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Old October 14, 2008, 05:49 PM   #1
under_dawg
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LIL' GUN compressed

I am loading up a 180gr XTP with Lil' Gun. I measured out 14.0 grains, but it seems it will be compressed. I was using Hodgdon's load info. It listed 13 gr min 15 gr max. This was for a Nosler Partition bullet, not an xtp. Maybe the bullet length of the Partition is less. Has anyone loaded the 180gr XTP with 14 gr of Lil' Gun and noticed the compression? This will be fired from a 4" GP-100 357 mag. Does anybody know the length of a Nosler Partition .357 180 gr bullet?

Last edited by under_dawg; October 14, 2008 at 07:34 PM. Reason: added caliber; Nosler bullet length
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Old October 14, 2008, 06:06 PM   #2
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What case/caliber?
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Old October 14, 2008, 06:07 PM   #3
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sorry about that its a .357 mag
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Old October 14, 2008, 08:49 PM   #4
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Standard operating procedure for an unknown load is start 10% lower than max, fire a few checking for pressure signs, extraction, etc and then work up 1-2% at a time until you reach max.

All that and um, no I haven't used Lil gun loaded with your bullet combo. Likely it will be ok, but I would have started at the reccomended starting load and worked my way up.
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Old October 15, 2008, 03:21 PM   #5
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I will start at the min as soon as I can tell if it safe to compress Lil' Gun or not. The min I see for the nosler partition is 13.0 grains, but it looks as though it will be slightly compressed.
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Old October 15, 2008, 03:23 PM   #6
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under dawg,
Yes , Ive used that load - 15.0 gr Li'l Gun, 180 gr XTP, cci-500 primer , W-W cases. Shot good in my M-28, Security Six and my Marlin 1894 carbine (all .357's). You'll be able to penetrate a deer from brisket to butt! Ought to work fine on black bear too, though I don't know that from experience. Good shootin'!


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Old October 15, 2008, 04:32 PM   #7
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To your question - is it safe to compress - maybe ...a little. But I wouldn't compress it in a .357 mag case - and if you do, I think you'll find it's going to be really dirty and inconsistent on performance - but I think you'll find its going to be dirty anyway.

I would recommend using TiteGroup for that load / it'll take up a lot less volume. TiteGroup is designed to perform consistently/and ignite properly even in .357 mag / .44 mag cases where it doesn't come close to filling the case. I might consider LongShot if you don't want to use TiteGroup - but again its a lot slower than TiteGroup. I've used TiteGroup for a long time in all of my pistol calibers from 9mm thru .44 mag - and I really like it.

TiteGroup is a low volume drop / so you do need to be careful and make sure your loader is tuned up (but you should do that anyway). The only thing I use Lil Gun for is .410 shotgun shells - and its dirty in a .410 even at 12.9 grains in a Remington STS .410 hull - but comparing performance using a shotshell primer Win 209 vs a handgun primer is probably not fair either - but Lil Gun is a relatively slow burning powder in the Hodgdon lineup of powders.

I don't have all my hard bound loading manuals here - but I think its interesting that Lil Gun only appears in the paper back Hodgdon manual I have in my office for a 180 gr Nos Part or for a 158 gr Hdy STP bullet - vs the smaller 125 gr or 146 gr. I'm confident Hodgon tested it - or it wouldn't be in their manual - but that's an awful lot of volume of powder in a relatively small case. I do know guys that use Lil Gun on .44 mag loads - because they like something that fills up the case ( with arond 23 or 24 grains ) - but everybody I've talked to about that says its real dirty in .44 mag as well.
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Old October 15, 2008, 04:52 PM   #8
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Compressed

I shot "Lil Gun" in a slightly compressed load in two 22 Hornet's. I was not satisfied with the accuracy, but the RIFLE did not show any pressure signs. If you do a proper crimp the "Lil Gun" should not be a problem if you get the accuracy you are loking for. I just could not get the accuracy with the powder. Tom.
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Old October 15, 2008, 04:54 PM   #9
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I called Hodgdon about an hour ago and spoke with the guy who did the testing. He said it should be fine slightly compressed. He said he did not indicate as a compressed load in the manual because it was a pistol load, whatever that means?? He said the load data for the .357 180gr Nosler Partitionshould be ok with any 180gr jacketed bullet. I remember in Lee's 2nd edition reading that Speer Golddots and The XTP have larger hp cavities and are therfore longer than other jhps. Lee gives the XTP it's own category in his 2nd edition.
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Old October 15, 2008, 04:59 PM   #10
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How did the cci-500's do? I see a magnum primer is called for in the load data, but I too have heard that the loads are more accurate with a standard primer for reasons that can't be explained.
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