The good states - Page 3

45King · August 14, 2002, 05:46 AM

BlackRazor wrote:

Quote:

45 king: How in hell did you get Class 3 in today's political climate. You mean they actually *added* full autos into the legal catagory after they had already been outlawed?!!? Cool!

I don't know how long the old system had been in place, but in June this year, I was attending the last reunion of the Doolittle Raiders at Owens Field here in Columbia. There were, of course, numerous WWII re-enactors, and in talking with some of them, I found out that our gov., Jim Hodges (a DEMOCRAT!!!) had "quietly signed into law" the legislation to bring us up to full Class III status just a few months prior to the reunion. That's all I know, but I'm sure this one had to be sneaked by a few of our state reps who are definitely "anti." The bill was easily passed without any fanfare.

See, SC is indeed a gun-owner friendly state.

Scarborough · August 14, 2002, 08:02 AM

BlackRazor, add ND to the good list. Shall issue CCW.

stellarpod · August 14, 2002, 08:52 AM

When looking at your "good" list, I think it appropriate to cull using another factor:

How receptive is your state to visitors with CCW from other states? What are their reciprocity restrictions?

Anyone want to pound their state's chest about this one?

ALthough Oklahoma is generally very gun-friendly, I know we don't enjoy the breadth of reciprocity that I'd like to see. What about other states?

Radicalcleric · August 14, 2002, 10:48 AM

Caution on Ohio. The big cities had their own bans on semi-autos and hi-cap mags. I lived in Cincinnati 1992-1996 and committed over 100 felonies everyday by having my AR15 and FN-FAL with their magazines inside the city limits. No gun dealers in city limits because city imposes waiting period. State does not.

In Cinti a guy took his AR and his M1 Carbine to PD station to ask if illegal. Yup, and he was arrested. Could not prosecute as Carbine was melted and AR was stolen by cops, I mean, it was "converted for police use" before trial so no evidence.

In my opinion, Cinti cops very crooked and have never heard of Bill of Rights. All big city leaders in Ohio stupid asses, too.

labgrade · August 14, 2002, 10:52 AM

Got us (CO) there, stellarpod. Zip recip. Good catch, BTW.

We don't have anything though that prevents a non-resident from getting CCW, except you'd likely have to have some sort of residential status - that might be a bit iffy to pull off.

BlackRazor · August 14, 2002, 11:39 AM

South Carolina rules.

Ohio really sucks. They're just as bad as Kali was only a couple of years ago. But now Kali's still worse.

Stellarpod: You're right, out of state CCW is a factor, but if I get too picky I won't have anything. I had to choose the stuff that was the most important to me. Any state that makes my good list is definately a good state for gunowners, but maybe I could later seperate it into "good" and "awesome."

I'm adding North Dakota to the good list since I'm assuming that in addition to CCW they also allow class 3.

David Scott · August 14, 2002, 01:29 PM

Florida is excellent for all the reasons stated above, plus:

IMHO one of the best things about Florida is that it's up to the officer on the scene whether a self-defense shooting should go any further than handing back the defender's weapon and bagging the perp's body. Justified shoots don't go to court here often. Even the local paper is sympathetic -- they did a fine human interest story on an independent c-store owner who put thre 9mm rounds into a coked-up robber with a knife, all about how hard the guy worked to own his own store, and how he felt about the shooting. Very upbeat, pro-self-defense tone.

When I was stopped for speeding I gave the deputy my CCW permit and told him I was armed. He said "OK", handed me back the permit, and that was all he said or did about it.

Florida also lets you carry in your car without a permit ("peaceable journey" law) so long as it's in a closed container (including glove box) or a holster with retention strap closed. They also have a law that says you may not collect damages for injuries suffered while committing a felony, so you need not fear perps coming back at you with lawyers.

We have plenty of places to shoot, including a free unmoderated range in the Ocala National Forest near me, and a club on the St. Johns River that hosts full-auto events. There's also a lot of decent gun shops and frequent gun shows.

Permits are all over the place. I have trouble thinking of friends who don't carry. At out motorcycle club's picnic (Gold Wingers, not hoodlums), talk got around to guns and it turned out that 15 out of 17 people there had permits (including the women). Two of the women got into a big debate about one's NAA Guardian .32 versus the other's Taurus snubbie.

The guy at the convenience store packs a Glock 19. The pizza guy carries. The local rabbi carries. The CCW classes at the Sheriff's Dept are full (16 people a month minimum). The class Thelma and I went to had a waiting list. Behind us in class sat a gentleman taking the class with his two college-age daughters. There were two little old ladies, one with a Colt Detective Special and the other with a SIG P239.

Sunshine, beaches, oranges growing in my yard, and gun-friendly. Gotta love it.

Russ · August 14, 2002, 01:46 PM

Kentucky and Tennessee = Good States. As Zander said, look at the HCI ratings. States with an F are good. I moved out of California about 9 months ago to Kentucky. Things are much easier here. I bought a gun a couple of months ago. No extra fees, no waiting period, etc. The whole transaction took about 5 minutes. There are alot of states that recognize KY's CCW permits also. Good luck choosing.

MitchSchaft · August 14, 2002, 03:22 PM

The only thing I want Tennessee to do now is allow carry in establishments that serve alcohol for onsite consumption.

Desertdog · August 14, 2002, 03:42 PM

In my thinking, there is only one good state. No permits required. The illegal use of a firearm calls for punishing the person/persons that did the illegal act.
Why should you or I have to jump through hoops to do what our constitution says is legal??
One good state - Vermont

BlackRazor · August 14, 2002, 03:46 PM

Only six states left before I have the entire list! Thanks a lot for all your help so far. Let's see, what's missing?

Haven't heard about South Dakota yet, anyone live there? What about Mississippi? Iowa? New Mexico?

labgrade · August 14, 2002, 04:06 PM

If you don't get a reply, do check packing.org ... lotsa good stuff there.

Sometimes a bit outa date, but better'n most.

Ala Dan · August 14, 2002, 06:24 PM

Alabama? Um good, real good!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

powderific · August 14, 2002, 09:33 PM

I can't believe South Dakota hasn't been mentioned! (I wonder if I'm the only one from SD here

) SD is definately good, class 3 stuff is just whatever federal laws are, CCW is shall issue, all it takes is a quick trip to the county sherrif and $10 for 4 years. Recently a law was passed that allows reciprocity agreements with other states, and the only criteria is that they meet our CCW requirements, which I imagine is almost any other state that issues CCW permits. SD=good

MitchSchaft · August 14, 2002, 09:36 PM

Blazer, in MS, you have to qualify with the gun you plan to carry, and only carry that gun for a CCW. They suck.

labgrade · August 14, 2002, 09:54 PM

Signing off for the night, but do consider where you're allowed to carry once you've received your permission from The King to carry conealed, or open carry.

Colorado has zip provisions against carrying in bars, schools, et al ... open carry is a state constitutional "garauntee" - void where prohibited.

you can CCW in a facility that serves alcohol, & even have a drink. Schools = OK. Try that in any other state ......

Looking at several other states that have the "peaceable journey" clause, CO doesn't even get into it (much) - we're good to go.

I've said it before, & will again now, CO has one of the best firearm-pro legislation (in comparison) - it's just in need of a tad of tweaking here 'n there.

BlackRazor · August 14, 2002, 10:21 PM

Sounds like MS allows concealed carry, albeit with some tight restrictions. However, I don't think I'd ever carry more than one type of handgun for concealed carry anyway, the P7 is just about the perfect choice for my CCW. So if MS also allows class 3, then I'll be happy to put it on the "good" list.

Something else I've been thinking about: Vermont. Wow, what an awesome place, no permits at all, huh? The only downside to this is that you can't carry in other states because it's impossible to get a permit in Vermont! Who would've thought there would be a disadvantage to living with Vermont's CCW laws? Speaking of Vermont, do you have to be a resident to carry there? One of my uncles lives up there and I was wondering the same thing the last time I was visiting; he didn't know but he said he thought it would be OK (he's seriously pro-guns, BTW). I might be visiting again this winter; I'd love to get a taste of true freedom; albeit for a brief time only.

Oh yeah, I'll put SD on the good list. Thanks again for all your help.

powderific · August 15, 2002, 02:02 AM

SD has no regulation forbidding carry in schools. It does prohibit carry in places that make over 50% of their money from the sale of alcohal though, but that's it besides the usual (courthouses and whatnot)

mickthenailer · August 15, 2002, 10:57 AM

You do not have to be a Vermont resident to carry here, just a
U.S. citizen.

Kcustom45 · August 15, 2002, 03:45 PM

stellarpod

Indiana honors everybody's CCW permits (as far as I know). I just wish that everyone else honored Indiana's.

stringj · August 15, 2002, 05:23 PM

Mississippi,
An OK state.

Quote:

Blazer, in MS, you have to qualify with the gun you plan to carry, and only carry that gun for a CCW. They suck.

The above is a total falsehood for the state of Mississippi (MS).

Jerry

stellarpod · August 15, 2002, 05:46 PM

Kcustom45:

It does appear that Indiana honors virtually all other state's CCW. I wish that I could say that Oklahoma returns the favor, but apparently they don't.

I'd have to say that, from a reciprocity standpoint, Indiana seems to have their act together.

Thanks for the update.

MitchSchaft · August 15, 2002, 06:25 PM

Quote:

The above is a total falsehood for the state of Mississippi

I was told that a couple months ago by a co-worker who lives in MS. My bad.

the blind lefty · August 16, 2002, 12:27 PM

c'mon, Ohio is just plain bad.
so what if California is worse; look at it.
the problem with central Ohio is the fact that there isn't even a hard way to get a CCW. become a cop? Yuk! this city has been winding down like a toilet flush! we probably have the most prolific urban sprawl in the world.
the lack of city planning is creating our slums of the future. cheap housing projects that leave children no room to play breed mischief. strip malls stripe the outskirts of the city,blending into smaller communities and sapping small bussiness. the inner city is rift with empty strip malls.
i say you can measure a cities crime friendly attitude with the over abundance of pawn shops.these are simply outlets for stolen booty around here. i live in the suberbs,and in just the last 5 years we're suffering from beggers, prostitutes, and homeless people. what's sad is we have plenty of service jobs(fastfood, quick stop shops), but even the low housing cost is out of many peoples reach.
i worked a security job about 3 blocks away from my home where a large band of hoodlums would prevent the innocent from entering the convenience store.they would,in fact, throw rocks at passers by or chase them. i can understand this problem in some of the other crap-holes mentioned,but Ohio seems to have gotten into it small-time rather quick.
yes,i plan on moving!
to bad my Mother is dug-in. i have family in Louisianna,Texas, Arizona, Colorado and PA. i was born in San Antonio, but my Father(God rest his soul) moved the family to Ohio for a better paying job.
P.S

ur"Republican"Governor Taft voted down CCW the last time it came up. he sees it fit to contract out all our budget to street repair. despite Ohio's nice roads,they are constantly covered with orange barrels and single lane traffic;they dig'em annually!

August 14, 2002, 08:52 AM	#53
stellarpod Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2001 Location: OKC,OK Posts: 263	When looking at your "good" list, I think it appropriate to cull using another factor: How receptive is your state to visitors with CCW from other states? What are their reciprocity restrictions? Anyone want to pound their state's chest about this one? ALthough Oklahoma is generally very gun-friendly, I know we don't enjoy the breadth of reciprocity that I'd like to see. What about other states? __________________ Things are a lot more like they used to be than they are now

August 14, 2002, 11:39 AM	#56
BlackRazor Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2002 Posts: 169	some observations South Carolina rules. Ohio really sucks. They're just as bad as Kali was only a couple of years ago. But now Kali's still worse. Stellarpod: You're right, out of state CCW is a factor, but if I get too picky I won't have anything. I had to choose the stuff that was the most important to me. Any state that makes my good list is definately a good state for gunowners, but maybe I could later seperate it into "good" and "awesome." I'm adding North Dakota to the good list since I'm assuming that in addition to CCW they also allow class 3.

August 14, 2002, 01:29 PM	#57
David Scott Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2000 Posts: 2,456	Florida is excellent for all the reasons stated above, plus: IMHO one of the best things about Florida is that it's up to the officer on the scene whether a self-defense shooting should go any further than handing back the defender's weapon and bagging the perp's body. Justified shoots don't go to court here often. Even the local paper is sympathetic -- they did a fine human interest story on an independent c-store owner who put thre 9mm rounds into a coked-up robber with a knife, all about how hard the guy worked to own his own store, and how he felt about the shooting. Very upbeat, pro-self-defense tone. When I was stopped for speeding I gave the deputy my CCW permit and told him I was armed. He said "OK", handed me back the permit, and that was all he said or did about it. Florida also lets you carry in your car without a permit ("peaceable journey" law) so long as it's in a closed container (including glove box) or a holster with retention strap closed. They also have a law that says you may not collect damages for injuries suffered while committing a felony, so you need not fear perps coming back at you with lawyers. We have plenty of places to shoot, including a free unmoderated range in the Ocala National Forest near me, and a club on the St. Johns River that hosts full-auto events. There's also a lot of decent gun shops and frequent gun shows. Permits are all over the place. I have trouble thinking of friends who don't carry. At out motorcycle club's picnic (Gold Wingers, not hoodlums), talk got around to guns and it turned out that 15 out of 17 people there had permits (including the women). Two of the women got into a big debate about one's NAA Guardian .32 versus the other's Taurus snubbie. The guy at the convenience store packs a Glock 19. The pizza guy carries. The local rabbi carries. The CCW classes at the Sheriff's Dept are full (16 people a month minimum). The class Thelma and I went to had a waiting list. Behind us in class sat a gentleman taking the class with his two college-age daughters. There were two little old ladies, one with a Colt Detective Special and the other with a SIG P239. Sunshine, beaches, oranges growing in my yard, and gun-friendly. Gotta love it. __________________ "As I looked at my two young sons, each with his gun, and considered how much the safety of the party depended on these little fellows, I felt grateful to you, dear husband, for having acquainted them in childhood with the use of firearms." -- Elisabeth Robinson, in The Swiss Family Robinson by Johann Wyss

August 14, 2002, 03:42 PM	#60
Desertdog Senior Member Join Date: January 23, 2002 Location: Mojave Desert, CA Posts: 261	The ONE good state In my thinking, there is only one good state. No permits required. The illegal use of a firearm calls for punishing the person/persons that did the illegal act. Why should you or I have to jump through hoops to do what our constitution says is legal?? One good state - Vermont

August 14, 2002, 03:46 PM	#61
BlackRazor Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2002 Posts: 169	All right! Only six states left before I have the entire list! Thanks a lot for all your help so far. Let's see, what's missing? Haven't heard about South Dakota yet, anyone live there? What about Mississippi? Iowa? New Mexico?

August 14, 2002, 08:02 AM	#52
Scarborough Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2001 Location: Fargo North Dakota Posts: 543	BlackRazor, add ND to the good list. Shall issue CCW.

August 14, 2002, 10:48 AM	#54
Radicalcleric Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2001 Posts: 645	Caution on Ohio. The big cities had their own bans on semi-autos and hi-cap mags. I lived in Cincinnati 1992-1996 and committed over 100 felonies everyday by having my AR15 and FN-FAL with their magazines inside the city limits. No gun dealers in city limits because city imposes waiting period. State does not. In Cinti a guy took his AR and his M1 Carbine to PD station to ask if illegal. Yup, and he was arrested. Could not prosecute as Carbine was melted and AR was stolen by cops, I mean, it was "converted for police use" before trial so no evidence. In my opinion, Cinti cops very crooked and have never heard of Bill of Rights. All big city leaders in Ohio stupid asses, too.

August 14, 2002, 10:52 AM	#55
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Got us (CO) there, stellarpod. Zip recip. Good catch, BTW. We don't have anything though that prevents a non-resident from getting CCW, except you'd likely have to have some sort of residential status - that might be a bit iffy to pull off.

August 14, 2002, 01:46 PM	#58
Russ Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2001 Location: Kentucky, Refugee from California Posts: 1,097	Kentucky and Tennessee = Good States. As Zander said, look at the HCI ratings. States with an F are good. I moved out of California about 9 months ago to Kentucky. Things are much easier here. I bought a gun a couple of months ago. No extra fees, no waiting period, etc. The whole transaction took about 5 minutes. There are alot of states that recognize KY's CCW permits also. Good luck choosing.

August 14, 2002, 03:22 PM	#59
MitchSchaft Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2001 Posts: 1,197	The only thing I want Tennessee to do now is allow carry in establishments that serve alcohol for onsite consumption.

August 14, 2002, 04:06 PM	#62
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	If you don't get a reply, do check packing.org ... lotsa good stuff there. Sometimes a bit outa date, but better'n most.

August 14, 2002, 06:24 PM	#63
Ala Dan Member in memoriam Join Date: August 13, 1999 Location: In The HOT, Humid, and Mu Posts: 6,116	Alabama? Um good, real good! Best Wishes, Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

August 14, 2002, 09:33 PM	#64
powderific Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2000 Location: South Dakota Posts: 137	I can't believe South Dakota hasn't been mentioned! (I wonder if I'm the only one from SD here ) SD is definately good, class 3 stuff is just whatever federal laws are, CCW is shall issue, all it takes is a quick trip to the county sherrif and $10 for 4 years. Recently a law was passed that allows reciprocity agreements with other states, and the only criteria is that they meet our CCW requirements, which I imagine is almost any other state that issues CCW permits. SD=good

August 14, 2002, 09:36 PM	#65
MitchSchaft Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2001 Posts: 1,197	Blazer, in MS, you have to qualify with the gun you plan to carry, and only carry that gun for a CCW. They suck.

August 14, 2002, 09:54 PM	#66
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Signing off for the night, but do consider where you're allowed to carry once you've received your permission from The King to carry conealed, or open carry. Colorado has zip provisions against carrying in bars, schools, et al ... open carry is a state constitutional "garauntee" - void where prohibited. you can CCW in a facility that serves alcohol, & even have a drink. Schools = OK. Try that in any other state ...... Looking at several other states that have the "peaceable journey" clause, CO doesn't even get into it (much) - we're good to go. I've said it before, & will again now, CO has one of the best firearm-pro legislation (in comparison) - it's just in need of a tad of tweaking here 'n there.

August 14, 2002, 10:21 PM	#67
BlackRazor Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2002 Posts: 169	Sounds like MS allows concealed carry, albeit with some tight restrictions. However, I don't think I'd ever carry more than one type of handgun for concealed carry anyway, the P7 is just about the perfect choice for my CCW. So if MS also allows class 3, then I'll be happy to put it on the "good" list. Something else I've been thinking about: Vermont. Wow, what an awesome place, no permits at all, huh? The only downside to this is that you can't carry in other states because it's impossible to get a permit in Vermont! Who would've thought there would be a disadvantage to living with Vermont's CCW laws? Speaking of Vermont, do you have to be a resident to carry there? One of my uncles lives up there and I was wondering the same thing the last time I was visiting; he didn't know but he said he thought it would be OK (he's seriously pro-guns, BTW). I might be visiting again this winter; I'd love to get a taste of true freedom; albeit for a brief time only. Oh yeah, I'll put SD on the good list. Thanks again for all your help.

August 15, 2002, 02:02 AM	#68
powderific Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2000 Location: South Dakota Posts: 137	SD has no regulation forbidding carry in schools. It does prohibit carry in places that make over 50% of their money from the sale of alcohal though, but that's it besides the usual (courthouses and whatnot)

August 15, 2002, 10:57 AM	#69
mickthenailer Senior Member Join Date: May 17, 2000 Posts: 112	You do not have to be a Vermont resident to carry here, just a U.S. citizen.

August 15, 2002, 03:45 PM	#70
Kcustom45 Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2002 Location: Indiana Posts: 146	stellarpod Indiana honors everybody's CCW permits (as far as I know). I just wish that everyone else honored Indiana's.

August 15, 2002, 05:46 PM	#72
stellarpod Senior Member Join Date: August 18, 2001 Location: OKC,OK Posts: 263	Kcustom45: It does appear that Indiana honors virtually all other state's CCW. I wish that I could say that Oklahoma returns the favor, but apparently they don't. I'd have to say that, from a reciprocity standpoint, Indiana seems to have their act together. Thanks for the update. __________________ Things are a lot more like they used to be than they are now

August 16, 2002, 12:27 PM	#74
the blind lefty Senior Member Join Date: July 17, 2002 Location: ohio Posts: 320	c'mon, Ohio is just plain bad. so what if California is worse; look at it. the problem with central Ohio is the fact that there isn't even a hard way to get a CCW. become a cop? Yuk! this city has been winding down like a toilet flush! we probably have the most prolific urban sprawl in the world. the lack of city planning is creating our slums of the future. cheap housing projects that leave children no room to play breed mischief. strip malls stripe the outskirts of the city,blending into smaller communities and sapping small bussiness. the inner city is rift with empty strip malls. i say you can measure a cities crime friendly attitude with the over abundance of pawn shops.these are simply outlets for stolen booty around here. i live in the suberbs,and in just the last 5 years we're suffering from beggers, prostitutes, and homeless people. what's sad is we have plenty of service jobs(fastfood, quick stop shops), but even the low housing cost is out of many peoples reach. i worked a security job about 3 blocks away from my home where a large band of hoodlums would prevent the innocent from entering the convenience store.they would,in fact, throw rocks at passers by or chase them. i can understand this problem in some of the other crap-holes mentioned,but Ohio seems to have gotten into it small-time rather quick. yes,i plan on moving! to bad my Mother is dug-in. i have family in Louisianna,Texas, Arizona, Colorado and PA. i was born in San Antonio, but my Father(God rest his soul) moved the family to Ohio for a better paying job. P.Sur"Republican"Governor Taft voted down CCW the last time it came up. he sees it fit to contract out all our budget to street repair. despite Ohio's nice roads,they are constantly covered with orange barrels and single lane traffic;they dig'em annually!