Short-barrel rifles in 5.56mm

BCannell · March 24, 2005, 09:38 AM

I understand that very small rifles in 5.56mm such as the G36C, Galil MAR, MTAR-21, M4 Commando and so forth cannot produce the velocity necessary to cause standard military rounds to fragment. Since without fragmentation the 5.56mm round is essentially a deeply-penetrating .22, this would seem to me to be a significant problem. How do the people who use those weapons deal with this? Do they use different loads or bullet weights or bullet designs? Do they just accept the limitations of the weapon and hope for the best?

M4A3 · March 25, 2005, 01:39 AM

Thay will fragment, just not as far out as with a 20" barrel like on an M16.

I know for a fact that M193 will fragment out of A 14.5" barrel 1-9 twist at least to 157 yards. (i've tested this at the range)

In general the m855, and m193 have to be going about 2400-2500 FPS to fragment in a flesh like target.

The longer the barrel, the higher the velocity, and 556 needs velocity to be effective.

smince · March 26, 2005, 06:14 AM

Funny thing is, most CQB Teams have gone away from MP5's and 9mm SMG's for short barreled AR's because, according to them, 5.56 actually over-penetrates LESS than 9mm does. Go figure? I'm just going by what I read in mags and have heard in real life. I don't own a 5.56 or a 9mm SMG.

March 24, 2005, 09:38 AM	#1
BCannell Senior Member Join Date: January 12, 2005 Posts: 136	Short-barrel rifles in 5.56mm I understand that very small rifles in 5.56mm such as the G36C, Galil MAR, MTAR-21, M4 Commando and so forth cannot produce the velocity necessary to cause standard military rounds to fragment. Since without fragmentation the 5.56mm round is essentially a deeply-penetrating .22, this would seem to me to be a significant problem. How do the people who use those weapons deal with this? Do they use different loads or bullet weights or bullet designs? Do they just accept the limitations of the weapon and hope for the best?

March 25, 2005, 01:39 AM	#2
M4A3 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2002 Location: Minnesota (YA-SHURE-YOU-BETCHA) Posts: 620	Thay will fragment, just not as far out as with a 20" barrel like on an M16. I know for a fact that M193 will fragment out of A 14.5" barrel 1-9 twist at least to 157 yards. (i've tested this at the range) In general the m855, and m193 have to be going about 2400-2500 FPS to fragment in a flesh like target. The longer the barrel, the higher the velocity, and 556 needs velocity to be effective. __________________ M4A3 Carbine - The worlds most versatile, adaptable, and effective assault rifle. Caliber: 5.56mm NATO Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt Barrel length: 370 mm Rate of fire: 700 - 950 rounds per minute Maximum effective range: 360 m

March 26, 2005, 06:14 AM	#3
smince Junior member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Northeast Alabama Posts: 2,580	Funny thing is, most CQB Teams have gone away from MP5's and 9mm SMG's for short barreled AR's because, according to them, 5.56 actually over-penetrates LESS than 9mm does. Go figure? I'm just going by what I read in mags and have heard in real life. I don't own a 5.56 or a 9mm SMG.