Raidex Crayons as lead cast bullet lube: Any experiences?

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Dear all people,

Has anyone experience in using [Crayon] animal markers directly as bullet lube? I am referring me to these: http://www.raidex.de/en/products/ani...ng-sticks.html.

It is supposed to be "special waxes and paraffins" as it states on their webpage. They supposed to be made in Germany by Hauptner&Herberholz and not China.

I am planning in rubbing the hole cast bullet with this animal marking stick specially filling the lube grooves.
I use the marker stick as is (no heating nor pan lubbing).

What do you guys say? Any personal experience with this? Specially: does it lead or not?
Any personal experience is much appreciated!

[g.willikers]

It would have to hold up to the temperatures involved in the bullets being fired to avoid smearing the rifling.
Any way to know?
Beeswax candles are popular with archers for lubing bow strings.
But they might not hold up to firearm temperatures either, since it melts at around 150 F.

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Till now I use Texaco Marfak NLGI 2 (MP2) lithium grease. But since it is a bit "greasy" it is messy and not that pleasant for the long run to use.

I am looking therefore for the animal marker crayon stick as an alternative.

Does anyone have first hand experience with them? May be another brand as well.

[briandg]

You said nothing about what you are shooting.

[dahermit]

Due to your name, I assume that you are interested in non-traditional bullet lubes because of availability issues. If your primary shooting interest is handguns, have you explored Powder Coating as an alternative to wax/grease lubes?

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

I shoot 9mm Luger for my S&W SD9VE pistol and for my Revolver (1873 SAA Pietta/Heritage 5.5") I shoot my homemade (shortened 38 spl/357 mag cases to 19mm) 9mm Federal Rimmed.

Special bullet lubes are locally NOT availlable at all. At least Texaco Marfak NLGI 2 (MP2) lithium grease works very well and abviously is availlable. I indeed just brushed out my bore of the Revolver with an brass Hopes #9 Kit and NO LEAD WHATSOEVER CAME OUT (onto an White paper).

I just bought such an Raidl Raidex animal marker and loaded 6 9mm Federal Rimmed bullets. They lube well like an lip stick and all grease grooves (tumble lube design) are filled completely. It is not a mess at all. Works very well for reloading just still do not know for leading.

Any experiences are much welcome.

[noylj]

Go to cast boolets for many lube formulas.
Beeswax is a GREAT bullet lube for ALL purposes.
Almost any grease will work.
Paraffin waxes, like Crayola Crayons, don't work well as they are very hard and brittle. If the wax can be bent, it will probably do OK.
If you can order on the internet, go to

http://www.lsstuff.com/lsstuff-stuff

for GREAT inexpensive lube.
Best, for you, might be Lee Liquid Alox or White Label 45/45/10 tumble lubes. Easy to use and work very well and a little goes a LONG way.

[T. O'Heir]

Availability issues work both ways too. Can't say as I've ever seen or heard of a Raidl Raidex animal marker, up here. Kind of suspect it may be too thin/light for bullet lube.
The MSDS says don't get it on your skin(kind odd considering it goes of animals), but also says it's non-toxic.
http://viehkennzeichnung.de/pdf/vieh..._031111_en.pdf
Mind you, Lee Liquid Alox will rot your brain if it gets the chance. Stuff is extremely toxic.

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

First of all: I was a member on Cast Boolits Forum but they banned me due to "I wasn't as liberal as the liberals so the liberals were not very liberal with me"; as well they did not like I wrote some words of my Posts in red and almost forced me to use another colour or no Color at all; overall they didn't like my religios and political views as I posted on their "politics and Religion" subforum (I was pro Christian and was for Trump as President) so they banned me accusing me to be "booring and low Level trolling."

So I took off from Cast Boolits as they just tolerate their own opinion.

Second: I tried 7 shots with These cast bullets lubed with Raidex Raidl max Crayon animal marker stick and have NO leading at all. It smokes more though, but NO LEADING as I brushed the Barrel out and nothing was to see on an White paper. I say the crayola animal marker is a success for bullet lubing. I tried it on an hot Motor Hood and it did not melt at all. It is supposed tho hold out 80 degrees Celsius before it starts to liquify. So, NO LEADING AT ALL WITH THIS LUBE.

Third: I stopped making 9mm Federal Rimmed and instead I went with 38 spl cases just seat the cast bullet similar to an wadcutter completely into the case so it has the same empty airspace between powder and bullet as an 9mm Luger. That gives me 9mm Luger Performance in 38 spl cases in an 357 Magnum Revolver. A very nice Invention!

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

T O'Heir,

I was for 4 years in Canada working and we had there Raidl Raidex max Crayon animal marker sticks made in Germany.
You have them there in Canada.

They work for bullets lube as I do not have leading after I tried 7 shots.

[mikld]

Two thoughts; first I'd have to look up the MSDS on the product for an opinion...

Second, your "opinion" of castboolits.com is 100% wrong. I've been a member since 2009 and have never seen nor experienced any "liberal, liberal for liberal" BS in any of the many sub forums. Did you ever stop to think it could actually be your fault? I occasionally see posts with red words. Plus I've seen many differing views/opinions and unless they were crude and insulting, they were never deleted nor blocked. If you were banned from that forum (which has been successfully running, with very few "arguments", for many, many years), I would say, confidently, it was your attitude...

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Dear Mikld,

These are my personal experiences with Cast Boolits Forum.
FIRST they got upset because "I had a too quick learning curve" as they called it (whatever that means).
From then the bullying and Mobbing started towards me.
SECOND: the guy with coloured and bold letters is me (pseudonym is AJG). They literally said: "it is just you, the only one, who uses colours in the Posts".
THIRD: they admitted having "lost" lots of valuble members due to such Details an even less reasons. As they (their Moderators) almost litterally said.
FOURTH: My Posts they found "booring" and that is the main reason they banned me.
FIFTH: as the low Level Mobbing and bullying got more pronounced I told them that "their attitude was a form of Internet censoring". That they did not like at all and promptly banned my pseudonyn AJG. You can check out my Posts if you want.
SIXTH: the whole issue started indeed with my Posts on their "Religion and politics" Forum so I have a strong Feeling the Cast Boolits Moderators did not agree with my religious and political Point of view. What happened as well they did not win me on Argumentation (since I am a lawyer) so they just made me shut my mouth by banning me from their Forum.

[briandg]

Be careful. Internet forums are a very valuable resource and you should hold on to these resources like a wino holds his bottle. I strongly advise that you not even enter into any political discussions.

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Hi ya all,

I shot several rounds now with the Raidex Raidl animal marker stick (made of various waxes and parraffins) and I HAVE NO LEADING AT ALL.

I shot even a snake with 3 shots dead.

It smokes more dough than Lithium grease when shot but this animal Crayon markers are remarkably soft (they are allways soft) but stay soft solid till 80 degrees Celsius. Natural Environment under sunshine does not get to 80 degrees Celsius. The Crayon animal marker paint still sticks on my truck Hood as hot it got and after a voyage of 60 Km at about 85 Km/h. No signs of smearing nor flowing.

I just Held a Piece under a candle and it started to flow but does not catch fire, rather it smokes quiet a bit.
For comparison I tried Vaseline and Vaseline melts way quicker than the animal marker Crayon. As well the Crayons are less liquid than Vaseline but nothing hard nor brittle (as candles are).
The animal marker Crayon has an melting Point of about 176 Farenheit (80 degrees Celsius).

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

briandg,

Yes I agree.
But the iffy Thing is I did even contribute way more on any Kind of subjects on Cast Boolits Forums than I got info from them.

Yes partially it may be my fault to not deescalate the issue.
But since I was new on Forums (never wrote on one) I did NOT KNOW THERE WERE Moderators since that I Interpret as INTERNET CENSORING LIKE CHINA OR USSR (comunists).

I did believe Forums are for FREE SPEECH and any Moderation is considered in Southamerica as INTERNET CENSORING.

As well I assume on political-religious Forums I can tell my honest free opinion (but it was not the case on Cast Boolits).

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Dear briandg,

If the Price of participating on Forums (or any other internet) is that other People control what you can say or think I believe then it is time to "let go the wino and wine bottle and be no more drunkard".

If Internet is censored I believe most freedoms are gone by then.

[g.willikers]

Generally speaking, it seems like the easiest way to get a thread closed on this forum is to stray too far from the subject. :

[briandg]

Guy, let me tell you the most important part of the internet.

This site belongs to someone. Someone who is trying to make a living on it while providing a service to his customers.

If someone busts you down because they don't like what they are seeing, that is not censorship, that isn't denying you your free speech, and it's sure as heck not like some dictatorial country that will shut you down if you say something that they don't want to hear. They will only bust you down of you push them beyond their tolerance.

These things belong to commercial enterprises. They utterly, completely own it and have ever right to moderate. I have driven my brother in law out of my home because he failed to be polite. I've seen people pushed out of restaurants for being loud and obnoxious. Owners of internet sites will do the same thing. They own it. You have all the free speech that you can desire, as long as you aren't doing it in a place that you aren't welcome. Really pretty simple.

Here's something I have said a number of times to various people for various reasons.



"this isn't your living room, and I don't have to listen to what you say, so shut up or get out."

Just do yourself a favor and leave anger and aggression out of the posts. We all need to learn from your experiences, and if you take a deep breath and wait an hour before posting, we can continue to have dialogues about gun related things.

[Pathfinder45]

Getting back to using something for bullet lube that was really intended for an entirely different purpose: In times of shortages or making do with what is available, or perhaps, something simply more economical, it can be worthwhile to experiment with what's at hand. I like the idea of beeswax, but not the price. I cast and shoot a lot of bullets in 45 Colt. I have experimented a little with adding crayons melted into the lube, just for color and to see what would happen, but I'm done with that. What I use for bullet lube can be found in any hardware store in the plumbing section. I buy the cheapest toilet-bowl sealing-wax-ring they have. It's waterproof, soft, sticky, and works really well, just as it is. Yes, it's a bit messy. but you can harden it some by melting it together with harder waxes until you get the results you want. It makes a good black-powder lube just the way it is.

On the other note: Thanks to the moderators of this site, we can stay on topic and not get side-tracked into the sordid arenas of politics and religion. We probably can't do much to change those things anyway, but we can certainly change our bullet lube.

Keep yer powder dry..........

[briandg]

Ive heard of a lot of people using toilet wax for lube and I believe one of them just blended in paraffin. It's really not a lot softer than beeswax, it's sticky as heck, and should actually do a good job once blended.

I have dealt with so many accursed toilet rings in the last 40 years that I'd rather be held down and stung by killer bees than ever touch another of those foul things in my life.

No, I'm not a plumber. I've owned and rehabbed several houses and a complete rebuild of the plumbing systems is mandatory. I'm also the one who was called whenever anyone who knew me needed a light switch replaced or a leaky faucet.

[Pathfinder45]

That's funny, Brian. And now that it's been brought up, I hope, for your sake, that you don't find yourself dreaming about changing out toilets tonight.
But you are exactly right, these lube recipes are like an alloy of metals melted together, but in this case, it's mutually soluble oils, fats, waxes, etc. Oftentimes it really doesn't matter what the source of the ingredients are, as long as the finished product has the right properties to do its job. However, weird as it may be, if you use lard or tallow in your lube, or if the rumor gets out that you do, someone down the firing line could feel defiled by your gunsmoke
Here's a story about how just such a thing as unclean bullet lube caused some serious offenses: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Rebellion_of_1857
And that's why be don't need to have religious debates foul up a forum dedicated to the shooting sports.

[briandg]

My high school history teacher spent hours on war. He actually threw that in. He spent a lot of time focusing on weaponry. Maybe that was a good thing. I leaned how to paper patch a bullet

[mikld]

Well, just reading your posts and your attitude here, I am not surprised your account was deleted

[TheGuyOfSouthamerica]

Thanks briandg,

Thanks for that Explanation. I did not know it at all.

I did not know These Forums are for someone to make his living.
I did not know they are "Commercial Enterprises".

I allways considered the Internet as an Experiment started by anarchists which is utterly successfull.

Now I see that I may have scared off some "customers" if Cast Boolits Forums are "Commercial". I did not know it was "all about Business" since guns and reloading for me is a free time Sport.

Now I understand better. I just would not see why I should post anything on any Forum if it is "all Business" since knowledge and science gets perverted if Money gets involved.

mikld: the concept "attitude" is Kind of open to any Interpretation.

But now I see and know that all non-Mainstream is not welcome.

[Pathfinder45]

Yeah, we could all stand to lighten up every now and then. I've been corrected at least a couple of times here, and that's OK. (Inspite of the fact that I've never been wrong. I thought I was wrong, just once; but I was mistaken!)
What I have learned in this thread, is that if I run out of bullet lube, in a pinch, I could raid my granddaughter's crayons, right? Think of all the colors......