Loading Manuals

stinger · August 11, 2002, 10:40 PM

Why do you recommend two or more manuals?

Extra resource?
Verifiying loads?

Are you aware of any manuals that have incorrect or inadequate data on a particular load?

Feel free to add anything.

Thanks,

Stinger

C.R.Sam · August 11, 2002, 10:47 PM

Extra resource?
Verifiying loads?

Yes.

Sam

swifter... · August 11, 2002, 11:04 PM

You can't have too many. You do have to read them, though...

Commend "The ABC's of Reloading" to your attention. No load data, lots of "how"...
Each manual has a "how" section, you oughta read three, at least, before buying anything else.
Tom

bfoster · August 12, 2002, 07:27 AM

Earl Naramore's Principles and Practice of Loading Ammunition, Samworth, 1954 is the best single book on ammunition I have seen. There are about 500 pages dealing with how and why components are made the way they are, followed by about 300 pages of how best to load ammunition. Naramore was quite well qualified: he worked for Lyman prior to WWII, and was in charge of several ammunition testing programs during the war.

Some information concerning primers is dated: non corrosive, non mercuric primers were neither uniform nor standardized at the time this was written.

This book is out of print, but well worth the effort it will take to find.

Bob

Jeeper · August 12, 2002, 08:37 AM

I have pretty much all the manuals out there. I end up using one or two. I really like the free pamphlets published by the powder companies. They have the newest powders in them.

Johnny Guest · August 12, 2002, 09:20 AM

I had been doing it almost as long I've been reloading--Checking one manual against another. Our own member, the esteemed, the venerable, the laconic, C.R.Sam, taught me the use of the verb phrase, "to second source," for this practice. As in, "You should second source that data, sonny boy."

There is always a possibility, however slight, of a misprint or an out and out error in a given manual. Or, a particular compiler may well be honestly reporting HIS data, but his instrumentation might have been off on a particular day.

I can recite, from memory, good, safe, load information for dozens of cartridges or variations thereof. But except for a very few old stand-by formulae, I won't put 'em out for others without checking my notes, or at least a manual or two, to verify that they are within normal limits. And, you know what? I do not resent in the slightest when someone takes my load tips and cross references them in his/her books. I applaud such care and caution.

Like Jeeper, I rgularly take advantage of the manufacturers' hand out pamphlets. Every handloader should look at the freeby rack in the gun shops, to see if Alliant or IMR or whomever have sent out new booklets. I like to keep back issues, too, just in case a particular powder or bullet is discontinued and I happen to have a stock on hand.

Best,
Johnny Guest

C.R.Sam · August 12, 2002, 09:46 AM

Nuther great addition to any library.

Complete Guide To Handloading.....Phill Sharpe. First print in late 30s, reprinted and updated into the late 40s or so.

NOT outdated except for a few cartridges which have come since.

Tremendous wealth of information from manufacture of componants to field AND lab testing.

Sam

WIL TERRY · August 12, 2002, 10:41 AM

sources for same. I have an entire bookcase devoted to loading data. I never check less than five sources when looking for data, NEVER!
Buy every old manual you can lay hands upon and update yearly with data from the bullet and propellent manufacturers.

Bogie · August 12, 2002, 10:45 AM

And always start at the "minimum/start" load. Every firearm is different, and yours may not like the "hot" loads.

Also, I bought one of those Midway load books for the .45 ACP, and the thing scares me - It's figuring on OALs that I can't reach with my mil-spec barrels, and it isn't shy on adding powder...

C.R.Sam · August 12, 2002, 11:41 AM

Helps to read ALL the text in them too.
Many don't.

Sam

WESHOOT2 · August 12, 2002, 08:44 PM

Means you don't have to make stuff up.

Frankly, you can get by with one book, if you KNOW what you're doing AND have experience AND have a chrono AND more common sense than some one like me.
And spare guns.

IMNSLE you can't have too much data.

(two thoughts: "...but not always..." and "...in your gun...")

griz · August 13, 2002, 05:59 AM

Besides the good practice of "second sourceing", having several books has another advantage. When looking at loads for a cartridge new to you, multiple books can tell you the best powder for the job. When one book says powder A gives the best velocity, it is probably a good powder for that round. When three books say powder B gives the best velocity or within a few FPS of it, then it IS a good powder for that round.

DAVID NANCARROW · August 13, 2002, 06:29 AM

I use the manufacturers handouts, plus the powder and bullet manufacturers. Lyman's 46th edition gives good information for the beginner and the how-to's, plus goes over the basics as to what you will need to start up rolling your own.

August 11, 2002, 10:40 PM	#1
stinger Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2001 Location: west texas Posts: 772	Loading Manuals Why do you recommend two or more manuals? Extra resource? Verifiying loads? Are you aware of any manuals that have incorrect or inadequate data on a particular load? Feel free to add anything. Thanks, Stinger

August 11, 2002, 11:04 PM	#3
swifter... Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 1999 Location: So. CA Mountains Posts: 540	You can't have too many. You do have to read them, though... Commend "The ABC's of Reloading" to your attention. No load data, lots of "how"... Each manual has a "how" section, you oughta read three, at least, before buying anything else. Tom __________________ There are damn few situations so screwed up that adding government to them will not make 'em worse... The best homeland security is an armed & informed citizenery! Molon Labe!

August 12, 2002, 08:37 AM	#5
Jeeper Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2001 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 776	I have pretty much all the manuals out there. I end up using one or two. I really like the free pamphlets published by the powder companies. They have the newest powders in them. __________________ Gun control theory - A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet.

August 12, 2002, 09:20 AM	#6
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	Second Sourcing Load Information I had been doing it almost as long I've been reloading--Checking one manual against another. Our own member, the esteemed, the venerable, the laconic, C.R.Sam, taught me the use of the verb phrase, "to second source," for this practice. As in, "You should second source that data, sonny boy." There is always a possibility, however slight, of a misprint or an out and out error in a given manual. Or, a particular compiler may well be honestly reporting HIS data, but his instrumentation might have been off on a particular day. I can recite, from memory, good, safe, load information for dozens of cartridges or variations thereof. But except for a very few old stand-by formulae, I won't put 'em out for others without checking my notes, or at least a manual or two, to verify that they are within normal limits. And, you know what? I do not resent in the slightest when someone takes my load tips and cross references them in his/her books. I applaud such care and caution. Like Jeeper, I rgularly take advantage of the manufacturers' hand out pamphlets. Every handloader should look at the freeby rack in the gun shops, to see if Alliant or IMR or whomever have sent out new booklets. I like to keep back issues, too, just in case a particular powder or bullet is discontinued and I happen to have a stock on hand. Best, Johnny Guest

August 12, 2002, 10:41 AM	#8
WIL TERRY Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 2000 Location: BLACK HILLS Posts: 1,322	You simply cannot have too much reloading data nor sources for same. I have an entire bookcase devoted to loading data. I never check less than five sources when looking for data, NEVER! Buy every old manual you can lay hands upon and update yearly with data from the bullet and propellent manufacturers.

August 11, 2002, 10:47 PM	#2
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	Extra resource? Verifiying loads? Yes. Sam

August 12, 2002, 07:27 AM	#4
bfoster Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 1998 Location: N. of Fords Switch, OK, USA Posts: 297	Earl Naramore's Principles and Practice of Loading Ammunition, Samworth, 1954 is the best single book on ammunition I have seen. There are about 500 pages dealing with how and why components are made the way they are, followed by about 300 pages of how best to load ammunition. Naramore was quite well qualified: he worked for Lyman prior to WWII, and was in charge of several ammunition testing programs during the war. Some information concerning primers is dated: non corrosive, non mercuric primers were neither uniform nor standardized at the time this was written. This book is out of print, but well worth the effort it will take to find. Bob

August 12, 2002, 09:46 AM	#7
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	Nuther great addition to any library. Complete Guide To Handloading.....Phill Sharpe. First print in late 30s, reprinted and updated into the late 40s or so. NOT outdated except for a few cartridges which have come since. Tremendous wealth of information from manufacture of componants to field AND lab testing. Sam

August 12, 2002, 10:45 AM	#9
Bogie Senior Member Join Date: June 5, 2000 Location: Job hunting on the road... Posts: 3,827	And always start at the "minimum/start" load. Every firearm is different, and yours may not like the "hot" loads. Also, I bought one of those Midway load books for the .45 ACP, and the thing scares me - It's figuring on OALs that I can't reach with my mil-spec barrels, and it isn't shy on adding powder... __________________ Job hunting, but helping a friend out at www.vikingmachineusa.com - and learning the finer aspects of becoming a precision machinist. And making the world's greatest bottle openers!

August 12, 2002, 11:41 AM	#10
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	Helps to read ALL the text in them too. Many don't. Sam

August 12, 2002, 08:44 PM	#11
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	MORE DATA Means you don't have to make stuff up. Frankly, you can get by with one book, if you KNOW what you're doing AND have experience AND have a chrono AND more common sense than some one like me. And spare guns. IMNSLE you can't have too much data. (two thoughts: "...but not always..." and "...in your gun...") __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

August 13, 2002, 05:59 AM	#12
griz Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2000 Location: Middle Peninsula, VA Posts: 1,588	Besides the good practice of "second sourceing", having several books has another advantage. When looking at loads for a cartridge new to you, multiple books can tell you the best powder for the job. When one book says powder A gives the best velocity, it is probably a good powder for that round. When three books say powder B gives the best velocity or within a few FPS of it, then it IS a good powder for that round.

August 13, 2002, 06:29 AM	#13
DAVID NANCARROW Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2000 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,761	I use the manufacturers handouts, plus the powder and bullet manufacturers. Lyman's 46th edition gives good information for the beginner and the how-to's, plus goes over the basics as to what you will need to start up rolling your own.