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Old February 14, 2015, 08:10 PM   #26
FITASC
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I opened the action, disassembled it. Needs some polishing at the lugs as the action was stiff. Snapped it to my shoulder and looked down the sights.
That will smooth up with use - don't go taking a Dremel or similar to it - take just a tad TOO much and you've ruined the gun. Those measurements are done in .001 increments if not .0001.

Don't look at the sights, look at your target.
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Old February 15, 2015, 12:04 AM   #27
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I am not certain, but I believe what FITASC means is look hard at a point, close your eyes, shoulder the gun, then open your eyes. If the gun fits it will be pointing at where you were looking. If your eyes are open as you bring the gun up you will unconsciously guide it to point at your target. Feel free to correct me if I have botched this up.
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Old February 15, 2015, 10:21 AM   #28
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You should not have to fit yourself to your gun - it should fit you to the point that it becomes a natural extension of your arms and eyes. If you are having to crawl up the stock, smash your cheek down hard on the comb, etc., in order to make the gun shoot where you are looking and pointing, then the gun does not fit you properly.
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Old February 16, 2015, 01:10 AM   #29
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FITASC: That's what I was trying to get at. To test how comfortable I was with the gun, I chose an object on the wall as a target, then swing the gun to my shoulder and attempted to aim. With the Stoeger, the moment the stock hit my shoulder, my sight acquisition was perfect and I was ready to pull the trigger. I could embarrass my cousin's semi-auto 12 gauge in a round of skeet shooting with this gun. It felt better than my father's Remingtom 870. The other two SxS shotguns I tried just felt...unnatural. I had to duck my head lower to get a good aim on those, and I tried them several times, lifting them to my shoulder and attempting to aim. Each time I did so, I found myself having to adjust myself or the gun.

It reminded me of shooting a Glock for the first time. I shoot a 1911 very well, and my sight acquisition is perfect when I bring up the handgun to aim. With a Glock, I have to make an adjustment each time because the grip angle is different. This Stoeger felt like my 1911.

I'm glad I didn't take a liking to the CZ or the Itasca prior to trying them out, because I would have been disappointed.
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Old February 16, 2015, 03:49 AM   #30
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There are some exceptions, but you generally don't aim a shotgun. If it fits it will point where you look.

This is what Phil Bourjaily wrote on "How to Find a Shotgun That Fits You Just Right", short of getting a professional fitting, in Field & Stream.

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(C)heck fit by closing your eyes, mounting the gun, then opening your eyes to see if you’re looking straight down the rib, or maybe seeing a bit of the rib if that’s what you prefer
If you do the same thing with your eyes open, you can't help but guide the gun to point where you look, even if it wants to point elsewhere.
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Old February 16, 2015, 06:38 AM   #31
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If you get a Stoeger, get a plain Uplander with 2 triggers and extractors. They have a pretty solid reputation as dependable guns. Tons of them used in CAS. The single trigger
This^^^^^.

I have an Uplander in .410....have had it for years. No complaints. No problems. Works as advertised.
I have, also, a Baikal IZH-43 in 12 gauge. Single trigger. i have had that gun much longer than the Stoeger. I shoot it fairly often at 16 yard Trap. It also has functioned well....reliable, accurate.
I like SXSs and own five of them. The two mentioned as well as a Parker, an old Ithaca, and a LeFever...all double triggers except for the Russian gun.
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Old February 25, 2015, 07:11 PM   #32
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I decided on the Coach Gun Supreme due to the factory recoil pad, the upgraded wood finish, and the removable chokes. Part 31481, with a double trigger, with the blued receiver and barrels. I'm considering getting a second IC choke since one is IC and one is M, but I'm not sure if there's much of a point to it for just breaking clay.

One thing I was curious about. What are everyone's thoughts on the nickel coated barrels? I've heard they can chip and start to rust. Any truth to that?

Last edited by XtremeRevolution; February 25, 2015 at 07:35 PM.
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Old February 25, 2015, 08:03 PM   #33
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I decided on the Coach Gun Supreme due to the factory recoil pad, the upgraded wood finish, and the removable chokes. Part 31481, with a double trigger, with the blued receiver and barrels. I'm considering getting a second IC choke since one is IC and one is M, but I'm not sure if there's much of a point to it for just breaking clay.

One thing I was curious about. What are everyone's thoughts on the nickel coated barrels? I've heard they can chip and start to rust. Any truth to that?
Is that a gun with 20" barrels? I am more of a fan of longer barrels personally, especially for clay targets.

As to chokes, that would depend on the targets. Are you talking about slow hand-thrown in the backyard stuff, or shooting competition type at a gun club? That would make a big difference. I shoot competition (my screen name is a type of clay target game), and I use a LM for 90% of the targets I see. On a typical 14 station sporting clays course that would mean 11-12 stations with that, and the remainder I will use a SK or IM for really close or really far targets.

As to the nickel topic - are you meaning on the outside or inside of the barrels? Inside is usually hard chromed if anything and is very durable.
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Old February 26, 2015, 02:34 AM   #34
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Your post has me thinking about the barrel length.

The 12 gauge coach comes in a nickel coating on the outside, and the Stoeger coach guns are 20" barrels. Could you elaborate on why you prefer a longer barrel?

The Uplander is $50 cheaper and is available with double triggers, removable chokes, and either 26" or 28" barrels.

Interestingly, the 28" Uplander is 44" total length, which is still 4.5" shorter than a Remington 870 with the same length barrel.

I don't believe I'd be shooting any competition. Just hand-thrown backyard stuff. Maybe find a skeet shooting range nearby. I would like to do some hunting. I've done as much reading as I can, and I'm getting a lot of conflicting reports. People who have shot with 20" coach guns for a decade and hunt everything with them, people who shoot a 20" coach gun better than their friends shoot longer guns, and then people who insist a longer barrel is ideal. Having thought it over more today, I'm still not settled on the barrel length.

From what I have read, it has more to do with the swing than with accuracy or distance, as the chokes will manage that. I haven't shot as much with a shotgun as I'd like, but it seems that people swing too fast with short barrels and stop too quickly. I may drive back down to the range I went to that had the stoeger 12 gauge coach and hold it again next to the uplander.

As a side benefit, the coach would fit nicely in my suitcase when I fly out to California to shoot with my dad. I don't know if the 26" or 28" barrel will fit in a suitcase.

There were also some remarks about some ranges not allowing you to use a gun below a certain length due to muzzle blast. Is this true?

Last edited by XtremeRevolution; February 26, 2015 at 02:46 AM.
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Old February 26, 2015, 08:31 AM   #35
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Short barrels look cool in the movie - they are called "coach" guns because they were intended to originally be used by the person "riding shotgun" on the stagecoach. They were made for very short distances and more spot shooting at targets not generally moving. CASS folks like the historical connection. That said, for shooting dynamic targets in lieu of static ones, it is all about swing, MOI, and doing it smoothly to the target. The current length you see on sporting courses is 30-32 on and O/U and 30 on a semi. This adds length and a little more forward bias which tends to really help with your swing dynamics. Short barrels, while they might start faster, are also faster to stop and thus miss from behind.
If clay games at the club are in your future, go to your local trap/skeet/sporting club and make some friends, ask them about their guns and why they chose what they did. See if they'll let you borrow/rent various types to see what you might like. Even if it is out of your range, it will give you something to aspire to later and also some indications of features you might want on whatever gun you decide.

As to the suitcase - guess that would depend on your suitcase! But you need to read each airlines rules as any gun MUST be in a locked secured case with non-TSA locks (that is my understanding)

Yes there are a lot of places, for safety reasons, that do not allow short barrels or any kind of "tactical" guns. The clay clubs run at a different level then clubs where folks are doing 3-gun stuff or shooting lots of slugs and buckshot. Not saying one is better or worse, just different rules for different reasons, so always check. A short barrel gun is usually out of place at a clay games place just like a 32" O/U is at a 3-gun place. "There's a time and a place for everything".

Last edited by FITASC; February 26, 2015 at 08:41 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old February 26, 2015, 01:10 PM   #36
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As to the suitcase - guess that would depend on your suitcase! But you need to read each airlines rules as any gun MUST be in a locked secured case with non-TSA locks (that is my understanding)
You have that right FITASC. Check the particular airline's policies, but hard sided (not a soft sided or duffel bag type) case with a lock that is not TSA approved. (You do not give the TSA agent the key. Check in early in case they page you when someone down the line wants it opened for inspection.)
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Old February 26, 2015, 01:41 PM   #37
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I've transported handguns before when flying out to California, and they were always in their own locked containers. It was a smooth process. The coach gun breaks down into 20" total length since the stock is about as long as the barrels are, so that makes it fit in even a carry-on size (which I would check in of course). I'll have to measure my larger luggage bags to see if the 26" or 28" barrels would fit.

Looks like I'm making another trip to the gun store to hold the uplander next to the coach gun.

I also decided I won't be competing with this gun. Any trap/skeet shooting will be just for fun. If I do any type of competing, it will be CAS, also just for fun. I would like to start hunting with a buddy of mine though.

Last edited by XtremeRevolution; February 26, 2015 at 01:58 PM.
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Old February 26, 2015, 08:36 PM   #38
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One thing I was curious about. What are everyone's thoughts on the nickel coated barrels? I've heard they can chip and start to rust. Any truth to that?
Yes, nickel can chip or start to peel
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Old March 1, 2015, 08:31 PM   #39
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So I discovered that the CZ is a straight grip due to being a traditional French stock. That's what threw me off about the fit. I now like it.

I held one in the store today. I think in the interest of owning a gun that I can keep for many many years, I will swallow the extra $200 and get the CZ Bobwhite 12 gauge. I compared the fit and finish of the Stoeger to the CZ and I realized in due time, I would grow to dislike it and would lose money selling it to get the CZ.

I think I can get used to the different stock with enough practice.
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Old March 1, 2015, 10:02 PM   #40
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Not quite French - called an English or straight stock, it really shines when a gun has two triggers as it allows you to slide your hand back just a smidgen for ease of using the rear trigger. It also typically allows a shooter to use a longer LOP due to that design while a tightly curved target pistol grip is usually done with a slightly shorter LOP.

The Turks (who make the CZ) do a much better job (IMO) than those Stoegers made in Brazil.
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Old March 1, 2015, 10:35 PM   #41
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Thanks for the correction. One of the gentlemen at the store did mention that it also makes it easier to shoot the two triggers. I'm glad to hear it is better made. It certainly felt much better made.
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Old March 1, 2015, 11:12 PM   #42
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I'm looking on the CZ website and I only see a 26" Bobwhite. Interestingly, I see a 26" and a 28" on Budgunshop.com. I cannot find a 28" Bobwhite anywhere else. Am I to assume that this is just an error?

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...+12g+28%22+MC5

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...+12g+26%22+MC5
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Old March 9, 2015, 12:03 PM   #43
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I pulled the trigger on the Bobwhite 12/26 from Bud's. I know a lot of people don't like them, but as long as they get me a functional gun in reasonable time, I'm not going to complain. My local Gander Mountain had one, and the distribution center everyone uses in this area had one, and past that, not one could be found anywhere within 2 hours of my location.

Gander Mountain had theirs for $750, which after tax would have set me back $800. I got the gun from Bud's for $665 plus $7 insurance, and will pay a $20 FFL fee. Saved $108, which is equivalent to $400 shells of Winchester bulk.

The #1 issue reported is the firing pins are too long and have a tendency to pierce cheap Winchester primers, and the rear trigger being a bit heavy. CZ covers that in addition to a trigger job under warranty, so I'm not concerned at this point.
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Old March 9, 2015, 12:53 PM   #44
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If your looking for fun gun, the Stoeger is just that. I have a two trigger sxs and it is a blast to shoot. It's a coach gun so it would not be great for hunting but in a pinch I guess you could make do. It is not a HD gun for me but I can say that I have put a lot of rounds through it without any isssues. Again it would not be ideal but if that is what you have. I bought the Stoeger coach gun for fun shooting and it fits that role well.
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Old March 24, 2015, 05:19 PM   #45
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Picked up my shotgun after it got delivered from Bud's.

I've read a lot of reviews saying the action is tight, and that's for sure. It will break in nicely after a while. I broke it apart and cleaned everything I could think of and lubed it up with some gun oil I had. Not a huge improvement. I grabbed my grease gun, which I had AMSOIL synthetic multi-purpose grease in, and use that on the lugs, and that smoothed it out quite a bit. All in all I'm very happy with it. The engraving is nice, the case hardened finish is nice, and the walnut stock is very nice.
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Old March 26, 2015, 02:00 PM   #46
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With break open shotguns, you'll want to oil things that slide like ejectors and use a good grease on things that rotate like the hinge pin, the knuckles and any choke tube threads.
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Old March 26, 2015, 10:15 PM   #47
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I just bought a CZ Sharp Tail 12g 30" barrels with 6 extenda chokes. Retail is 1,300. paid 1190 at Rifle Gear in Fountain Valley CA. Can't wait to pick it up and shoot clays!
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Old July 16, 2015, 05:00 PM   #48
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Had a chance to finally shoot this a month ago. What a blast. Literally. Tried both triggers at once and no matter how careful I was, I nicked my middle finger knuckle. Boy was it fun though. The 3 of us ended up going through 140 shells that day shooting trap. I personally shot about 60, and yes my shoulder was feeling it. First round ever shooting trap, didn't know what to expect, and scored a 3/25. Second round, I started getting the hang of it and got 13/25. My shoulder was done though or I would have played a third game.

The reports online of pierced primers on winchester bulk ammo are true. Not on all of them, but it does make it more difficult to open the gun afterward. This happened only on Winchester bulk ammo. I had some Estate ammo and some Remington with me and those fired and ejected without any problems. Since they're only a few cents a box more, I'll be avoiding Winchester ammo moving forward.

All in all, very happy with the purchase and everything worked without any problems.
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Old July 16, 2015, 06:33 PM   #49
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Trap

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First round ever shooting trap, didn't know what to expect, and scored a 3/25. Second round, I started getting the hang of it and got 13/25. My shoulder was done though or I would have played a third game.
That was 16 yard ATA Trap at a Trap range???
One of the problems with using a field gun for Trap is recoil. SXSs tend to weigh in at 7-7.5lbs. A single barrel Trap gun will weigh maybe two pounds more....mitigates recoil. That is one reason why Trap guys can shoot 100 or 200 and not be terribly affected.
About that two triggers at once business...hopefully you have that out of your system. It is surely not the best way to treat your gun. It may have two barrels but it is not designed to shoot them both at the same time.
Just because you can doesn't mean that you should.

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Old July 16, 2015, 07:35 PM   #50
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If by Winchester bulk ammo, you mean their Universals or Super Speeds, do yourself a favor and buy the Federal at Wally World. Those two types of Winchesters are the crappiest shotgun ammo ever made.

Agree with Pete about trying to pull both at once - no need for your shoulder or the breech face to take that punishment. My first time ever firing a DT SxS (being LH) I did that on a pheasant standing on a fence post. Nothing left but some feathers and a HUGE bruise on my shoulder. Took me over 35 years to try one again and I passed on buying what would have been some great guns.

Have fun but be prudent.
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