The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old September 13, 2012, 09:55 AM   #1
hulley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 9, 2008
Location: Hoschton, Ga.
Posts: 726
? on hard cast bullets.

While at a pin shoot last night, a fellow shooter mention to keep hard cast velocity under 1100fps. Is this correct? I was under the impression that soft lead should be kept down but hard cast can go much faster.

I just bought 1000rds of Missouri Bullets 158gr RN hard cast for .38/.357mag. I loaded up some 38spl but I will be doing .357mag very soon.
__________________
Nov 2, 2011 sent form 4, SS Sparrow. Arrived May 29, 2012.
Jan 30, 2012 sent form 1 for SBR. Arrived July 12, 2012
Jan 22, 2013 Sent form 4, 762-SDN-6. Arrived Sept 13, 2013
hulley is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 11:34 AM   #2
drail
Junior member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2008
Posts: 3,150
They can and are driven much faster. If the bullet's size and hardness are correct for your barrel very little leading is experienced. If the bullet is undersized or too hard to obturate (swell) and fill the grooves leading can be a problem.
drail is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 11:34 AM   #3
dahermit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 28, 2006
Location: South Central Michigan...near
Posts: 6,501
"hard cast bullets" is nebulous. Does not indicate how hard. Try them and see if you have undue leading (the proof in the pudding), adjust your load accordingly. Vague, but sage-sounding advice from another shooter is usually worth exactly what it costs.
dahermit is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 11:39 AM   #4
jmortimer
Junior member
 
Join Date: January 24, 2010
Location: South West Riverside County California
Posts: 2,763
Done right you can go faster but I would be more concerned about accuracy. To do it right, you need to slug your bore and order the proper size bullet. You may have the right bullet. The only way to know for sure is to check. Missouri Bullets might be able to give you some tech support. They have a good reputation.
jmortimer is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 11:44 AM   #5
mikld
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 7, 2009
Location: Southern Oregon!
Posts: 2,891
"Hard Cast" is many times just a marketing term used to sell bullets to shooters that think harder is better. Bullet fit is the key to shooting clean, leading free bullets. For revolvers, bullets the same size as cylinder throats works very well. For semi-autos, .001"-.002" over groove diameter is good. IMO, bullet fit is more important than BHN (I've shot some over max. loads of True Blue in a .357 Magnum (oops!) and 140 gr. SWC cast from wheel weight alloy, mebbe 10 BHN with no leading because the bullets were .359", cylinder throats are .359", and groove diameter is .357". No idea how fast they were going but I'd guess at over 1300 fps).

Slug you cylinder throats and barrel and size, or purchase, bullets accordingly, same diameter as cylinder throats...
__________________
My Anchor is holding fast!
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
mikld is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 11:53 AM   #6
zxcvbob
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2007
Location: S.E. Minnesota
Posts: 4,720
Expect leading if you get over about 1500 fps, but the bullet/gun combination may surprise you (can be a good surprise or bad.)

My Ruger .30 Blackhawk doesn't lead no matter what; I've had cast bullets (no gas checks) up to 1720 fps in that thing. OTOH, the Taurus Gaucho .357 leads badly with anything I shoot, hard lead or soft, even .38 target wadcutters.
__________________
"Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth
zxcvbob is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 12:26 PM   #7
GeauxTide
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 20, 2009
Location: Helena, AL
Posts: 4,415
I've loaded some 44 Missouri Bullets to 1200 without leading.
GeauxTide is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 12:37 PM   #8
hulley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 9, 2008
Location: Hoschton, Ga.
Posts: 726
Thanks guys I'll try and get a little more info from Missouri. Nor sure how to slug a barrel but I'll find out and proceed before making anymore rounds. So far I've only made up a few for my .38 LCR.
__________________
Nov 2, 2011 sent form 4, SS Sparrow. Arrived May 29, 2012.
Jan 30, 2012 sent form 1 for SBR. Arrived July 12, 2012
Jan 22, 2013 Sent form 4, 762-SDN-6. Arrived Sept 13, 2013
hulley is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 01:26 PM   #9
Edward429451
Junior member
 
Join Date: November 12, 2000
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 9,494
I believe that lead is about 7 or 8 BHN, and that WW's are about 10 or 11 BHN, and hardcast afaik is anything from about 14 BHN and up. When I water drop my WW's they harden to ~24 BHN and I have driven them to 1400 fps without leading. I've driven (oversized .460) 45/70 boolits to ~1700 fps without leading, and they were not hardcast. Air dropped 20/1.

The guy at your pin shoot was just repeating what he's heard before. That's exactly what they used to say (back in the 80's), don't go over 1000 or 1100 fps with lead. We know better now!

What size are your Missouri bullets?
Edward429451 is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 02:10 PM   #10
oldmanFCSA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 8, 2010
Location: WISCONSIN
Posts: 283
With a properly prepped bore, I've shot 310 grain TC-SWC from my 10.5" Ruger Super Blackhawk at 1440 fps rough average, while shooting metallic sihlouettes (sp??). These were handcast from wheelweights.
Definitely a WARM loading, but with proper sizing and lube, little leading will occur. If you want, gas check bullets will lead less but sizing is very important.

Reference: NEI al mold 310-320 grain dependent on alloy mix.
__________________
OldmanFCSA = "Oldman" at www.fcsa.org
FCSA Member, SCSA Member, NRA Member, & AMA Member
"Oldage & Treachery will overcome Youth & Skill"
oldmanFCSA is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 02:19 PM   #11
zxcvbob
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2007
Location: S.E. Minnesota
Posts: 4,720
Hulley, what powders do you have? 8 grains of Herco works really well with 158 grain cast bullets in .357 Mag. AA#7 is another good one but I don't remember the charge weight (about 11 grains I think, but you better look it up)
__________________
"Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth
zxcvbob is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 03:13 PM   #12
hulley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 9, 2008
Location: Hoschton, Ga.
Posts: 726
.358 diameter with a Brinell of 12. I'm using 4gr of Unique for my 38spl, something light for targets. I'm picking up a SP101 that I have on layaway in a week or so and I'm on the lookout for a GP100 in more than likely 4".

So I havent loaded the .357mag yet but I'm ready to go. I want to wait until I get my SP101 in hand. I have other powders for the mag loads, probably go with 2400. I want to do some light loads for targets but no too light. I really should pick up some magnum primers as well but I think i could get away with the pistol primers on the light stuff.
__________________
Nov 2, 2011 sent form 4, SS Sparrow. Arrived May 29, 2012.
Jan 30, 2012 sent form 1 for SBR. Arrived July 12, 2012
Jan 22, 2013 Sent form 4, 762-SDN-6. Arrived Sept 13, 2013
hulley is offline  
Old September 13, 2012, 03:35 PM   #13
zxcvbob
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2007
Location: S.E. Minnesota
Posts: 4,720
You don't need magnum primers unless you are using H110 or 296 or maybe HS-6 powders. (that's the only ones I can think of) Unique and 2400 work better with standard primers.

Before you buy anything else, try 6.5 to 6.8 grains of Unique.
__________________
"Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth
zxcvbob is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.06754 seconds with 10 queries