I was suspended from my job for having a gun.

[JohnKSa]

From what I have seen, it's fairly common for weapons-related policy violations to result in a suspension that is then changed to a termination with a phone call.

My guess is that they want to get you off the property while you still think you have a chance of keeping your job and then fire you later once you are offsite so there's less chance of an incident.

I agree with Levant that getting terminated for cause for a weapons-related policy violation is a bad thing that could follow you around for a long time. If you can manage to get them to let you stick around for a few months--whatever it takes--and then find another job, you'd probably be better off in the long run.

[HiBC]

"I decided to show the gun that WAS in my truck to the guy IN THE PARKING LOT"

Which,like it or not,as the story gets told in the truck drivers workplace"He then approached me in the parking lot with gun in hand"

Different folks can see the same event,and truthfully tell a different story from a different point of view.

Now,another harsh reality,and indiscretion on your part,OP.If you would like to keep your job,It was a bad idea to post the company name here.Likely someone at your company is a PR person who searches the internet for any reference to the company name.I would not,for any reason,post my employer's name on this forum.

It is time to develop a sense of politically taking good care of yourself.

You are not a victim,you made poor choices and there may be harsh consequences.

tyme and johnska are mods here.I suggest a PM to request this post be taken down.If your company's management becomes aware of this,you will be gone,IMO.

[44 AMP]

and yeah it's against company policy because they own the parking

ok, you're done. No matter what the stupid policy is, (no guns, red shirt on Tuesday, anything really) if its a written policy, and you did break it, then you are done, whenever they feel like it. And you don't have a valid defense, sorry.

This subject has come up for discussion recently, and basically, if its a company policy, and you knowingly break it (no matter how good a reason you have) then you're fired, if that's what they want. And they usually want it, because their lawyers tell them to.

Cases like yours are why some states passed laws protecting employees who are forced by company rules to leave their legally possessed arms in their vehicle. ALL states ought to do this, but not all have, nor likely will.

Good Luck

[NWPilgrim]

I think JohnKSa is correct that they suspended you to get you off the property with minimal confrontation.

If you do lose this job then get another in a non-corporate business, even something for 3-4 months to get another job on your resume between this one and the better one down the road. Learn the lesson of Op Sec and not flaunting policy, then move on and put some distance behind you. If necessary and possible move to another area and apply for job that is totally unrelated to what you are doing.

Roofing at least back in my day of doing it was chock full of sketchy pasts. But it is hard work and somewhat seasonal so there was a lot of turnover and no questions asked. Same for small time logging and mill operations. Lots of manual jobs are high turnover or seasonal and employers are more interested if you can and will do the hard work and not so much about your past.

Get one or two of those jobs behind you and be working on a long term plan. Or go to college or trade school for a year or more and "start over". Or do some subsistence volunteer work for 6 months to a year.

[ClydeFrog]

My state has some of the most pro-employer/business labor laws & regulations in the nation.
You can be dismissed for nearly any reason without cause.
New changes were made to the state unemployment compensation system to make is easier for former employers to deny UC/unemployment benefits too.

BTW; my state also has one of the lowest weekly UC benefit payments in the USA too so don't think any unemployed residents can get rich off that system.

[tyme]

On the subject of states that have preempted corporate regulation of guns in vehicles in corporate parking lots...

Wouldn't taking the gun out and showing it to someone go beyond what is covered in those state law protections? Are any of them written so broadly that a company can do nothing about an employee who shows off guns in a corporate parking lot?

[4runnerman]

Wouldn't taking the gun out and showing it to someone go beyond what is covered in those state law protections? Are any of them written so broadly that a company can do nothing about an employee who shows off guns in a corporate parking lot?

Tyme- I doubt it. I think that was over the line there. It's just something you don't do under and situation. Work is no place ever to show off guns.

[BigD_in_FL]

In FL, you leave your gun INSIDE your car, or your protection ends. There are some exceptions to even having one in your car - power plants is one that comes to mind

[RX-79G]

$8.30 an hour? I think the OP found a great way of collecting unemployment from his big zero of a job while he looks for better.

If the supervisor likes you, ask him personally to use him as a reference.

Whether you report to a prospective employer that you were terminated for cause or not is up to you. If there wasn't a clear policy, then it was not "for cause".

[dakota.potts]

There is some protection in Florida, in different ways. I can't be fired for having a gun in my car. In Florida, I can open carry or concealed carry a handgun at my place of business, including limited places you couldn't otherwise carry (being a bar owner comes to mind). Any employee or even a regular volunteer with regular duties is consider to be "at their place of business" and can carry open or concealed without a license.

However, if I were to carry concealed and the grip poked out, an anti-gun employer may fire you on the spot without even giving justification. If I were asked to leave after doing so and refused to leave, it would be felony armed trespass.

So, in many ways Florida has more protection than it would seem in the OP's state. Doing the above, I couldn't have been arrested depending on the circumstances of showing it to the coworker (did I sweep coworker with the muzzle? Did I rack the slide aggressively?") but could have been fired the very second the boss heard about it.

[glh17]

TN recently passed a guns in car law but employers can fire for about any reason short of violating discrimination laws.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by RX-79G

$8.30 an hour? I think the OP found a great way of collecting unemployment from his big zero of a job while he looks for better.

If he ends up being discharged for cause, I doubt he'll be able to collect unemployment compensation.

[Tom Servo]

In any case, we're not really talking about an issue of law or civil rights as it pertains to interaction with the government.

We've got a situation in which someone entered into an employment agreement, showed a lack of discretion which violated that agreement, then found his employment terminated. If a gun wasn't involved, would we even be discussing this?

[dakota.potts]

If it were some other item we might be. Say his workplace bans alcohol and OP decides to take his coworker to his car to show him an awesome bottle of McCallan Single Malt that he picked up for the weekend. How would we feel about that? I personally don't know how I would feel about it. It might be a violation of the contract, and for that I can't fault them for terminating employment, but it was in the parking lot and displayed only briefly -- again accounting for the fact that I don't know exactly how the display went down.

I don't know that I've read anywhere that OP has had his contract terminated. Did I miss that? Could it be that the employers are still trying to figure out if they even can do that if it was in the parking lot?

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by dakota.potts

I don't know that I've read anywhere that OP has had his contract terminated. Did I miss that? Could it be that the employers are still trying to figure out if they even can do that if it was in the parking lot?

Probably not officially discharged yet, unless something has happened and he hasn't updated us. But post #8 wasn't sounding optimistic:

Originally Posted by travalanch

Yeah, they can't arrest me over having the gun in my vehicle no more than they could for me forgetting my nametag. My boss did let me know that he takes my *offense* worse than an associate that calls off every other day and works half as fast as me so I think I'm canned lol...

[dajowi]

If you're old employer is contacted by a prospective new employer for a reference check, the old employer may bring up the firearms incident as being the basis of termination. Something like this placed upon your employment record can follow you with negative results.

Here are two illustrations (the first one is true).

1. On both my wife's and mine credit report (I don't remember from which credit bureau, maybe all three) it is noted that we are active military. Neither one of us has ever been in the military. How they got that idea is beyond me. Have you ever tried to get information changed on a credit report? We have and and trying to get this erased is not worth the hassle.

2. You're at a doctor's office answering routine questions. And they ask if you've ever used drugs? Or have a firearm in the house? By innocently answering the questions truthfully without thinking too much about, ("yeah you smoked marijuana when you were a teenager") or ("yeah I have a pistol"), they'll be furiously writing down that you have a drug problem or that your a danger to your children and society at large - before you even realize that you shouldn't have truthfully answered the question in the first place. Once this gets into your record it's like the internet - you can't take it back.

[Ben Towe]

I had a similar incident, though I was not actually working for the company (I was hauling product to them), I got out of the truck with my pistol on my hip and another trucker saw it and apparently felt the need to tell someone, who proceeded to pitch a hissy fit... I, in turn, told them to go jump off a cliff. I have better things to do than deal with morons and their policies, I suspect you do as well.

[NJgunowner]

Ok, lets clear something up right here. These are the questions asked 95% of the time.

A. Did so and so work for you from these dates.
B. Is so and so eligible to be rehired.

If the previous employer volunteers anything else they can be sued for libel, therefore most won't risk it. Also some states have laws about what information they can ask for.

If you want to find out what they are saying, have a friend call them and pretend to be checking employment history and see what they are telling people.

Here's a good reference. http://career-advice.monster.com/job...y/article.aspx

Your REFERENCES however can say whatever they want, so choose carefully.


The original poster showed an amazing lack of good judgement going out to his car to show off a gun to some guy he just met. I mean really...

[Don P]

Originally Posted by dakota.potts

Any employee or even a regular volunteer with regular duties is consider to be "at their place of business" and can carry open or concealed without a license.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, how is a VOLUNTEER an EMPLOYEE.

You have posted similar thoughts before and were proved wrong and now here doing it again. Musician/bar comes to mind

[zxcvbob]

What?

[Al Norris]

Corrected the quote, above.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by dakota.potts

In Florida, I can open carry or concealed carry a handgun at my place of business, including limited places you couldn't otherwise carry (being a bar owner comes to mind). Any employee or even a regular volunteer with regular duties is consider to be "at their place of business" and can carry open or concealed without a license.

I'm sure we've covered this before. A place of business is "your" place of business ONLY if you are the owner. If you are an employee, it is NOT your place of business and any laws allowing firearms carry "at your place of business" do not apply to you. Same for volunteers -- a place where you volunteer, even regularly, is not your place of business.

[dakota.potts]

We decided that a one-off night at a bar may not be a place of business and that there was no evidence to support that and anyone wanting to do so would risk being the first case.

The case (which I'll find) was provided to me by the legal team at Florida Carry, Inc. It decided that a person regularly volunteering at a city hall without pay was considered at his place of business because he had to show up on a regular schedule and perform specific regular duties. I've talked it over with 2 different Florida firearms lawyers who have shown me the the statutes and the case law supporting this reading. Unfortunately I neglected to keep it.

My ultimate point being this: in some states, you may have very strong protection from the law but if the business decides to fire you, they can do so in an instant.

If you want to debate the laws I've stated, perhaps a different thread or a PM would be better and I can send you the case through PM when I get such. I think my point remains that in my state, you may not be covered from an employer where you would be from prosecution. You can expect to lose your job for a legal activity.

ETA: case http://scholar.google.com/scholar_ca...95866506477466

"This Court, in Rinzler v. Carson,[5] noted that:

"[T]he Legislature in adopting the Revised Statutes of 1969, which includes Chapter 790 dealing with the subject of 67*67 weapons and firearms, has declared (Section 790.25(1)) it to be the policy of the Legislature not only that it is necessary to promote firearm safety and to curb and prevent the use of firearms and other weapons in crime and by incompetent persons, but also that the lawful use in defense of life, home and property and for other lawful purposes is not to be prohibited."[6]
If we upheld the lower court's verdict, we would be saying that a person, in defense of his home or place of business, is not permitted to conceal his possession of a firearm. This would mean that:

1). An owner of a business, or his employee, could not carry a concealed weapon on or about his person i.e., on his person, or in a drawer next to the cash register). He would either have to risk a loss of business by offending customers, or give up his only means of self-defense.

The Legislature could not have intended a result so inconsistent with its Declaration of Policy in Section 790.25(1), the Exceptions to said Section in Section 790.25(3)(n), and the Construction in Section 790.25(4). We must, therefore, reverse the verdict of the trial court and find the defendant not guilty of a violation of Florida Statute 790.01, F.S.A.

"(1) Declaration of policy. — The legislature finds as a matter of public policy and fact that it is necessary to promote firearms safety and to curb and prevent the use of firearms and other weapons in crime and by incompetent persons without prohibiting the lawful use in defense of life, home, and property, and the use by United States or state military organizations, and as otherwise now authorized by law, including the right to use and own firearms for target practice and marksmanship on target practice ranges or other lawful places, and lawful hunting and other lawful purposes.

* * * * *

"(3) Exceptions. — The provisions of sections 790.05 and 790.06, Florida Statutes, shall not apply in the following instances, and despite said sections it shall be lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:

* * * * *

"(n) A person possessing arms at his home or place of business;

"(4) Construction. — This act shall be liberally construed to carry out the declaration of policy herein and in favor of the constitutional right to keep and bear arms for lawful purposes. This act shall be supplemental and additional to existing rights to bear arms now guaranteed by law and decisions of the courts of Florida, and nothing herein shall impair or diminish any of such rights. This act shall supersede any law, ordinance, or regulation in conflict herewith."

I hope this is on-topic as it deals with carry in the workplace. In this case, the defendant was not fired and his employer even paid for the firearm he carried.

I think it's important to note that in a similar case, while I could do such, I could expect to be fired on the spot without notice in my state. OP had mentioned he was worried about both criminal and civil repercussions.

[45long]

Can't say about company policy as to whether or not they'll can you for that .

Now as far as the "jail time " goes , doesn't Kansas have the Castle Law?

Most States now have it . Missouri does . This basically says that your car is extension of your home as far as guns go. You can have them hidden,loaded in your vehicle and in reach in case of an emergency. You don't even have to tell a cop you if he stops you unless he asks. If he asks you have to tell him . I thought Kansas has adopted that law. Worth checking out. Funny though . most people don't even know it exists in thier state . I didn't know until 3 years after it was activated .

[dakota.potts]

Does Castle Doctrine protect keeping your gun in your car? My understanding is that you may still need a license to keep a gun in a car, but criteria for using it in a defensive standard are the same as for your house i.e. you may not have a duty to retreat where you would in public.

Missouri may allow you to keep a gun in your car AND extend Castle Doctrine to your car as Florida does, but I don't know if it's the castle law that allows you to keep the gun in your car. That may also be a state by state decision so I'd be caution against telling it to somebody as a blanket statement.