Birdshot Safety

roy reali · September 26, 2010, 05:14 PM

Bird seasons are or will be opening in most areas. As with all shooting activities safety must be rule one. This has to do with dangers of birdshot at longer distances.

You are in a field hunting birds. You know there are hunters on the other side of the same field. You are three to four hundred yards away from them. A bird flushes and your shot will be pointed towards those other hunters. Would you shoot the bird? No one would shoot in that direction with a rifle, even a rimfire. But, shouldn't they be safe from small pellets?

If you are going to shoot birds towards other hunters, what would you say the minimum distance they need to be for safety sake?

oneounceload · September 26, 2010, 05:51 PM

Having done that previously, and subsequently finding out that the pellets penetrated someone's denim pants (but not the skin), double that distance - or better work out a drive system where folks take turns driving the birds to a line of Guns

zippy13 · September 26, 2010, 06:07 PM

Roy,

Obviously, it depends on the size of the shot -- the bigger the pellets, the farther they go. I've been the architect for several gun clubs and my field tests have verified the published safety data. The 300-yard safety zone for target loads is conservative, #7-1/2 trap loads will typically land at about 200-yards and #9 skeet loads at about 185-yards. If you maintain 300-yards between shooters you'll be safe from other upland shooters. Of course, there's always some idiot who uses turkey loads for upland birds -- stay about 350-yards from these guys.

Problems arise when hunters overestimate the distances, and you're closer than you think you are. A light dusting of bird shot, from a adjacent shooting party, serves as a reminder that you're too close. Not long ago, I reported when three of my squad-mates, all experienced comp shooters, went over to the Colorado River for the opening of dove season. At practice the next weekend, I asked how their shooting had been. The first reply was, "We had a great time." Seconded by "Yeah, it was awesome!" That was immediately followed by: "Bull s**t, someone shot me!!!"

Always wear eye and ear protection when shooting!

Pahoo · September 27, 2010, 10:47 AM

Good post and brings out a few points that some have never considered. Recently, there was a young man in Iowa who was duck hunting on the edge of a pool/pond. There was another hunter across the water and got hit by pellets when a "Low-Flier" passed by. We have seen the same thing happen in the dove fields. The last time I went out, there were about 75 hunters around the edge of the of one field. Some passed on the "Low-Fliers" and some did not. No one got shot this time but you could hear the pellets hitting the stalks.

One thing that we teach, is the effective range of your firearm. We teach it but sadly we don't go into much detail. This doesn't present much of a problems on upland bird hunting and we usually know where the other hunters might be and work the field accordingly. There aren't many hunters out at one time nor are there many birds.

We need to be aware of the low flying targets, the effective range of what we shoot and proximity of other hunters. Easier said then done !!! ...

Be Safe !!!

BarkeyVA · September 27, 2010, 01:27 PM

My friend, who belongs to a dove hunting club, invited me to go with him as his guest. The club's primary safety rule was that hunters must see blue sky below the bird before shooting. Consequently, I passed up a number of shots that day hunting over sunflowers.

NWPilgrim · September 27, 2010, 02:04 PM

Having been on the receiving end of shot when a pheasant flushed between parties I would say if you can see the other party downrange then don't shoot. The other party laughed but my Dad was ready to skin them.

Even if it is far enough away to not pose a lethal danger it is a courtesy. If you are so hard up for a bird that you will forgo a common courtesy then hunt where there are fewer people and more birds. Seems like a terrible habit to get into shooting with people downrange no matter the trajectory and energy.

markj · September 27, 2010, 04:17 PM

I see hunters in the field, I go over and run em off it is private land

and I got rights exclusive on most places round here.

mete · September 27, 2010, 04:31 PM

SAAMI has the information on the distance that various size shot can go. It's faurther than you think

JNewell · September 27, 2010, 06:22 PM

Really? 800 yards, birdshot? I am not saying it's not true, but I'm surprised.

Quote:

Having done that previously, and subsequently finding out that the pellets penetrated someone's denim pants (but not the skin), double that distance - or better work out a drive system where folks take turns driving the birds to a line of Guns

oneounceload · September 27, 2010, 06:31 PM

I'm not saying it is LETHAL at that range- but it could, as the old BB gun warnings said -"put an eye out" Yet another reason to wear eye protection.

How many times do we see warnings on a box of .22 saying effective range is 1 mile?

It is real easy to accidentally launch a payload of #7-1/2 or 6's on the right angle that can maximize distances.......

Safety first - let the bird go if there's a chance of sending a payload towards others.....

rjrivero · September 27, 2010, 06:41 PM

Take your lessons from Dick Chaney. Don't shoot towards other hunters. Especially rich Texans who donate to your Campaign Funds.

Scubasimmons · September 27, 2010, 09:56 PM

If it's 3-400 yards I'm not too worried but I agree most people overestimate the distance. I think courtesy dictates not leveling down on a fellow hunter no matter the distance.

Having been shot at 80-100 yds with dove load on bare skin I question penetration at 800 yds. It stung but didn't penetrate the back of my arm.

roy reali · September 28, 2010, 06:51 AM

When I was a teenager, some friends and I headed to the edge of town to do some shotgun shooting. We found a drainage ditch and pond. Twehty minutes into shooting a Sheriff's car pulled up. We all unloaded our guns and walked up to the deputy. He asked what kind of guns we were shooting. We showed him our shotguns and ammo. We all had light field loads.

He pointed towards a home that was a good half mile away. They had reported us shooting and that our shot was raining down on their roof. He was upset, not at us, but on the person that made the call. He saw that there was no way our shot could be reaching that home. He said go back to shooting and be careful.

I am sure if we had .22's it would have been different.

zippy13 · September 28, 2010, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scubasimmons

I think courtesy dictates not leveling down on a fellow hunter no matter the distance.

A wise practice.
The problem is, the folks whose hunting practices scare us aren't reading this or another similar forum.

publius · September 28, 2010, 05:31 PM

I never, ever shoot at a low bird in a dove field, no matter if someone is directly in front of me or not. Distance doesn't matter. It's not worth putting someone's eyes out or getting buttstroked by me if it you shot in my direction.

JNewell · September 29, 2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

I'm not saying it is LETHAL at that range- but it could, as the old BB gun warnings said -"put an eye out" Yet another reason to wear eye protection.

How many times do we see warnings on a box of .22 saying effective range is 1 mile?

It is real easy to accidentally launch a payload of #7-1/2 or 6's on the right angle that can maximize distances.......

Safety first - let the bird go if there's a chance of sending a payload towards others.....

Was thinking more about what people were launching at me...

roy reali · September 29, 2010, 08:53 PM

Some folks say that one should not ever fire on low flying birds. I guess that is a good safety tip. But what about birds that only give you low targets, like quail. Sometimes they are too low and you worry about any dogs in the area.

publius · September 29, 2010, 10:38 PM

Quail is a totally different than doves. You aren't in a field lined with people, you have yourself and maybe 2 others behind dogs. Yes, quail hunting is a low-bird game but your guys are right there beside you and you should always know where your dogs are. The dogs should be fairly close to you at all times if trained well, they aren't off running through the woods like deer dogs.

oneounceload · September 30, 2010, 08:02 AM

Having watched some bird dogs jump up after a flushing quail, it still pays to let the bird get up a little so you don't shoot the dog; otherwise, the post about having only a few hunters on either side is spot on

Artie · September 30, 2010, 07:50 PM

I've been peppered many times at dove shoots over the years. It kind of comes with the territory at certain fields, especially if they are long fields. I've never known anyone to have skin broken or even have any pain from it. It's not necessarily because someone shoots a low bird either, it's just how the land lays sometimes. Fortunately I've never hunted with someone stupid enough to shoot level to someone in line with them at close range.

I'm very skeptical about bird shot being a danger at more than 250 yards based on personal experience. I would almost bet anything that it's not possible for birdshot to travel 800 yards. It wouldn't bother me at all if someone 800 yards away were shooting directly at me with a shotgun. 800 yards is over half a mile.

nathaniel · September 30, 2010, 07:56 PM

Theres people that will say "Birdshot" wont hurt you at 25 yards. But they dont know dittily squat, I have had shot bounce off me at about 150 yards you can feel it but it doesnt hurt by any means. Still I dont like to shoot towards anyone its just engrained in my brain if I see people not to shoot that way.

HunterGuy · October 2, 2010, 04:20 PM

Reguardless of shot size you will still rain lead down on them, and I for one do not like it done to me so i don't do it to other people.

Either wait for the bird to clear away from them or call out to them that one is heading their way (and hope they don't shoot at you in the meantime).

Ryanfromcanada · October 3, 2010, 12:05 PM

"Even if it is far enough away to not pose a lethal danger it is a courtesy. If you are so hard up for a bird that you will forgo a common courtesy then hunt where there are fewer people and more birds. Seems like a terrible habit to get into shooting with people downrange no matter the trajectory and energy"

+1

September 26, 2010, 05:14 PM	#1
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 3,248	Birdshot Safety Bird seasons are or will be opening in most areas. As with all shooting activities safety must be rule one. This has to do with dangers of birdshot at longer distances. You are in a field hunting birds. You know there are hunters on the other side of the same field. You are three to four hundred yards away from them. A bird flushes and your shot will be pointed towards those other hunters. Would you shoot the bird? No one would shoot in that direction with a rifle, even a rimfire. But, shouldn't they be safe from small pellets? If you are going to shoot birds towards other hunters, what would you say the minimum distance they need to be for safety sake?

September 27, 2010, 10:47 AM	#4
Pahoo Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2006 Location: IOWA Posts: 8,783	Low Fliers !! Good post and brings out a few points that some have never considered. Recently, there was a young man in Iowa who was duck hunting on the edge of a pool/pond. There was another hunter across the water and got hit by pellets when a "Low-Flier" passed by. We have seen the same thing happen in the dove fields. The last time I went out, there were about 75 hunters around the edge of the of one field. Some passed on the "Low-Fliers" and some did not. No one got shot this time but you could hear the pellets hitting the stalks. One thing that we teach, is the effective range of your firearm. We teach it but sadly we don't go into much detail. This doesn't present much of a problems on upland bird hunting and we usually know where the other hunters might be and work the field accordingly. There aren't many hunters out at one time nor are there many birds. We need to be aware of the low flying targets, the effective range of what we shoot and proximity of other hunters. Easier said then done !!! ... Be Safe !!!

September 27, 2010, 02:04 PM	#6
NWPilgrim Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 2,346	Having been on the receiving end of shot when a pheasant flushed between parties I would say if you can see the other party downrange then don't shoot. The other party laughed but my Dad was ready to skin them. Even if it is far enough away to not pose a lethal danger it is a courtesy. If you are so hard up for a bird that you will forgo a common courtesy then hunt where there are fewer people and more birds. Seems like a terrible habit to get into shooting with people downrange no matter the trajectory and energy. __________________ "The ultimate authority ... resides in the people alone. ... The advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition." - James Madison

September 27, 2010, 04:31 PM	#8
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	SAAMI has the information on the distance that various size shot can go. It's faurther than you think __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

September 28, 2010, 06:51 AM	#13
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 3,248	Too Far When I was a teenager, some friends and I headed to the edge of town to do some shotgun shooting. We found a drainage ditch and pond. Twehty minutes into shooting a Sheriff's car pulled up. We all unloaded our guns and walked up to the deputy. He asked what kind of guns we were shooting. We showed him our shotguns and ammo. We all had light field loads. He pointed towards a home that was a good half mile away. They had reported us shooting and that our shot was raining down on their roof. He was upset, not at us, but on the person that made the call. He saw that there was no way our shot could be reaching that home. He said go back to shooting and be careful. I am sure if we had .22's it would have been different.

September 26, 2010, 05:51 PM	#2
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Having done that previously, and subsequently finding out that the pellets penetrated someone's denim pants (but not the skin), double that distance - or better work out a drive system where folks take turns driving the birds to a line of Guns

September 26, 2010, 06:07 PM	#3
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Roy, Obviously, it depends on the size of the shot -- the bigger the pellets, the farther they go. I've been the architect for several gun clubs and my field tests have verified the published safety data. The 300-yard safety zone for target loads is conservative, #7-1/2 trap loads will typically land at about 200-yards and #9 skeet loads at about 185-yards. If you maintain 300-yards between shooters you'll be safe from other upland shooters. Of course, there's always some idiot who uses turkey loads for upland birds -- stay about 350-yards from these guys. Problems arise when hunters overestimate the distances, and you're closer than you think you are. A light dusting of bird shot, from a adjacent shooting party, serves as a reminder that you're too close. Not long ago, I reported when three of my squad-mates, all experienced comp shooters, went over to the Colorado River for the opening of dove season. At practice the next weekend, I asked how their shooting had been. The first reply was, "We had a great time." Seconded by "Yeah, it was awesome!" That was immediately followed by: "Bull s**t, someone shot me!!!" Always wear eye and ear protection when shooting!

September 27, 2010, 01:27 PM	#5
BarkeyVA Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2008 Location: Southeastern Virginia Posts: 123	My friend, who belongs to a dove hunting club, invited me to go with him as his guest. The club's primary safety rule was that hunters must see blue sky below the bird before shooting. Consequently, I passed up a number of shots that day hunting over sunflowers.

September 27, 2010, 04:17 PM	#7
markj Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2005 Location: Crescent Iowa Posts: 2,971	I see hunters in the field, I go over and run em off it is private land and I got rights exclusive on most places round here.

September 27, 2010, 06:31 PM	#10
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	I'm not saying it is LETHAL at that range- but it could, as the old BB gun warnings said -"put an eye out" Yet another reason to wear eye protection. How many times do we see warnings on a box of .22 saying effective range is 1 mile? It is real easy to accidentally launch a payload of #7-1/2 or 6's on the right angle that can maximize distances....... Safety first - let the bird go if there's a chance of sending a payload towards others.....

September 27, 2010, 06:41 PM	#11
rjrivero Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2008 Location: NW Ohio Posts: 1,399	Take your lessons from Dick Chaney. Don't shoot towards other hunters. Especially rich Texans who donate to your Campaign Funds.

September 27, 2010, 09:56 PM	#12
Scubasimmons Senior Member Join Date: February 10, 2009 Location: Sammamish, WA Posts: 119	If it's 3-400 yards I'm not too worried but I agree most people overestimate the distance. I think courtesy dictates not leveling down on a fellow hunter no matter the distance. Having been shot at 80-100 yds with dove load on bare skin I question penetration at 800 yds. It stung but didn't penetrate the back of my arm.

September 28, 2010, 05:31 PM	#15
publius Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2005 Location: Mississippi/Texas Posts: 2,505	I never, ever shoot at a low bird in a dove field, no matter if someone is directly in front of me or not. Distance doesn't matter. It's not worth putting someone's eyes out or getting buttstroked by me if it you shot in my direction. __________________ "Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress, but I repeat myself." Mark Twain

September 29, 2010, 08:53 PM	#17
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 3,248	Low Birds Some folks say that one should not ever fire on low flying birds. I guess that is a good safety tip. But what about birds that only give you low targets, like quail. Sometimes they are too low and you worry about any dogs in the area.

September 29, 2010, 10:38 PM	#18
publius Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2005 Location: Mississippi/Texas Posts: 2,505	Quail is a totally different than doves. You aren't in a field lined with people, you have yourself and maybe 2 others behind dogs. Yes, quail hunting is a low-bird game but your guys are right there beside you and you should always know where your dogs are. The dogs should be fairly close to you at all times if trained well, they aren't off running through the woods like deer dogs. __________________ "Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress, but I repeat myself." Mark Twain

September 30, 2010, 08:02 AM	#19
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Having watched some bird dogs jump up after a flushing quail, it still pays to let the bird get up a little so you don't shoot the dog; otherwise, the post about having only a few hunters on either side is spot on

September 30, 2010, 07:50 PM	#20
Artie Member Join Date: September 12, 2010 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 85	I've been peppered many times at dove shoots over the years. It kind of comes with the territory at certain fields, especially if they are long fields. I've never known anyone to have skin broken or even have any pain from it. It's not necessarily because someone shoots a low bird either, it's just how the land lays sometimes. Fortunately I've never hunted with someone stupid enough to shoot level to someone in line with them at close range. I'm very skeptical about bird shot being a danger at more than 250 yards based on personal experience. I would almost bet anything that it's not possible for birdshot to travel 800 yards. It wouldn't bother me at all if someone 800 yards away were shooting directly at me with a shotgun. 800 yards is over half a mile. Last edited by Artie; September 30, 2010 at 08:02 PM.

September 30, 2010, 07:56 PM	#21
nathaniel Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2010 Location: North Dakota Posts: 600	Theres people that will say "Birdshot" wont hurt you at 25 yards. But they dont know dittily squat, I have had shot bounce off me at about 150 yards you can feel it but it doesnt hurt by any means. Still I dont like to shoot towards anyone its just engrained in my brain if I see people not to shoot that way.

October 2, 2010, 04:20 PM	#22
HunterGuy Senior Member Join Date: September 24, 2010 Location: South Jersey Posts: 263	Reguardless of shot size you will still rain lead down on them, and I for one do not like it done to me so i don't do it to other people. Either wait for the bird to clear away from them or call out to them that one is heading their way (and hope they don't shoot at you in the meantime).

October 3, 2010, 12:05 PM	#23
Ryanfromcanada Member Join Date: April 23, 2009 Posts: 57	"Even if it is far enough away to not pose a lethal danger it is a courtesy. If you are so hard up for a bird that you will forgo a common courtesy then hunt where there are fewer people and more birds. Seems like a terrible habit to get into shooting with people downrange no matter the trajectory and energy" +1