Need 1911 help

dakota.potts · April 29, 2013, 11:02 PM

My dad's 40th birthday is happening in September. It's a little while away but I had a cool idea the other day that I've been thinking about.

My dad was in the Navy in the early 90's and qualified with the 1911 among other weapons. He qualified the highest level/longest distance rank with the 1911 and loved it and the .45 round. He says he hated when they switched to 9mm and his groupings went all over the place.

Anyways, he's got a .40 compact now that will be his carry gun when he gets his license. But I thought he would really enjoy it if I could find a 1911 for him just like the one he used in the Navy.

This is where I'm stuck though. There are so many 1911 variants and models that I don't know where to start. I know he was in during the 90's (I believe 91-95), on the USS Underwood http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Underwood_(FFG-36). That's the best knowledge I have. The only other thing I know is that it was a .45 1911. I think I remember him telling me once that it was an upgraded model called the 1917 but considering that's the designation for a Thompson I'm not sure that's right.

Also, I won't be able to fund it on my own, so it will have to be a family venture and cost will be an object.

Can any one help narrow things down for me? Thanks

BarryLee · April 29, 2013, 11:16 PM

Possibly the M1911, so I suppose a basic Colt Model 01991 would be the closest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1911_pistol

http://www.coltsmfg.com/Catalog/Colt...1®Series.aspx

Wreck-n-Crew · April 29, 2013, 11:21 PM

http://www.gunsinternational.com/COL...n_id=100333740

Is that what you are looking for?

DeadEye1911 · April 29, 2013, 11:21 PM

I agree with the previous post, the M1911 is probably the most identical thing you'll find. There's so many options for you to buy for him and price range. From Kimber to Rock Island Armory, the sky is the limit. I personally recommend the RIA because it's in my 400-500 dollar price range. By the way, awesome gift idea!

Wreck-n-Crew · April 29, 2013, 11:26 PM

or here? http://www.gunsinternational.com/-Co...n_id=100292014

The 1917 is a revolver as far as i know! anyone?

Tucker 1371 · April 29, 2013, 11:27 PM

The Springfield GI models seem to be pretty faithful reproductions aside from the grips.

Wreck-n-Crew · April 29, 2013, 11:36 PM

Got lost as to the 1917 comment... anyway nice 45 tucker ...BTW I lived in Morristown, Bean station....Family from there.

Water-Man · April 30, 2013, 12:12 AM

I don't know what your budget is, but I'm sure he'd appreciate a Colt Gold Cup in good, used condition.

ClydeFrog · April 30, 2013, 12:20 AM

I saw a NIB unfired US Navy model 1911a1 on www.GunsAmerica.com . I don't recall the firearm price but I can check.
That could look good.
Or ship-shape,

.

CF

dakota.potts · April 30, 2013, 02:11 AM

We don't have the money which is why saving is necessary this far in advance if we're going to do it. I went to look for the model number and found it was no longer up.

RickB · April 30, 2013, 08:34 AM

Yeah, the Springfield G.I. is apparently out of production. The Springfield Mil-Spec has better sights, and is a better shooter, as opposed to historical reproduction.

**Spats McGee** · April 30, 2013, 08:39 AM

Yes, the Springfield GI is (currently) out of production. I'm not convinced it will stay that way forever, though. A good starting place is bac1023's Buyer's guide for all you 1911 addicts.

Tactical Jackalope · April 30, 2013, 08:46 AM

^ +1 on BAC's link there.

Look up the Mil-Spec from Springfield Armory too.

**Spats McGee** · April 30, 2013, 08:52 AM

I'm also curious as to the intended purpose for the 1911. If it's just a range goodie, intended to be as close to historically correct as you can get, that's fine. However, if it's going to be a carry piece, you might want to give up a little historical accuracy. In particular, if I were buying a 1911 to carry, the one feature that I would really look for is a lowered and flared ejection port. Not that I'm a gunsmith, but my gut says that sights, triggers, safeties, etc., can all be added with much less of an investment in smithing time than lowering and flaring the ejection port. (If anyone knows for sure that I'm wrong, please speak up.) Accordingly, that's one investment I'd make on the front end, if it's to be carried. If not, then it's less important.

Andrewh · April 30, 2013, 09:02 AM

your dad would have been in about the same time as me.

they were all frankenguns from WWII.

most rattled pretty badly.

when I qualified, they were using korean war surplus 45 ammo.

of course the officer next to me brought his personal gold cup and match ammo. lol.

Franken guns can be found and are not that much money.
But unless he really cares about that vs just having a nice 1911, I would do as other sugguested and check out other used 1911's.

it also depends on if he wants actual GI configuration vs again, just a nice 1911.

starting price if you can find them for a new RIA would be around 450ish.

springfield GI/milspecs are in the 600 range.

old colts are probably going to run you round 800-1000 depending on condition.

you might find some beat up ones in the 400-600 range. which can't be any worse off than the ones we qualified with.

JimDandy · April 30, 2013, 09:39 AM

Quote:

old colts are probably going to run you round 800-1000 depending on condition.

That's also pretty close to where New Colts are going for, as well as new Sig Sauers, and Kimbers. I've got the Sig 1911 Nightmare in 5" that I like. I plan on getting one with the Pony logo soon as well.

BigJimP · April 30, 2013, 11:10 AM

On a budget...I'd suggest you look at the new Colt's...they're doing pretty well these days.

But look at a bunch of different guns...in my opinion, its about the trigger...find the gun locally that has the best trigger in it ( some of the production level guns are being shipped with really crummy triggers ...and some of them are pretty nice ) but you can't make a judgement without holding each one - and picking the best one you can find.

dakota.potts · April 30, 2013, 01:28 PM

I don't see him carrying a full sized .45. It would just be a nice present. I want it to be like the one he had but niceties like a better trigger, ejection system etc. would be nice. I'm just looking for one that has the same type of trigger he used, similar sights, safeties and everything in the same position, and looks the same or similar. Basically if he were to pick it up it would feel like the one he fired 20 years ago. It's not important that's it's an exact replica of one that saw Normandy Beach or anything like that

**Spats McGee** · April 30, 2013, 02:53 PM

With that additional information, dakota.potts, I'd suggest taking a look at the Springfield Armory Mil-Spec. It's got the lowered ejection port, and better sights than the old SA GI model. To my eye, it's also got a nice old school look to it: parkerized finish, wood grips, etc.

ETA: also, if you want adjustable sights, consider the SA Range Officer.

JimDandy · April 30, 2013, 03:38 PM

Quote:

I don't see him carrying a full sized .45

Because he doesn't carry, because he doesn't carry .45ACP Single Stack, or because it's Full/Government-Model size?

I carry my Nightmare, and it's a 5" barrel. With a good horsehide IWB holster, you stuff most of it down your pants anyway.

dakota.potts · April 30, 2013, 06:25 PM

He has a .40 compact and he's very happy with it because it's double stack (12 rounds), polymer frame, and he likes that it's DAO with no safety to worry about when carrying. He's previously stated that he thinks it may even be a little arrogant to think he can carry his p250 compact and specifically mentioned that he wouldn't try to carry a full size 1911. I know it can be done but you should carry what you're comfortable with.

I brought it up to my mom today. She said if our business does well it would be great to get him the 1970 Chevelle he's wanted forever, but if we can't quite afford that she thinks it's a great idea. So I've got the unofficial go ahead to start getting ideas.

**Aguila Blanca** · April 30, 2013, 07:59 PM

I have to disagree on the Springfield Mil-Spec. First, it has angled cocking serrations. Second, it has Springfield's internal locking system, and a 28-pound mainspring where 23 pounds is the standard. For someone looking to replicate the feel and general appearance of a military M1911A1, IMHO the Mil-Spec makes a lousy choice.

Other than an actual replica (which nobody offers today), the best choice for the purpose intended would probably be a Colt Series 70 replica. It will be nicely blued rather than Parkerized, but mechanically it will be the same as that old Army slabsides ... but with better sights. If the price of a Series 70 replica is too high, you can get almost the same thing with a Colt 1991. The Series 70 replica is a Custom Shop pistol, the 1991 is a production pistol. The 1991 is also blued, but not as nicely polished as the Series 70. The 1991 has a firing pin safety, which was not on the military pistols and is not on the Series 70, but which is totally transparent to the shooter.

Plus ... both are Colts. While it's true that a great many military M1911A1s were NOT Colts, and many were actually "mixmasters" with mismatched slides and receivers, the fact is pretty much all GIs thought of them and referred to them as "Colt 45s." I know I did, and as I now think back to when I was shooting the 1911 in the late 60s I realize that I actually have no idea what make pistol I shot. Back then I didn't know other companies made them for the Army, so I just assumed they were all Colts.

Tactical Jackalope · April 30, 2013, 11:38 PM

On that note. I have a Colt Series 70 I might be selling. See my thread. It's as is.

mxsailor803 · May 2, 2013, 05:00 AM

My wife and just went through the same thing for my father in law back during christmas. Biggest difference was he was in the USMC and my found a some custom pewter silver EGA grips before we found the gun. I got lucky and found him a Springfield GI and tested it out for him. Shot good but the mag spring (Wilson Combat that I fixed for myself

)was weak so I threw in a couple surplus GI mags I had laying around and gave it to him. He's enjoyed it very much and he wants us to have a shootoff whenever I get back stateside. I found the GI used for just under 500.

April 29, 2013, 11:02 PM	#1
dakota.potts Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2013 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 3,084	Need 1911 help My dad's 40th birthday is happening in September. It's a little while away but I had a cool idea the other day that I've been thinking about. My dad was in the Navy in the early 90's and qualified with the 1911 among other weapons. He qualified the highest level/longest distance rank with the 1911 and loved it and the .45 round. He says he hated when they switched to 9mm and his groupings went all over the place. Anyways, he's got a .40 compact now that will be his carry gun when he gets his license. But I thought he would really enjoy it if I could find a 1911 for him just like the one he used in the Navy. This is where I'm stuck though. There are so many 1911 variants and models that I don't know where to start. I know he was in during the 90's (I believe 91-95), on the USS Underwood http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Underwood_(FFG-36). That's the best knowledge I have. The only other thing I know is that it was a .45 1911. I think I remember him telling me once that it was an upgraded model called the 1917 but considering that's the designation for a Thompson I'm not sure that's right. Also, I won't be able to fund it on my own, so it will have to be a family venture and cost will be an object. Can any one help narrow things down for me? Thanks

April 29, 2013, 11:16 PM	#2
BarryLee Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2010 Location: The ATL (OTP) Posts: 3,946	Possibly the M1911, so I suppose a basic Colt Model 01991 would be the closest. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1911_pistol http://www.coltsmfg.com/Catalog/Colt...1®Series.aspx __________________ A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

April 29, 2013, 11:21 PM	#3
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	http://www.gunsinternational.com/COL...n_id=100333740 Is that what you are looking for? __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!*

April 29, 2013, 11:21 PM	#4
DeadEye1911 Member Join Date: March 22, 2013 Location: Rio Grande Valley Texas Posts: 35	M1911 I agree with the previous post, the M1911 is probably the most identical thing you'll find. There's so many options for you to buy for him and price range. From Kimber to Rock Island Armory, the sky is the limit. I personally recommend the RIA because it's in my 400-500 dollar price range. By the way, awesome gift idea! __________________ Jesus said, "I am the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father, but by Me." (John 14:6)

April 29, 2013, 11:26 PM	#5
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	or here? http://www.gunsinternational.com/-Co...n_id=100292014 The 1917 is a revolver as far as i know! anyone? __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!*

April 29, 2013, 11:27 PM	#6
Tucker 1371 Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2008 Location: East TN Posts: 2,649	The Springfield GI models seem to be pretty faithful reproductions aside from the grips. __________________ Sgt. of Marines, 5th Award Expert Rifle, 237/250 Expert Pistol, 382/400. D Co, 4th CEB, Engineers UP!! If you start a thread, be active in it. Don't leave us hanging. OEF 2011 Sangin, Afg. Molon Labe

April 29, 2013, 11:36 PM	#7
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	Got lost as to the 1917 comment... anyway nice 45 tucker ...BTW I lived in Morristown, Bean station....Family from there. __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!*

April 30, 2013, 12:12 AM	#8
Water-Man Senior Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 2,126	I don't know what your budget is, but I'm sure he'd appreciate a Colt Gold Cup in good, used condition.

April 30, 2013, 12:20 AM	#9
ClydeFrog Junior member Join Date: May 1, 2010 Posts: 5,797	US Navy model 1911a1 .45acp... I saw a NIB unfired US Navy model 1911a1 on www.GunsAmerica.com . I don't recall the firearm price but I can check. That could look good. Or ship-shape, . CF

April 30, 2013, 02:11 AM	#10
dakota.potts Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2013 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 3,084	We don't have the money which is why saving is necessary this far in advance if we're going to do it. I went to look for the model number and found it was no longer up.

April 30, 2013, 08:34 AM	#11
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,517	Yeah, the Springfield G.I. is apparently out of production. The Springfield Mil-Spec has better sights, and is a better shooter, as opposed to historical reproduction.

April 30, 2013, 08:39 AM	#12
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	Yes, the Springfield GI is (currently) out of production. I'm not convinced it will stay that way forever, though. A good starting place is bac1023's Buyer's guide for all you 1911 addicts. __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.

April 30, 2013, 08:46 AM	#13
Tactical Jackalope Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2010 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 6,429	^ +1 on BAC's link there. Look up the Mil-Spec from Springfield Armory too.

April 30, 2013, 08:52 AM	#14
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	I'm also curious as to the intended purpose for the 1911. If it's just a range goodie, intended to be as close to historically correct as you can get, that's fine. However, if it's going to be a carry piece, you might want to give up a little historical accuracy. In particular, if I were buying a 1911 to carry, the one feature that I would really look for is a lowered and flared ejection port. Not that I'm a gunsmith, but my gut says that sights, triggers, safeties, etc., can all be added with much less of an investment in smithing time than lowering and flaring the ejection port. (If anyone knows for sure that I'm wrong, please speak up.) Accordingly, that's one investment I'd make on the front end, if it's to be carried. If not, then it's less important. __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.

April 30, 2013, 09:02 AM	#15
Andrewh Senior Member Join Date: July 7, 1999 Posts: 966	your dad would have been in about the same time as me. they were all frankenguns from WWII. most rattled pretty badly. when I qualified, they were using korean war surplus 45 ammo. of course the officer next to me brought his personal gold cup and match ammo. lol. Franken guns can be found and are not that much money. But unless he really cares about that vs just having a nice 1911, I would do as other sugguested and check out other used 1911's. it also depends on if he wants actual GI configuration vs again, just a nice 1911. starting price if you can find them for a new RIA would be around 450ish. springfield GI/milspecs are in the 600 range. old colts are probably going to run you round 800-1000 depending on condition. you might find some beat up ones in the 400-600 range. which can't be any worse off than the ones we qualified with.

April 30, 2013, 11:10 AM	#17
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	On a budget...I'd suggest you look at the new Colt's...they're doing pretty well these days. But look at a bunch of different guns...in my opinion, its about the trigger...find the gun locally that has the best trigger in it ( some of the production level guns are being shipped with really crummy triggers ...and some of them are pretty nice ) but you can't make a judgement without holding each one - and picking the best one you can find.

April 30, 2013, 01:28 PM	#18
dakota.potts Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2013 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 3,084	I don't see him carrying a full sized .45. It would just be a nice present. I want it to be like the one he had but niceties like a better trigger, ejection system etc. would be nice. I'm just looking for one that has the same type of trigger he used, similar sights, safeties and everything in the same position, and looks the same or similar. Basically if he were to pick it up it would feel like the one he fired 20 years ago. It's not important that's it's an exact replica of one that saw Normandy Beach or anything like that

April 30, 2013, 02:53 PM	#19
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	With that additional information, dakota.potts, I'd suggest taking a look at the Springfield Armory Mil-Spec. It's got the lowered ejection port, and better sights than the old SA GI model. To my eye, it's also got a nice old school look to it: parkerized finish, wood grips, etc. ETA: also, if you want adjustable sights, consider the SA Range Officer. __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.

April 30, 2013, 06:25 PM	#21
dakota.potts Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2013 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 3,084	He has a .40 compact and he's very happy with it because it's double stack (12 rounds), polymer frame, and he likes that it's DAO with no safety to worry about when carrying. He's previously stated that he thinks it may even be a little arrogant to think he can carry his p250 compact and specifically mentioned that he wouldn't try to carry a full size 1911. I know it can be done but you should carry what you're comfortable with. I brought it up to my mom today. She said if our business does well it would be great to get him the 1970 Chevelle he's wanted forever, but if we can't quite afford that she thinks it's a great idea. So I've got the unofficial go ahead to start getting ideas.

April 30, 2013, 07:59 PM	#22
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,457	I have to disagree on the Springfield Mil-Spec. First, it has angled cocking serrations. Second, it has Springfield's internal locking system, and a 28-pound mainspring where 23 pounds is the standard. For someone looking to replicate the feel and general appearance of a military M1911A1, IMHO the Mil-Spec makes a lousy choice. Other than an actual replica (which nobody offers today), the best choice for the purpose intended would probably be a Colt Series 70 replica. It will be nicely blued rather than Parkerized, but mechanically it will be the same as that old Army slabsides ... but with better sights. If the price of a Series 70 replica is too high, you can get almost the same thing with a Colt 1991. The Series 70 replica is a Custom Shop pistol, the 1991 is a production pistol. The 1991 is also blued, but not as nicely polished as the Series 70. The 1991 has a firing pin safety, which was not on the military pistols and is not on the Series 70, but which is totally transparent to the shooter. Plus ... both are Colts. While it's true that a great many military M1911A1s were NOT Colts, and many were actually "mixmasters" with mismatched slides and receivers, the fact is pretty much all GIs thought of them and referred to them as "Colt 45s." I know I did, and as I now think back to when I was shooting the 1911 in the late 60s I realize that I actually have no idea what make pistol I shot. Back then I didn't know other companies made them for the Army, so I just assumed they were all Colts.

April 30, 2013, 11:38 PM	#23
Tactical Jackalope Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2010 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 6,429	Need 1911 help On that note. I have a Colt Series 70 I might be selling. See my thread. It's as is.

May 2, 2013, 05:00 AM	#24
mxsailor803 Senior Member Join Date: February 8, 2010 Location: SC Posts: 1,344	My wife and just went through the same thing for my father in law back during christmas. Biggest difference was he was in the USMC and my found a some custom pewter silver EGA grips before we found the gun. I got lucky and found him a Springfield GI and tested it out for him. Shot good but the mag spring (Wilson Combat that I fixed for myself )was weak so I threw in a couple surplus GI mags I had laying around and gave it to him. He's enjoyed it very much and he wants us to have a shootoff whenever I get back stateside. I found the GI used for just under 500.

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