pumps that unlock after firing

youngun · January 27, 2002, 04:18 PM

So, the guy at the range says the Mossies unlock for you, to start the cycling back, and that's one reason he likes them over the 870's. I says,"really? I didn't notice the 870 NOT doing that."

Pumped it, (dry, of course!) held back on the pump, and pulled the trigger; sure enough, you have to let go the tension before you can cycle.
Interesting I never noticed in while firing (at times as fast as I could), must be the dynamics of recoil, etc.

So, do all 870's behave this way?
Do all the Mossie's not?
Pros/coms?

Thank you!

Dave McC · January 27, 2002, 05:10 PM

Mine don't. Even the 20 gauge has seen some use, maybe 500-1K rounds.The rest vary from a coupla thousand to quite a few thousand, and run smooth.

Gottanidea this fades during the breakin period. Run more ammo through yours and see what happens.

Adamantium · January 27, 2002, 06:18 PM

I've never noticed my Mossberg 500 doing that, and neither of my friend two 500 do that either.

OTOH, my Winchester 1300 Def. does exaclty what you are talking about. I can remember once when I shot that thing and actually had to pull the forend back, it is always already cycled back by the time I/m done feeling the recoil and all I do is slide it forward. If you get use to it then it makes for a very quick follow up shot.

The pro is it can be quick, but the con is that if you are not used to it you will be trying to push it back when it is already is thinking to yourself "What in the world is wrong with my gun, why won't it cycle back?".

Sincerely,
Adam

youngun · January 27, 2002, 07:02 PM

Dave, your's don't "which"?
Lock after fire, or cycle themselves?

Fatcat · January 27, 2002, 09:35 PM

I can't make mine do it repeatedly (lock after pulling the trigger). Even then, I have to be pulling fairly hard on the fore-end. I don't always have to release the tension, a little jiggle of the fore-end will send it back.

Sounds more like a break-in thing than a mechanical thing, like Dave said.

David Park · January 28, 2002, 05:19 AM

Just dry-fired my Mossy 500, and it does not unlock after firing unless tension is released. However, dry-firing is not firing. The recoil of the gun independent of the fore-end is often enough to "unlock" the fore-end.

I tend to push forward on the fore-end until I'm ready to cycle the action, so I wouldn't notice either way.

Dave McC · January 28, 2002, 06:26 AM

Mine cycle themselves.It took a bit of changing things around when I started shooting trap to not cycle w/o thinking. Other than trap, I pull back on the forend a bit when mounted, so the cycle starts immediately.

A couple of my 870s if held vertically and the release hit will open by themselves, tho not all the way. Work polishing, of course.

PJR · January 28, 2002, 07:53 AM

Never actually considered this issue but on my 870, the action will open without the trigger being released when dry fired. It's a ten year old 870P.

Paul

BigG · January 28, 2002, 08:46 AM

All the pumps I've shot unlock once the hammer drops. That's why some claim they can unload one as fast as an automatic.

The big difference between later model pumps and the older versions was the addition of a disconnector. On an older shotgun like an Ithaca or a Winchester you can hold back the trigger and fire it simply using the pump stroke.

There's either something wrong with the shotgun you mention or it needs to have the newness worn off, probably the latter. HTH

Kharn · January 28, 2002, 09:28 AM

My 870 used to require letting off the pressure before unlocking, but it no longer does while dry firing (after about 500-750 through it). Firing heavy field loads sometimes requires reducing pressure before it will unlock, but I also typically only fire those shells after expending about 100 "dove" shells during long strings of clays.

Kharn

January 31, 2002, 08:01 PM

One has to take notice about the safety issue. If the round doesn't go off and the shooter is pulling back the fore-end and the locking opens right away, then there is danger of delayed ignition of the round.

In my Mossberg 835 the lock won't open unless you let go the tension of the fore-end. I have shot about 3000 rounds whit it.

NC-VT · February 4, 2002, 06:02 PM

My 590A1 does not unlock after the trigger is pulled, when dry firing. I have to release tension, first. I'll try to check it next time I take it out and put some rounds through it.

SAWBONES · February 4, 2002, 07:45 PM

No matter if the forend "automatically" unlocks or not on firing, the action should definitely be mechanically locked at the instant of primer ignition, right? I have a Remington 870 and a Benelli Nova, both of which allow the forend to drop as soon as the trigger is pulled (on the Benelli, the forend actually springs back), but neither shotgun is unsafe or allows the action to open before the firing of the shell is completed.

As to the issue of "hangfires", I've NEVER had one in many (hundreds of thousands?) of pistol + rifle rounds fired, nor in the several hundred shotgun rounds I've fired to date. (I'm new to SGs.) I assume this is a rare occurence for SG rounds? It certainly seems so for pistol and rifle ammunition. Best.

January 27, 2002, 04:18 PM	#1
youngun Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 2001 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 324	pumps that unlock after firing So, the guy at the range says the Mossies unlock for you, to start the cycling back, and that's one reason he likes them over the 870's. I says,"really? I didn't notice the 870 NOT doing that." Pumped it, (dry, of course!) held back on the pump, and pulled the trigger; sure enough, you have to let go the tension before you can cycle. Interesting I never noticed in while firing (at times as fast as I could), must be the dynamics of recoil, etc. So, do all 870's behave this way? Do all the Mossie's not? Pros/coms? Thank you! __________________ New firing pin: $12. New extractor: $15. Ballistic fingerprinting: worthless.

January 27, 2002, 06:18 PM	#3
Adamantium Senior Member Join Date: June 6, 1999 Location: El Paso, TX Posts: 1,021	I've never noticed my Mossberg 500 doing that, and neither of my friend two 500 do that either. OTOH, my Winchester 1300 Def. does exaclty what you are talking about. I can remember once when I shot that thing and actually had to pull the forend back, it is always already cycled back by the time I/m done feeling the recoil and all I do is slide it forward. If you get use to it then it makes for a very quick follow up shot. The pro is it can be quick, but the con is that if you are not used to it you will be trying to push it back when it is already is thinking to yourself "What in the world is wrong with my gun, why won't it cycle back?". Sincerely, Adam __________________ New gun, same ol' shot.

January 27, 2002, 07:02 PM	#4
youngun Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 2001 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 324	Dave, your's don't "which"? Lock after fire, or cycle themselves? __________________ New firing pin: $12. New extractor: $15. Ballistic fingerprinting: worthless.

January 27, 2002, 09:35 PM	#5
Fatcat Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2000 Location: Rockaway Beach, OR Posts: 376	I can't make mine do it repeatedly (lock after pulling the trigger). Even then, I have to be pulling fairly hard on the fore-end. I don't always have to release the tension, a little jiggle of the fore-end will send it back. Sounds more like a break-in thing than a mechanical thing, like Dave said. __________________ Patrick J. Sullivan :: [email protected] "When I whet my flashing sword, and my hand takes hold in judgement, I will take vengeance upon mine enemies, and I will repay those who haze me."

January 28, 2002, 05:19 AM	#6
David Park Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2001 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 1,224	Just dry-fired my Mossy 500, and it does not unlock after firing unless tension is released. However, dry-firing is not firing. The recoil of the gun independent of the fore-end is often enough to "unlock" the fore-end. I tend to push forward on the fore-end until I'm ready to cycle the action, so I wouldn't notice either way. __________________ Libertarian for Bush '04

January 27, 2002, 05:10 PM	#2
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Mine don't. Even the 20 gauge has seen some use, maybe 500-1K rounds.The rest vary from a coupla thousand to quite a few thousand, and run smooth. Gottanidea this fades during the breakin period. Run more ammo through yours and see what happens.

January 28, 2002, 06:26 AM	#7
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Mine cycle themselves.It took a bit of changing things around when I started shooting trap to not cycle w/o thinking. Other than trap, I pull back on the forend a bit when mounted, so the cycle starts immediately. A couple of my 870s if held vertically and the release hit will open by themselves, tho not all the way. Work polishing, of course.

January 28, 2002, 07:53 AM	#8
PJR Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2000 Posts: 1,127	Never actually considered this issue but on my 870, the action will open without the trigger being released when dry fired. It's a ten year old 870P. Paul

January 28, 2002, 08:46 AM	#9
BigG Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 1999 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 4,334	All the pumps I've shot unlock once the hammer drops. That's why some claim they can unload one as fast as an automatic. The big difference between later model pumps and the older versions was the addition of a disconnector. On an older shotgun like an Ithaca or a Winchester you can hold back the trigger and fire it simply using the pump stroke. There's either something wrong with the shotgun you mention or it needs to have the newness worn off, probably the latter. HTH __________________ o "The Earth is degenerating today. Bribery and corruption abound. Children no longer obey their parents, every man wants to write a book, and it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching." Assyrian tablet, c. 2800 BC o "In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a scarce man brave, hated, and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain o "They have gun control in Cuba. They have universal health care in Cuba. So why do they want to come here?" Paul Harvey o TODAY WE CARVE OUT OUR OWN OMENS! Leonidas, Thermopylae, 480 BC

January 28, 2002, 09:28 AM	#10
Kharn Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2001 Location: Maryland Posts: 1,531	My 870 used to require letting off the pressure before unlocking, but it no longer does while dry firing (after about 500-750 through it). Firing heavy field loads sometimes requires reducing pressure before it will unlock, but I also typically only fire those shells after expending about 100 "dove" shells during long strings of clays. Kharn

January 31, 2002, 08:01 PM	#11
Zitadel Guest Posts: n/a	One has to take notice about the safety issue. If the round doesn't go off and the shooter is pulling back the fore-end and the locking opens right away, then there is danger of delayed ignition of the round. In my Mossberg 835 the lock won't open unless you let go the tension of the fore-end. I have shot about 3000 rounds whit it.

February 4, 2002, 06:02 PM	#12
NC-VT Member Join Date: February 4, 2002 Location: Central NC Posts: 44	590A1 My 590A1 does not unlock after the trigger is pulled, when dry firing. I have to release tension, first. I'll try to check it next time I take it out and put some rounds through it.

February 4, 2002, 07:45 PM	#13
SAWBONES Senior Member Join Date: March 17, 1999 Location: The third dimension Posts: 670	No matter if the forend "automatically" unlocks or not on firing, the action should definitely be mechanically locked at the instant of primer ignition, right? I have a Remington 870 and a Benelli Nova, both of which allow the forend to drop as soon as the trigger is pulled (on the Benelli, the forend actually springs back), but neither shotgun is unsafe or allows the action to open before the firing of the shell is completed. As to the issue of "hangfires", I've NEVER had one in many (hundreds of thousands?) of pistol + rifle rounds fired, nor in the several hundred shotgun rounds I've fired to date. (I'm new to SGs.) I assume this is a rare occurence for SG rounds? It certainly seems so for pistol and rifle ammunition. Best. __________________ "Humani nihil alienum"

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