Cast lead bullets for .45 ACP

[Doc Hoy]

I tagged this onto a different post but I think that post had pretty much played itself out.

Couldn't get answers> So here goes again.

I am looking at casting bullets for .45ACP (two 1911s) and this will be my first smokeless reloading experience.

I do a lot of BP cartridge reloading in several different calibers. I have cast bullets for a long time and can get pretty consistent results.

1. There are some posts which refer to hard cast and soft cast bullets. Can someone explain the difference.

To me a hard cast bullet is BHN 14 or higher. Soft cast is just about anything less.

I am going to opt for a RN bullet and I like Lee molds.

I am thinking somewhere around 230 for the 1911.

2. Some of you reported good service from this bullet. Are there any detractors out there?

3. The bullet produced by this mold is .452. I have a Lyman Manual that says problems can result from using bullets larger than .451. Again, do any of you have experience like that reported in the Lyman Manual?

The Lyman Manual lists Bullseye, Unique, Red Dot, PB, SR 7625 and SR 4756 (This is an old manual) and a Lyman RN bullet with one groove.

As regards powder, I would like to use the same powder for reloading Nagant revolver and Tokarev rounds.

4. If you take that into consideration and assuming it is doable, which of the powders would be a good place to start? Unique seems to be very popular.....

[g.willikers]

While I don't cast my own, the ones I buy, usually the 200 grain SWC, are advertised as hard cast.
They are sized .452.
I've used many, and most, of the usual powder choices, depending on availability, without noticing enough difference that matters.
With similar, if not exactly the same, velocities, accuracy, and leading - little to none.
About the most differences in the powders is that the ones that are the "dirtiest" also clean up very easily, as they leave a soft and easily removed residue.
But I prefer the Hodgdon powders, when available, as they burn very clean.
Hope this helps, some.

[Doc Hoy]

I am going to keep watching for additional folks, but your pointer on powder is helpful.

[Shootest]

My favorite load for 45 ACP in my 1911 is a lee molded 228g LRN over 4.5g Bullseye sized to .451. It just can’t be beat by factory loads accuracy wise.

[Doc Hoy]

Okay now that is also very useful.

Does Bullseye do okay in the smaller Tokarev and Nagant calibers?

Any votes for Unique?

[Jim Watson]

Nearly all commercial cast .45 bullets are .452", jacketed .451".

Lyman has always been skimpy on cast bullet diameter, even though they are usually taken as the authoritative source. But I guarantee you will not get worthwhile results with a .376" bullet in any older .38-55, for example.

[Doc Hoy]

That about does it....

The Lee mold it is. I think I will try a six cavity mold this time.

It would be my first.

[nemesiss45]

FWIW, I load 230 gr round nose on 5.5gr of unique. I just used the base load for plinking, but it cycles fine, so I have not done more load development yet. I used unique because I had it on hand, so maybe others are better... but I have no complaints. I recently started casting, but having only one batch under my belt which have not been loaded or shot yet, I cant add anything to that side of the issue

[chris in va]

Skip the 6 cavity mild until you get some experience. I've been casting for four years and still couldn't produce more than 3-4 decent bullets when a friend loaned me his 6 holer. Stick with the two hole mold.

Caveat on the Lee 228. While its a good mold, be aware the profile isn't the same as a standard 230 gr FMJ. It is 'fatter' further up on the ogive and you will have to do a few plunk tests to get the seating depth correct.

One more thing. Lee molds are aluminum. When you close the mold after dropping bullets, put it on a flat surface. It'll prolong the life of the mold and help align the steel pins better. Also check to see the mold block pins are properly staked as some aren't and the pins can fall out.

[noylj]

For casting, I consider 12BHN to be hard enough for everything I do. If I need a harder alloy, I use a gas check.
You need to slug the barrel and determine what the actual barrel groove diameter is and the bullets generally need to be AT LEAST 0.001" larger than the groove diameter. You always slug the barrel.
Bullets up to 0.454" will work great in any .45 Auto I have ever used. In fact, I DO NOT size any of my cast bullets.
Currently, I tumble lube all my cast bullets.
I found back in the '70s that as-cast bullets shot as well or more accurately than any sized bullet.
The main problem with "oversize" bullets is using an expander that is too small (or, like many folks, not using an expander at all and only flaring the case mouth).
Trying to squeeze a 0.452" bullet into a case with an unexpanded ID of 0.448" will often cause the bullet to either be swaged down in size (and be very inaccurate and lead the bore) or the bullet will be seated crooked and there will be a bulge in the case at the base of the bullet that prevents the case from chambering.
Get an expander that will leave the case ID at 0.450-0.451" for a 0.452" bullet and you'll have no problems.

[Doc Hoy]

Thanks for the post.

More good info.

[Mike / Tx]

I have the Lee 230gr TL 6 cavity mold and to be honest while I have poured and shot quite a few of them I prefer the H&G 68 200 SWC bullet more. Lee also makes a mold for it as well in both 2 and 6 cavity.

It just shoots as good or better in most cases, and it also uses less lead, and powder. There is also a TON of load data out there for it as well.

Not to distract from the 230gr bullets, just I prefer the one over the other.

Also don't forget you CAN tumble lube any bullet design with the Alox type lube.

As to the 6 cavity mold, if you plan on pouring up a bunch, they are hard to beat. Most have a hard time with them due to not getting them up to temp. IF you DO get one, just start off pouring the end 2 cavities, and after a half dozen or more pours add another cavity. Keep this up until your using all of them. They need to be kept hot, so you either have to have your alloy up to around 725'ish or more, or you need to pour faster like I do. I usually keep the alloy temp around 685-700 for my 6 cavity Lee's, and I will pour at a faster rate. I started out casting with a 6 cavity mold so now when I switch to a 2 cavity man it seems to take forever to get a pan full.

Just remember if you DO get the 6 cavity mold they do not come with handles, you will have to order a set separately.

For loading, either style needs to be checked for fit in your chamber, before you load up a bucket full. The 200's are usually seated where you have about a thumbnails worth of the front driving band exposed. The RN version when seated properly will have the bottom edge of the ogive either just sitting against the lands, or immediately behind them. It depends on your chamber. Either way you still need to do "The Plunk Test" to determine the proper seating depth for your pistol.

[A pause for the COZ]

I had and sold that LEE 230gr mold.. YUC.. Did not like how deep you have to seat it.

My two main molds are the Lyman 452374. This in my opinion is the gold standard for rn 45 bullets.

My second mold is the 6 cavity LEE copy of the HG68 swc.
This is the Gold standard for swc's and LEE sells it cheap.

the 45 is not fussy about the melt. Range scrap is fine and actually shoots best.

I choose Bulls eye powder for my 45's
It is the exact same powder Uncle Sam used in the 1911. Good enough for them is good enough for me.

[totalloser]

Yeah, low pressure cartridge, doesn't require particularly hard lead. Range lead varies a LOT though. If you don't see any cast bullets in the range lead, you will likely need to add something for hardness.

I agree with using a two cavity ESPECIALLY for a first mold. I started with all six cavity, and then got a two. For small batches the two cavity is actually faster. It heats up and starts dropping good bullets a ***LOT*** faster. If I want to cast a thousand in one sitting the six cavity makes sense, but somewhere around 3-400 the two cavity is literally faster. Mostly because one cavity in the six always seems to be problematic.

Having said that, I found a trick- well actually reapplied an old trick: Resmoke the mold cavities if you are having trouble. Works like magic. Some folks use a hot plate to preheat the 6 cavity mold- I bet it works great, but haven't tried it yet. I pour slabs on the backside of the mold to preheat it, and large sprues on the plate until it's hot enough.

I got 230 truncated cone for .45 and would go RN if I did it again. The feedramp dings the curve on the TC making them ugly up a bit. Seems to be 100% cosmetic, but irks me. A LOT of folks use Semi Wadcutter in 1911's with great success. I have read over and over that they are more reliable feeding than RN.

Look into powder coating since you are just getting started. I wish I had gone that route in the first place. I probably will never use my pan lube stuff again, and it cost about the same as getting started with lube.

Oh on the .452" issue, that is what my 6 cavity drops and with pan lube I shot them that way. With PC I size them to .452". The "plunk" test (as noted by Mike) is usually the way to verify if it's right for your barrel, but I share my .45's with a few buddies (glock, 1911's) and so far .452" has been fine in all.

As to powder, I use Power Pistol, but it is finicky behind cast. Very little wiggle room. If I were to suggest a powder from my minimal experience, I would opt for something more versatile and forgiving like Accurate #5.

[Doc Hoy]

I have about a dozen one and two cavity molds, so I am ready for the foray into six cavities.

I do the resmoke trick now and again but in the smaller molds I find I don't really need it that much.

The metal I use is ballast from ships (U.S. Navy) which is very soft (8 or 9) which I use for cap and ball and Wheel weights which I alloy pretty consistently to 14 or there abouts.

Powder is a different story. The LGS had exactly one jug of pistol powder (Alliant 300 MP) which has no load for .45 ACP. I am still looking.

[Doc Hoy]

....I took advice from several of you.

I was originally set on a round nose bullet. I wanted to use a six cavity mold.

Then "Pause" said try the HG68.

Another of you advised against the six cavity mold even though I figured I could make it work. (I am pretty stubborn)

So in the end, I went for two molds one for each of the bullets above. Also dropped to two cavity molds to keep the price down. (I know I can make those work)

I'll prolly tumble lube them with some leftover lard from a pork butt my better half cooked up, the other day. (Don't you believe it.)

[schmellba99]

I shoot cast lead almost exclusively out of my pistols these days, mostly because it's way cheaper than anything else. My 1911's don't notice the difference - all projos are .452" sized with a single lube groove.

Don't get too bent up on hardness - a whole lot of that is simply a necessity by commercial projo manufacturers trying to mitigate damage during shipping. They have a need to produce higher BHN numbers than you will in your garage molding, because you don't have to account for shipping & handling factors they do.

You can cast pure wheel weights int he garage and shoot them lights out, and you'll find that accuracy probably improves (or at least stays the same) and lead is simply easier on your firearm than jacketed is.

Unique is a great powder. I load it in my 1911's, along with Universal. Both are 1a and 1b in terms of favorites for pistols in my loading room. Unique is a little dirtier, but it is not excessively so and it cleans up without issue. Universal is not quite as dirty, but depending on the load can produce a touch of smoke. It's really 6 of one, a half dozen of the other.

[Doc Hoy]

Thanks for the post.

I would be very happy if I could find some powder.

Pray for me.