12 gauge hunting

[fenriswulf]

Anybody still doing this for hunting ammo? We used to have 6 reloaders set up for shotgun back in the 90's. Now all I have is rifle stuff. The cost of components today for a 12 gauge round is more or less equivalent to the walmart price for a low brass squirrel/rabbit round. I'm not reloading for $$ but keeping things efficient would be nice.

I'm looking into reloading a Remington express round. if I can "optimize" it for my purposes then great.

I was thinking:
1 oz #5 shot
20-25 grain reddot powder.

I'm just guessing at the powder. I want to knock squirrels out at far off ranges. Any ideas?

[loademwell]

Not sure what your asking.
I don't have 5 presses set up for shotgun. I have my Mec Sizemaster and 2 single stage rifle presses.
You looking for the recipe for 1 oz shot?
Cost wise: I some what agree. It does seem to be a bit much for shot. I think I spent 45 bucks on 25 lbs of #8 (trap shooting) and I use 1 1/8th Thats roughly 350 shells.
Powder: 22 bucks and believe me, there is more in 1 lb can then needed for 2 25lb. bag of shot. So you get 700 shells with a lb. SO adding 11 bucks.
Primers: 5 bucks for 100,, so 20 for all 350.
Wads: 10 bucks for 500

Grand Total: 86 Seems to be about 14 boxes of shells. with a little left over components.
If I bought the same shells at the gun range it would be $9 a box. I think walmart would be around 8. Never look anymore.

So Walmart: $8 ish x 14 = 112
Range: 9 x 14 = 126

I spend a little less then 86 for components.

[BigJimP]

Yes, a lot of us still reload shotshells.../ I have 4 presses set up - Mec Hydraulics ....one in 12ga, 20ga, 28ga and .410 ....and my 12ga 1 oz loads at about 1225 fps are still under $5 a box for a premium shell ( way better than the bulk walmart stuff ) ...and premium target shells are over $8 a box now..../ heck even most of the cheap shells are $ 6 a box or more.../ but I don't reload to save money, I reload to customize my shells to what I want....like a 3/4oz in a 12ga or 20ga shell these days...

But to answer your question....there are lots of 1 oz loads for a 12ga...and depending on which wad and powder you select....Hodgdon Clays might get you up around 1300 fps....but Hodgdon Intl will definitely get you up or even over 1300 fps...( with 1 oz loads )..../ and 1 oz of 9's ...or 1 oz of 5's ..uses the same recipe (only the pellet count is different )...

Personally, I wouldn't bother loading hunting shells...but since I still shoot about 250 shells a week for clays, I keep reloading all 4 gagues.../ I could use my target shells ( and have) for upland birds once in a while over the years...but finding a bag of 5's may not be inexpensive.../ I guess it depends on how many squirrels you're going to hunt on whether its worth it to you or not ....but if you still have a press, sure it would be easy to do.

[fenriswulf]

Thanks. I may not even buy a new press. I can hand load as many as I'll use in a year without too much effort. I was mostly wanting to know how much powder to load. I have no idea whats reasonable for these.

Haven't been able to find any fresh powder for shotguns. Anyone know where I should look? Online sights take months to send it out.

[GTOne]

Third Generation, Recob's target shop, Gamaliel shooting supply.

These guys are all getting various powders day in day out. You just need to watch every day.
I've bought from all of them in the last couple months and I've gotten my shipments in about 3 days from ordering.

But, if you are looking for pound bottles and primers by the 100 pack, nevermind. Online buying is not worth it unless you buy enough powder or primers or a mix of them to offset the hazmat charge.

I can buy 209 primers locally, at $50 per k, and powder is similar for a pound. That=robbery. The lgs can go out of business here for all I care, thieves.

[BigJimP]

Powder and primers...and wads.... In my area:

a. Trap and skeet clubs are best sources...
b. larger gunshows in the area
c. Online ...ReCob's target shop

for your recipe's ...look at the Hodgdon Online reloading guide...it'll give you all the loads you'll need for Hodgdon powders ( Clays, International, etc )...

Red Dot is an Alliant product/ and for 1 oz loads, it does have a couple of recipes up around 1300 fps....so you can check their website for the amount of the powder you can load ...but yes, its probably going to be around 20 -22 grains..../ but don't guess at it ....find a recipe and follow it !!! ( hull, wad, primer and powder...experimenting is not safe beyond the published recipes) !

[fenriswulf]

Found a few lbs of powder today. Just had to keep calling in to ask it seems. They had some tightwad 8 lb kegs for 120. works out to 15 bucks a lb. That powder claims to be more potent per grain than the rest too which could potentially make it economical to use. Any opinions about that?

I didn't need 8 lbs tho so I bought 1 lb of Hogdon HS-6. The website doesn't have any load data for it. The can just says the max load for 12 gauge 2.75inch is:

with 1.25 oz shot
Win AA Hull
33 grains of powder
1330 velocity

I'm using 1 oz wads right now in Remington low brass hulls. I'm going to try two weak loads at:
12 grains
15 grains

Let me know what you guys think about upping the powder content with these low brass hulls. I'll have some high brass hulls after my next squirrel trip.

[fenriswulf]

Before I forget, what do you guys think about reducing the load size from 1 oz to 3/4 oz? I'm attempting to reach a higher speed without adding excessive powder. My goal overall is to make a squirrel hunting round for far away shots and shots into the tops of tall hickory trees. When I shoot the cheap 6 dollar a box shells into the treetops, my shot often has to go through thick leaves which seems to slow it down to nonlethal speeds. Last year I knocked several squirrels down only to have them grab onto low limbs and run off.

[BigJimP]

I don't know anything about hunting or killing squirrels...( and I'm sure not eating any of them)....but I would think 3/4oz is plenty....the only issue is the pellet count. ( well, I kill a few in my yard that aggravate me, with rat poison in peanut butter ...and that does the trick ) but....

...a #6 or #5 pellet ...at 1300 fps ....in a 1 1/8 oz load, or a 1 oz load, or in a 3/4 oz load ....all hit just as hard, in terms of penetration or killing power / the only issue is the number of pellets in the pattern. And I'm guessing here - but I would think you only need 2, maybe 3 pellets, to kill a squirrel.

and I know a lot of the guys down in Tennessee, etc...use 28ga's on small game like Rabbits...( and a standard 28ga load is 3/4 oz) ...so I don't see why it wouldn't work on squirrels as well....( or 1/2 oz in a .410 for that matter )....

a # 6 ....coming out of a .410 shell......or a 12ga shell....hits just as hard ...( its just pellet count )....and I've killed a lot of rabbits with a 28ga.
----------------
a 3/4 oz load of 6's is about 167 pellets ( its 129 pellets if you go to 5's ).
a 1/2 oz load of 6's is about 112 pellets ( or 86 in 5's )....

and with a Modified Choke at 35-40 yds ...you should have about a 30" pattern with no holes in it...regardless of whether you shoot 1 oz, 7/8 oz, or 3/4 oz...( but I'd pattern a few shells ....to see what you need for choke at the kill range you expect ) ...you might need to go to Imp Mod ...

[89blazin]

Let me know what you guys think about upping the powder content with these low brass hulls. I'll have some high brass hulls after my next squirrel trip.
High brass or low brass has no bearing on the load data.

[fenriswulf]

Treerats are delicious bigjim. Just turn me loose in your yard and squirrel troubles will be a thing of the past lol.

Well, if no one tells me any different over the next few days I'm going to try 25 grains of powder. Seems kind of high to me but its well below the max loading of 33 grains. I did some figures and I can build a shell with 25 grains and 1 oz shot for the cost of a cheap round at the store(Just to be able to say I'm not putting extra $ into these so much as skill). For the sake of pride I would love to see this round significantly outperform the cheapo rounds. I'll keep working at an "optimum" version as I go.

[BigJimP]

What recipe did you get the 33 grains from ??

Remember in shotshells....you can't just use any 209 primer - you need to find a recipe for the specific primer / and the specific hull / and the specific wad...and the specific powder - at the specific weight of shot you intend to load....its not an either or type of thing...

You can't ( or at least should not ) ....just pull any old max out of the tables and consider it ok ...???

[fenriswulf]

That loading was on the powder can. its the only one I can find. It uses 209 Winchester primers.

I justed checked and im using the win primers. the only inconsistencies are the wads, shells, and the loads(Im using 1 oz instead of 1.25 oz)

[BigJimP]

Discrepancies in the recipe...are a problem..../ you can't have discrepancies.

You need to find a recipe using CCI primers or Win 209 primers ( they may or may not be the same powder drops / and for 1 oz ...or whatever shot charge you're using.

Just follow the published recipes - 100% - and you'll be fine.

[BigD_in_FL]

I'm just guessing at the powder

You reload and have this cavalier attitude?

Try going to the powder maker's website and actually using a recipe. Do you guess when loading metallic too?.......

Really.....................

try real hard to keep all of your fingers and eyes

[eastbank]

i load 1-1/8 oz #7.5-8 shot with 18gr red dot and a CB wing jammer wad and chedx primers with rem STS-golden nitro,s for the clay games. for small game i just change the shot to #6,s. and use a 9000g to load with and i just bought a 9000gh but have not set it up yet. i loaded up on wads for 7.30 a bag last year and also chedx primers for 23.00 a thousand, i just bought 11 bags of shot for 36.00 a bag off of a friend who bought a ton of it last year. and i can tell the difference between my reloads and the store bought shells,my reloads being better. eastbank.

[fenriswulf]

How about this one?

http://data.hodgdon.com/shotshell_load.asp

I'm using Remington express hulls which aren't listed at all in these recipes. I think these are the same(They use Remington nitro 27 sts or gun club plastic in this recipe).

The only difference is that I have 1 oz AA cb1100 wads and they have 1.25 oz AA F114. I can buy these 1.25 oz wads but I was hoping to use less shot to keep from damaging the squirrel meat too much.

[fenriswulf]

For the link above im putting

hs6 powder
12 guage
lead
2.75 Remington sts nitro 27 hulls
then using the lower two recipes. with the AA wads