt if that's an issue.

Also ensure that you got the hammer block (looks like a miniature skeleton key, see below) back in place correctly last time you took it apart. On a S&W, it needs to be slid all the way UP on the post with the little flag on the end pointed into the revolver before the side plate is pressed back on. I have no idea if a problem with that could cause your symptoms.

[ryan1985]

Ok that makes me feel better because the DA functions just fine and is capable of rapid fire without a hiccup. I didn't actually touch the mechanism at all when I took the plate off but I will check the hammer block like you said. All I did was blast the inside real good with a can of powder blast and put some slip2000 on the moving parts. I've bought spare parts for my ar on brownells and midway before but haven't looked for parts for my revolver yet. I do remeber back in 2009 I lost one of the side plate screws and had a hard time finding one and could only get it from taurus.

It's odd I can cock and de-cock it to my heart's content and it doesn't jam it's only after firing a round that cause the SA to jam up.

[ryan1985]

I think that's what has me so confused here this only happens when firing a round. It doesn't matter if I have rounds in the cylinder or not I can cock and de-cock continuously with no problem and the cylinder spins no problem. It's as if the jarring action of firing is causing something to get misaligned. Now that I think about that some more maybe that does point to a warpage of the side plate? It isn't possible that I warped the acutal frame by prying it off right? I wouldn't think so it's a heavy frame made from SS if I could warp it by hand that easy I'd be suprised.

[ryan1985]

It looks like after a quick search that if I need any parts I'll have to go through Taurus directly. My next revolver will definetly be a S&W and I'll sure as hell be more careful with it.

[g.willikers]

Since it only acts up after firing a round, have you checked to see if the primers are staying put in the fired cases?
If even one is sneaking out, that alone could jam up the works.
Just a thought.
Also check the cylinder motion, fore and aft in the frame.
Is it overly loose or tight?

[ryan1985]

I did come across some people saying that about the primers I kept my empties since I intend to start handloading for my .44 too at some point in the future so I'll take a look at them when I get home. This happened with several brands of ammo though so I'm assuming the problem is with the gun. I shot 240gr remington SP's, 280gr winchester SP's, 280gr horandy HP's and a few double tap 320gr WFN's and all had the same problem. I'll check the cylinder but I'm not sure exactly what it's supposed to feel like but it dosen't feel like it's changed since I bought it.

I'll report back to you after I get home this afternoon and get it taken apart.

[g.willikers]

Come to think, the problem could also be at the other end of the cartridges.
The bullets could be sneaking out forward under recoil, and jamming the rotation of the cylinder against the barrel.
Unfortunately the only way to know this is while shooting the gun.
Both the primer and bullet problems would no doubt show up shooting DA, too, though.
But it's worth a look see.

[jad0110]

That is odd that it doesn't happen in dry firing, but does with live ammo. And only in SA. OTH, in your original post you state that:

What usually happens is after firing the first shot the mechanism gets immediately locked up when I try to pull the hammer back to fire a second shot. At that point I have to manually turn the cylinder myself to free the mechanism or fire it normally as a double action revolver.

Emphasis added.

Can you actually turn the cylinder freely in either direction after firiing a shot? How much? If you can turn the cylinder backwards (clockwise in a Taurus, looking from the rear of the cylinder) or clockwise to the point that you hear a "click" (the cylinder stop snapping fully up into position), then you most assuredly have a timing problem.

The only thing I can figure is you are squeezing the trigger in DA with a different speed than cocking the hammer in SA (and with different speeds when dry firing). If a revolver is not timed quite right, cocking the hammer or squeezing the trigger very slowly may not provide sufficient rotational momentum to the cylinder for it to lock in place properly. For a properly timed revolver this shouldn't present a problem. With an empty gun, try cocking the hammer very slowly until the hammer locks into position. Now try to rotate the cylinder. It should not spin freely in either direction (if it does, there is a timing problem). A tiny amount of wiggle is okay, but if you hear the cyl stop "click" up into position, again the gun has a timing problem.

Also, FYI most Tauris (like most if not all Rugers) use a transfer bar mechanism instead of a hammer block. Internally, S&W and Taurus revolvers share some similarities, but they are quite different in others.

[spacecoast]

Also, FYI most Tauris (like most if not all Rugers) use a transfer bar mechanism instead of a hammer block. Internally, S&W and Taurus revolvers share some similarities, but they are quite different in others.

jad0110 - thanks for that info, I appreciate the chance to learn. I knew about the Rugers (quite different really) but thought the Tauri revolvers were practically clones of S&Ws.

[ryan1985]

Yeah it does have a transfer bar I remember that now. It's been a few weeks so my memory's a little foggy but I'm pretty sure I could only turn it counter clockwise when it was jamming. It's been a while but I seem to remember now that I think about it some more that there was a time that it didn't lock up correctly. It's vague but I think I remember a time a while back that I cocked it and with the hammer all the way back the cylinder wasn't lined up with the barrel. At the time I think I just spun the cylinder around again and it didn't happen so I didn't give it another thought. I've really neglected it I see that now I spent so much of my time the last few years learning how to put my ar15 together and then learning how to hand load for it that I didn't pay attention to the problems my revolver was having. I've never dry fired it either as I've been told that could stretch the firing pin I've only cocked it and de-cocked it before.

[ryan1985]

I second that spacecoast I never assume to know everything and am always happy to learn new info when possible. You may be right though in a way I might have bumped something when I had that plate off it's been so long I just can't remember.

[ryan1985]

Whoa I'm home now got the grips off and side plate screws out and something strange is happening as I tap on it. I'm tapping on it with the handle of a screwdriver and the cylinder is unlocking when I give it good square hit to the handle portion of the frame.

[g.willikers]

As in the cylinder lock is popping up and down on its own, through its window in the bottom of the frame, under the cylinder, when you tap the frame?

[ryan1985]

Yes sir that's what appeared to have been happening. I have the plate off now and nothing appears to be broken or bent.

[ryan1985]

I was holding it in my left hand with my thumb gripping the cylinder. Every time I struck the handle the cylinder unlocked and rotated to the next chamber.