flintlocks---Blue Ridge versus Great Plains

Kevan · February 7, 2002, 07:42 PM

Blue Ridge or Great Plains...Great Plains or Blue Ridge...I can't decide!

I have a .54 percussion Great Plains rifle and just love it. Shootinest rifle I've ever seen. Now I want me a flintlock. Part of me wants the long rifle attributes of the Cabela's Blue Ridge. It sure looks good! And part of me says, "go with what you KNOW works---the Great Plains" except that we are talking flintlocks. My question is: which has the better lock and ignition?

Hell, evenually I'll probably get both but I need help to decide which to buy first ---LOL!

BenW · February 7, 2002, 08:50 PM

I have the percussion Great Plains as well and love it. One of the best production guns out there I think. I'm also looking at flintlocks right now and am leaning towards the Jaeger rifle at Tennessee Valley Manufacturing http://www.avsia.com/tvm/

Kind of a wait, but they sure are purty, and being of German extraction, it would be neat to use a design one of my ancestors might have used.

Cap n ball · February 8, 2002, 11:50 AM

That Blue Ridge rifle is a real good looker. You fellas may want to go to that link provided in the 'Tuning flintlocks' thread that 'Salt' posted. Lots of real good info about lock types and touch-holes.

Salt · February 9, 2002, 12:33 PM

I recommend having a custom handmade rifle built for you when you move up to Flintlock.

http://www.nmlra.org/

Locks? Siler locks are very good.

Kevan · February 9, 2002, 06:05 PM

Salt, I joined the NMLRA a few months back. Good organization. At this time, I cannot afford a custom flinter, but am keeping an eye to the future. I'm real partial to TVM's Southern-style rifles. I really like the Southern poor-boy style. I hear tell that Dixie discontinued it's Tennessee Mountain rifle. Why?? I heard they couldn't keep them in stock because they sold so well. I guess it's like the restaraunts that always discontinue the meals everyone liked best. I like the Blue Ridge because of the way the stock looks. I'm leaning hard towards the Blue Ridge.

ed mason · February 10, 2002, 05:20 PM

Kevan,

Before you go off and buy a production gun take a harder look at TVM.AS you know they build custom rifles and fowlers at "affordable"prices.You can have any lock you choose but they come standard with siler locks and davis dbl set triggers.The "southern" rifle they sell is probably closest to your choosing but take a hard look at the virginia rifle especially if your going to get one in a larger caliber than 50 cal.

Ck out this link also for some good deals on custom flinters.

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Consignments.shtml

http://www.avsia.com/tvm/

BigG · February 11, 2002, 11:55 AM

The Blue Ridge, while nice looking, will whack your cheekbone a good one with that crooked stock. Recommend .54 if you get one.

Wildwilley · February 11, 2002, 02:55 PM

Before you go off and buy a TVM, Find a few fella's who own 'em and check them out. I don't slam any gunmakers. Each builder, commercial or custom has there own way of making a flintlock rifle. TVM does some things that I don't really like, but then again I shoot custom guns anyway. Check their wood thickness ratio where you need to. ( AT the wrist, ramrod channel, patchbox if any.) They make a nice flinter but is some spots it's a little weak.
I own a Blueridge .32 cal. This year I'll be placing a new lock in it.
The one it came with is terrible. I have an L&R that should drop in with a little work.
If your gonna shoot a large caliber in this gun, remember it's front heavey when you get into the .50-.54cal. range. It has a straight stock and will have a little more kick.
I've owned the Great Plains and the locks are interchangable with T/C. I bought an extra frizzen when I wore out the old one.
(That tells you how much I shot it.)
The only problem with the Great Plains is that everyone has one. This I don't see as much of a problem but most of us want somthing different.
If your willing to spent the money, you might want to check out the Pedersolli line. They offer a good line of guns and these can be ordered from a bunch of dealers.

ed mason · February 11, 2002, 08:10 PM

Wildwilley

I hear what your saying about TVM rifles.There are some fitting issues that need to be addressed but I cant think for the life of
me why you would recommend a Pedersoli over a tvm.?????The wood is absolutely worthless on my Brown bess and it has
Italy stamps all over the steel.Its almost embarrassing to take it to Fort Fredricksburg because without refinement(proper dated
lock,correct wood and thimble set up,proper butt plate, ect) it's reeks of being a imatation.Then there is the issue of the locks
provided with the Pedersoli.Many of the shooters at rendezvous have the locks re-heat treated to provide better sparks with
the Pedersoli.

I like custom flinters as much as the next person.I am still Interviewing gunmakers and trying to make a decision on which one I
will get to build a Jim Chambers virginia rifle(kit).I really hate to shell out $2000 bucks to have a $600 kit made, but it looks
like that is what its going to take to get the job done right.!!!I don't think that most general shooters will see the "flaws" that are
in the TVM rifles without a "expert"opinion but then again I don't think that those same people are going to shell out $2000
bucks for a flintlock Either.

I could be wrong though!!!

Wildwilley · February 16, 2002, 08:46 AM

The only thing I can say about your Bess would be what year is it?
Pedersoli made a bunch of improvments to their line in the last few years.
I do have to say your right about the wood on those old flinters though. I hade a Charlaville that was terrible. I think there was more glue than wood in it when I sold it.
The company made a whole bunch of new guns for the Patriot and you can pick them up for between $500-800, depending where you live.
I believe in 1998 they started making guns for competition in Europe. They have shooting matches like we have for cartrige guns only they use flintlocks and are strictly regulated. (In Germany they even have guys who load your gun for you if your not certified.)
I recomend guns you can get parts easily for, if your not buying a custom gun. The best way to purchase a flinter is to go to a place that has a good display. Then you can check every detail before you buy. When you purchase a kit, you can't check anything unless it's a drop in style kit.
The biggest thing to check is if the touch-hole is set above the flashpan. If it's to low it won't go off and in the rain, the water will run right into the barrel. If you get a kit with a pre-drilled barrel you run the risk of getting the same thing.
I know Jim Chambers, if you buy a kit or a gun from him it will be done right... But your gonna pay for it.
If you want a list of a few good builders, I can help you and if you can come down to Prickett's Fort the first weekend in April. Thats the School of the Longhunter. There will be a ton of gun builders and accoutrement makers there. You can pick up a lot of tips and talk to guys who use their flinters all the time. Jim Chambers might even be there.

ed mason · February 16, 2002, 02:43 PM

Your right about the Chambers Kit's being the best there is.My Tvm virginia rifle was built with a Chambers large round face
lock,38 inch swamped barrel and wood patch box..I was thinking about getting a A Chambers kit in the Virginia Style in 60 cal
with a 38 inch swamped barrel but he only offers it in 42 inch in that caliber.I would have to go with Colrain (sp) barrel if I want
the shorter barrel, something I really don't want to do.They make good barrels all right but they don't have the respect or resale
value that the getz barrels have.My other choice would be to build a Lancaster rifle in my configuration but since I fought in
both the revolutionary war as a virginia rifleman and the civil war with the south so I find it appalling and against my nature to have
a gun with YANKEE grace lines.BAWHAHABAWHAH

My brown bess is a 2000 model.It appears to have a birch stock or a real crude piece of maple.All of the stocks that I saw at
Ft Fredricksburg from Pedersoli look like crap!!!I know a guy that can take one and turn the barrel down to remove the
etching of the italian proof marks,redo the wood and thimbles and correct the butt stock and lock but by the time I shell out that
kind of dough, I might be able to search around and find a authentic one.I passed up a pretty good deal on one at Ft
Fredricksburg for $3000 that was not in too bad of shape.

50-110 · February 16, 2002, 04:13 PM

I've had several BP rifles over the last 15 yrs, and the best i've found is an Austin-Halleck 50cal flint lock Mountain Rifle,it has all the metal browned, 31"bbl with fixed sights front and rear. The action is silky smooth from the first time I fired it.The only thing I found that I don't like (but can live with) is the bottom of the bbl is stamped "Spain". I bought it from Dixie Gun Works at about 600.00. I've never regretted buying it in the 4 yrs I've had it

**4V50 Gary** · February 16, 2002, 04:44 PM

Ed - consider taking a gun building seminar or buying some tapes. You may want to build one yourself and save the ducats for another Chambers kit. I'm thinking of the Militia musket which can serve as a fowler.

There's a gun building seminar coming up in Oregon (May), the NMLRA in KY (June/July) and finally one in Conner Prarie, IN (Oct).

BTW, check out Narraganestt (sic) Arms in Indianapolis for their First Model Brown Bess. $1500 with correct parts (castings made from originals) assembled and ready to fire.

ed mason · February 16, 2002, 05:28 PM

4v gary.Thanks for the info on Narraganestt arms.I have one of their catalogs and have been pondering over the gun they call
the Culpepper county Longrifle.But then again they dot make it it a 60cal.The reason I want a 60 cal is because I want to have
a rifle that has interchangablity with my TVM fowler.

The only reason I bought a brown bess was because I wanted a flintlock to hunt with.Its does a good job with 90 gr and #4
shot.I got a nice 10 inch bearded Turkey this past spring with it.As i get further and further into this RE- enacting thing I will
think strongly about getting one of the Narragansett arm's Brown Bess.

February 7, 2002, 07:42 PM	#1
Kevan Member Join Date: February 7, 2002 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 89	flintlocks---Blue Ridge versus Great Plains Blue Ridge or Great Plains...Great Plains or Blue Ridge...I can't decide! I have a .54 percussion Great Plains rifle and just love it. Shootinest rifle I've ever seen. Now I want me a flintlock. Part of me wants the long rifle attributes of the Cabela's Blue Ridge. It sure looks good! And part of me says, "go with what you KNOW works---the Great Plains" except that we are talking flintlocks. My question is: which has the better lock and ignition? Hell, evenually I'll probably get both but I need help to decide which to buy first ---LOL! __________________ William C. Quantrill Fan Club

February 9, 2002, 06:05 PM	#5
Kevan Member Join Date: February 7, 2002 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 89	Salt, I joined the NMLRA a few months back. Good organization. At this time, I cannot afford a custom flinter, but am keeping an eye to the future. I'm real partial to TVM's Southern-style rifles. I really like the Southern poor-boy style. I hear tell that Dixie discontinued it's Tennessee Mountain rifle. Why?? I heard they couldn't keep them in stock because they sold so well. I guess it's like the restaraunts that always discontinue the meals everyone liked best. I like the Blue Ridge because of the way the stock looks. I'm leaning hard towards the Blue Ridge. __________________ William C. Quantrill Fan Club

February 11, 2002, 11:55 AM	#7
BigG Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 1999 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 4,334	The Blue Ridge, while nice looking, will whack your cheekbone a good one with that crooked stock. Recommend .54 if you get one. __________________ o "The Earth is degenerating today. Bribery and corruption abound. Children no longer obey their parents, every man wants to write a book, and it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching." Assyrian tablet, c. 2800 BC o "In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a scarce man brave, hated, and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain o "They have gun control in Cuba. They have universal health care in Cuba. So why do they want to come here?" Paul Harvey o TODAY WE CARVE OUT OUR OWN OMENS! Leonidas, Thermopylae, 480 BC

February 11, 2002, 02:55 PM	#8
Wildwilley Member Join Date: September 29, 2001 Location: Southwest Pennsylvania Posts: 51	TVM Before you go off and buy a TVM, Find a few fella's who own 'em and check them out. I don't slam any gunmakers. Each builder, commercial or custom has there own way of making a flintlock rifle. TVM does some things that I don't really like, but then again I shoot custom guns anyway. Check their wood thickness ratio where you need to. ( AT the wrist, ramrod channel, patchbox if any.) They make a nice flinter but is some spots it's a little weak. I own a Blueridge .32 cal. This year I'll be placing a new lock in it. The one it came with is terrible. I have an L&R that should drop in with a little work. If your gonna shoot a large caliber in this gun, remember it's front heavey when you get into the .50-.54cal. range. It has a straight stock and will have a little more kick. I've owned the Great Plains and the locks are interchangable with T/C. I bought an extra frizzen when I wore out the old one. (That tells you how much I shot it.) The only problem with the Great Plains is that everyone has one. This I don't see as much of a problem but most of us want somthing different. If your willing to spent the money, you might want to check out the Pedersolli line. They offer a good line of guns and these can be ordered from a bunch of dealers. __________________ Wild Willy

February 16, 2002, 08:46 AM	#10
Wildwilley Member Join Date: September 29, 2001 Location: Southwest Pennsylvania Posts: 51	What year? The only thing I can say about your Bess would be what year is it? Pedersoli made a bunch of improvments to their line in the last few years. I do have to say your right about the wood on those old flinters though. I hade a Charlaville that was terrible. I think there was more glue than wood in it when I sold it. The company made a whole bunch of new guns for the Patriot and you can pick them up for between $500-800, depending where you live. I believe in 1998 they started making guns for competition in Europe. They have shooting matches like we have for cartrige guns only they use flintlocks and are strictly regulated. (In Germany they even have guys who load your gun for you if your not certified.) I recomend guns you can get parts easily for, if your not buying a custom gun. The best way to purchase a flinter is to go to a place that has a good display. Then you can check every detail before you buy. When you purchase a kit, you can't check anything unless it's a drop in style kit. The biggest thing to check is if the touch-hole is set above the flashpan. If it's to low it won't go off and in the rain, the water will run right into the barrel. If you get a kit with a pre-drilled barrel you run the risk of getting the same thing. I know Jim Chambers, if you buy a kit or a gun from him it will be done right... But your gonna pay for it. If you want a list of a few good builders, I can help you and if you can come down to Prickett's Fort the first weekend in April. Thats the School of the Longhunter. There will be a ton of gun builders and accoutrement makers there. You can pick up a lot of tips and talk to guys who use their flinters all the time. Jim Chambers might even be there. __________________ Wild Willy

February 7, 2002, 08:50 PM	#2
BenW Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2001 Location: CA Posts: 282	I have the percussion Great Plains as well and love it. One of the best production guns out there I think. I'm also looking at flintlocks right now and am leaning towards the Jaeger rifle at Tennessee Valley Manufacturing http://www.avsia.com/tvm/ Kind of a wait, but they sure are purty, and being of German extraction, it would be neat to use a design one of my ancestors might have used.

February 8, 2002, 11:50 AM	#3
Cap n ball Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2000 Posts: 247	That Blue Ridge rifle is a real good looker. You fellas may want to go to that link provided in the 'Tuning flintlocks' thread that 'Salt' posted. Lots of real good info about lock types and touch-holes.

February 9, 2002, 12:33 PM	#4
Salt Junior member Join Date: December 26, 2001 Posts: 673	I recommend having a custom handmade rifle built for you when you move up to Flintlock. http://www.nmlra.org/ Locks? Siler locks are very good.

February 10, 2002, 05:20 PM	#6
ed mason Member Join Date: October 23, 2001 Posts: 67	Kevan, Before you go off and buy a production gun take a harder look at TVM.AS you know they build custom rifles and fowlers at "affordable"prices.You can have any lock you choose but they come standard with siler locks and davis dbl set triggers.The "southern" rifle they sell is probably closest to your choosing but take a hard look at the virginia rifle especially if your going to get one in a larger caliber than 50 cal. Ck out this link also for some good deals on custom flinters. http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Consignments.shtml http://www.avsia.com/tvm/

February 11, 2002, 08:10 PM	#9
ed mason Member Join Date: October 23, 2001 Posts: 67	Wildwilley I hear what your saying about TVM rifles.There are some fitting issues that need to be addressed but I cant think for the life of me why you would recommend a Pedersoli over a tvm.?????The wood is absolutely worthless on my Brown bess and it has Italy stamps all over the steel.Its almost embarrassing to take it to Fort Fredricksburg because without refinement(proper dated lock,correct wood and thimble set up,proper butt plate, ect) it's reeks of being a imatation.Then there is the issue of the locks provided with the Pedersoli.Many of the shooters at rendezvous have the locks re-heat treated to provide better sparks with the Pedersoli. I like custom flinters as much as the next person.I am still Interviewing gunmakers and trying to make a decision on which one I will get to build a Jim Chambers virginia rifle(kit).I really hate to shell out $2000 bucks to have a $600 kit made, but it looks like that is what its going to take to get the job done right.!!!I don't think that most general shooters will see the "flaws" that are in the TVM rifles without a "expert"opinion but then again I don't think that those same people are going to shell out $2000 bucks for a flintlock Either. I could be wrong though!!!

February 16, 2002, 02:43 PM	#11
ed mason Member Join Date: October 23, 2001 Posts: 67	Your right about the Chambers Kit's being the best there is.My Tvm virginia rifle was built with a Chambers large round face lock,38 inch swamped barrel and wood patch box..I was thinking about getting a A Chambers kit in the Virginia Style in 60 cal with a 38 inch swamped barrel but he only offers it in 42 inch in that caliber.I would have to go with Colrain (sp) barrel if I want the shorter barrel, something I really don't want to do.They make good barrels all right but they don't have the respect or resale value that the getz barrels have.My other choice would be to build a Lancaster rifle in my configuration but since I fought in both the revolutionary war as a virginia rifleman and the civil war with the south so I find it appalling and against my nature to have a gun with YANKEE grace lines.BAWHAHABAWHAH My brown bess is a 2000 model.It appears to have a birch stock or a real crude piece of maple.All of the stocks that I saw at Ft Fredricksburg from Pedersoli look like crap!!!I know a guy that can take one and turn the barrel down to remove the etching of the italian proof marks,redo the wood and thimbles and correct the butt stock and lock but by the time I shell out that kind of dough, I might be able to search around and find a authentic one.I passed up a pretty good deal on one at Ft Fredricksburg for $3000 that was not in too bad of shape.

February 16, 2002, 04:13 PM	#12
50-110 Junior Member Join Date: February 16, 2002 Location: Western Kentucky Posts: 3	Flint locks I've had several BP rifles over the last 15 yrs, and the best i've found is an Austin-Halleck 50cal flint lock Mountain Rifle,it has all the metal browned, 31"bbl with fixed sights front and rear. The action is silky smooth from the first time I fired it.The only thing I found that I don't like (but can live with) is the bottom of the bbl is stamped "Spain". I bought it from Dixie Gun Works at about 600.00. I've never regretted buying it in the 4 yrs I've had it __________________ Jack NRA life member NMLRA member

February 16, 2002, 04:44 PM	#13
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,841	Ed - consider taking a gun building seminar or buying some tapes. You may want to build one yourself and save the ducats for another Chambers kit. I'm thinking of the Militia musket which can serve as a fowler. There's a gun building seminar coming up in Oregon (May), the NMLRA in KY (June/July) and finally one in Conner Prarie, IN (Oct). BTW, check out Narraganestt (sic) Arms in Indianapolis for their First Model Brown Bess. $1500 with correct parts (castings made from originals) assembled and ready to fire. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

February 16, 2002, 05:28 PM	#14
ed mason Member Join Date: October 23, 2001 Posts: 67	4v gary.Thanks for the info on Narraganestt arms.I have one of their catalogs and have been pondering over the gun they call the Culpepper county Longrifle.But then again they dot make it it a 60cal.The reason I want a 60 cal is because I want to have a rifle that has interchangablity with my TVM fowler. The only reason I bought a brown bess was because I wanted a flintlock to hunt with.Its does a good job with 90 gr and #4 shot.I got a nice 10 inch bearded Turkey this past spring with it.As i get further and further into this RE- enacting thing I will think strongly about getting one of the Narragansett arm's Brown Bess.