SAA: Adjusting fixed sights???

Hawken1911 · April 8, 2006, 08:56 PM

Hello,

I took my new Taurus Gaucho to the range today and the groups printed a few inches to the left (I was shooting at around 15 feet). On my semi-autos I would drift the rear sight to the right, but the rear sight on this is a groove in the frame. The front sight is fixed as well, but I thought I read a while back that revolver front sights are sometimes adjusted by rotating the barrel in the frame. Does my barrel need adjusting, or do I need to bend the sight blade? How does one go about sighting in a SAA style gun with all fixed sights, and is it something I can do myself, or is this a gunsmith/factory thing. Any help would be rgeatly appreciated.

Paul

Hawken1911 · April 9, 2006, 07:00 AM

O.K., after more research I've found that turning the barrel to the left for windage is what I need to do, and is actually common. So now the remaining question is, is this something I can do myself; are there "how to" sources out there?

Jim Watson · April 9, 2006, 08:04 AM

It calls for a barrel vise and a frame wrench, kind of expensive tools for one job. There have been a lot of revolver barrels turned with wood blocks in a bench vise and a hammer handle through the frame. There have been some frames bent from the uneven load, too. I wouldn't chance it.

**4V50 Gary** · April 9, 2006, 10:37 AM

I was taught we could actually change the alignment slightly by slamming the gun on a wood worktable. The gun is literally slammed once in the direction you want the sight to move (left side of frame for left drift and right side for right drift) on the revolver frame against the wood table.

Harry Bonar · April 9, 2006, 08:50 PM

Dear Shooter:
DO NOT DO ANYTHING TO YOUR GUN! Do not slam it around or turn the bbl.
This is my opinion; If you are a right handed shooter and if you "pull" a little this is excatly where you'll hit. Try different ammo and try not to pull at all - you for your purpose to resolve this should'nt know when the gun goes off.
Harry B.

ConRich · April 10, 2006, 08:12 AM

Harry B has a good point. I would test the gun from a bench supported on a bag or other support. If it still shoots to the left then have a gunsmith retime the barrel.

Rich

Hawken1911 · April 11, 2006, 03:20 PM

I appreciate the concern about trigger pull guys, and that would be my first suggestion for an amateur too. But I'm a seasoned shooter and pistol instructor, and I can shoot nice groups at point of aim with every other gun I own, whether they be SA, DA, or DAO. This is definitely a windage sight adjustment that needs to be made.

I don't think I can bring myself to try to adjust it by slamming it, so I think I'll send it to a professional with the proper tools. Thanks for the info.

Archie · April 11, 2006, 06:23 PM

There are two 'easy' ways to adjust windage on a SAA.

Lock up the gun in a vise, being careful to protect the finish, and use a cresent wrench to gently bend the front sight - opposite the direction to move bullet strike. The front sight is a little 'off', but I think it adds character. (Like the lines around my eyes.)

Other 'easy' adjustment is to widen the rear sight notch in the direction to move the bullet strike. Use a small swiss fill with a 'safe' edge in the bottom of the notch, so you don't deepen it. (Sometimes, they can use deepening - you're a big kid.)

**Unclenick** · April 12, 2006, 11:31 AM

Just to clarify that last point for newbies, the rear sight is moved in the opposite direction of the POI error; a front sight is moved in the same direction as the POI error, or toward the original group center from the shooter's perspective. As Archie stated, you can think of this in terms of moving the impact point rather than moving the sites. This reverses which sight is referred to as moving towards or away from where you want things to go, so just be sure you have that sorted out. POI starts out grouping left, so correcting the front sight means moving it left, so the resulting POI moves right.

I agree on the rear notch file approach. I did that with a Charter Bulldog that shot about 2" left at 25 yards. I loved the wider rear sight view. Calculate how much wider it would have to be on your gun and cut that width out of a piece of black construction paper and put a 90 degree turn on it and tape it in place and have a look to see if it is satisfactory?

Nick

**44 AMP** · April 15, 2006, 08:16 PM

Before you do something permanent to your gun, try SEVERAL different brands of ammo/bullet weights. You may just find one that shoots to where your sights are. If you do, then shoot that ammo and be on target.

If, however, you can't find one that hits point of aim, or you are determined to shoot a particular load, then adjust your gun. Personally, I favor the rear notch adjustment. I have never been in favor of "banging" the gun against anything. It can work, but it is hardly precise.

Another thought, since no two people look through the sights exactly the same, try having someone else (or several someones) shoot the gun, and see if the gun shoots "off" for them. And is it consistantly "off" the same amount/direction for each shooter?

check these things out before permantly altering a gun, lots of times, you will find that no alteration is needed. Or, it may be you that needs altering.

Teach · April 20, 2006, 12:12 PM

Also consider having the muzzle recrowned, sometimes the slightest defect at the crown can cause a deflection of the bullett.

Harry Bonar · April 22, 2006, 02:17 PM

Dear Shooters:
I really don't care about a shooters qualifications, or how much we shoot.
I get people to bring me fixed sighted guns all the time, "it shoots low and to the left!" I take it out as one suggested and bed it down and it shoots dead on (of course I realize that a piatol can shoot low and left).
If you load a gun for the shooter and stagger the loads in the cylinder or magazine 99% of shooters (including me!) will "flinch" low and left if right handed - low and right if left handed.
This is crucial in real on the street combat confrontations - bad guys can't shoot for----- so assuming most bad guys are right handed as you draw your weapon step slightly to your left - chances are his round will go right past you!
Harry B.

April 8, 2006, 08:56 PM	#1
Hawken1911 Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Posts: 162	SAA: Adjusting fixed sights??? Hello, I took my new Taurus Gaucho to the range today and the groups printed a few inches to the left (I was shooting at around 15 feet). On my semi-autos I would drift the rear sight to the right, but the rear sight on this is a groove in the frame. The front sight is fixed as well, but I thought I read a while back that revolver front sights are sometimes adjusted by rotating the barrel in the frame. Does my barrel need adjusting, or do I need to bend the sight blade? How does one go about sighting in a SAA style gun with all fixed sights, and is it something I can do myself, or is this a gunsmith/factory thing. Any help would be rgeatly appreciated. Paul __________________ "Aude Aliquid Dignum" (Dare Something Worthy)

April 9, 2006, 07:00 AM	#2
Hawken1911 Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Posts: 162	O.K., after more research I've found that turning the barrel to the left for windage is what I need to do, and is actually common. So now the remaining question is, is this something I can do myself; are there "how to" sources out there? __________________ "Aude Aliquid Dignum" (Dare Something Worthy)

April 9, 2006, 10:37 AM	#4
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	I was taught we could actually change the alignment slightly by slamming the gun on a wood worktable. The gun is literally slammed once in the direction you want the sight to move (left side of frame for left drift and right side for right drift) on the revolver frame against the wood table. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

April 9, 2006, 08:50 PM	#5
Harry Bonar Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: In the Vincent, Ohio general area. Posts: 1,804	fixed sight Dear Shooter: DO NOT DO ANYTHING TO YOUR GUN! Do not slam it around or turn the bbl. This is my opinion; If you are a right handed shooter and if you "pull" a little this is excatly where you'll hit. Try different ammo and try not to pull at all - you for your purpose to resolve this should'nt know when the gun goes off. Harry B.

April 11, 2006, 03:20 PM	#7
Hawken1911 Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Posts: 162	I appreciate the concern about trigger pull guys, and that would be my first suggestion for an amateur too. But I'm a seasoned shooter and pistol instructor, and I can shoot nice groups at point of aim with every other gun I own, whether they be SA, DA, or DAO. This is definitely a windage sight adjustment that needs to be made. I don't think I can bring myself to try to adjust it by slamming it, so I think I'll send it to a professional with the proper tools. Thanks for the info. __________________ "Aude Aliquid Dignum" (Dare Something Worthy)

April 9, 2006, 08:04 AM	#3
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,534	It calls for a barrel vise and a frame wrench, kind of expensive tools for one job. There have been a lot of revolver barrels turned with wood blocks in a bench vise and a hammer handle through the frame. There have been some frames bent from the uneven load, too. I wouldn't chance it.

April 10, 2006, 08:12 AM	#6
ConRich Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2004 Location: Maine Posts: 299	Harry B has a good point. I would test the gun from a bench supported on a bag or other support. If it still shoots to the left then have a gunsmith retime the barrel. Rich

April 11, 2006, 06:23 PM	#8
Archie Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2000 Location: Hastings, Nebrasksa - the Hear Posts: 2,209	Been there, done that... There are two 'easy' ways to adjust windage on a SAA. Lock up the gun in a vise, being careful to protect the finish, and use a cresent wrench to gently bend the front sight - opposite the direction to move bullet strike. The front sight is a little 'off', but I think it adds character. (Like the lines around my eyes.) Other 'easy' adjustment is to widen the rear sight notch in the direction to move the bullet strike. Use a small swiss fill with a 'safe' edge in the bottom of the notch, so you don't deepen it. (Sometimes, they can use deepening - you're a big kid.) __________________ There ain't no free lunch, except Jesus. Archie Check out updated journal at http://oldmanmontgomery.wordpress.com/

April 12, 2006, 11:31 AM	#9
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,060	Just to clarify that last point for newbies, the rear sight is moved in the opposite direction of the POI error; a front sight is moved in the same direction as the POI error, or toward the original group center from the shooter's perspective. As Archie stated, you can think of this in terms of moving the impact point rather than moving the sites. This reverses which sight is referred to as moving towards or away from where you want things to go, so just be sure you have that sorted out. POI starts out grouping left, so correcting the front sight means moving it left, so the resulting POI moves right. I agree on the rear notch file approach. I did that with a Charter Bulldog that shot about 2" left at 25 yards. I loved the wider rear sight view. Calculate how much wider it would have to be on your gun and cut that width out of a piece of black construction paper and put a 90 degree turn on it and tape it in place and have a look to see if it is satisfactory? Nick __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

April 15, 2006, 08:16 PM	#10
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,803	Just a thought Before you do something permanent to your gun, try SEVERAL different brands of ammo/bullet weights. You may just find one that shoots to where your sights are. If you do, then shoot that ammo and be on target. If, however, you can't find one that hits point of aim, or you are determined to shoot a particular load, then adjust your gun. Personally, I favor the rear notch adjustment. I have never been in favor of "banging" the gun against anything. It can work, but it is hardly precise. Another thought, since no two people look through the sights exactly the same, try having someone else (or several someones) shoot the gun, and see if the gun shoots "off" for them. And is it consistantly "off" the same amount/direction for each shooter? check these things out before permantly altering a gun, lots of times, you will find that no alteration is needed. Or, it may be you that needs altering.

April 20, 2006, 12:12 PM	#11
Teach Member Join Date: January 31, 2006 Location: Southeast Oklahoma Posts: 24	Also consider having the muzzle recrowned, sometimes the slightest defect at the crown can cause a deflection of the bullett.

April 22, 2006, 02:17 PM	#12
Harry Bonar Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: In the Vincent, Ohio general area. Posts: 1,804	fixed sights: Dear Shooters: I really don't care about a shooters qualifications, or how much we shoot. I get people to bring me fixed sighted guns all the time, "it shoots low and to the left!" I take it out as one suggested and bed it down and it shoots dead on (of course I realize that a piatol can shoot low and left). If you load a gun for the shooter and stagger the loads in the cylinder or magazine 99% of shooters (including me!) will "flinch" low and left if right handed - low and right if left handed. This is crucial in real on the street combat confrontations - bad guys can't shoot for----- so assuming most bad guys are right handed as you draw your weapon step slightly to your left - chances are his round will go right past you! Harry B.

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