Berdan primed mil brass

enstorm · December 25, 2007, 06:00 PM

Is brass like Lake City 30'06 boxer primed, not berdan, but crimped? Do I need any specialty tool to prep mil brass in 223 308 and 30'06 other than the pocket swager to remove the crimp? Can cases designed for berdan primers be worked to accept boxer primers, and how? Thanks

keebo52 · December 25, 2007, 06:43 PM

Lake city brass is boxer primed but a lot of foreign milsurp brass is berdan primed. Look inside the case mouth and if you see 2 flash holes it's berdan primed and a single flash hole is boxer primed. Berdan primed brass cannot be converted to use boxer primers because the dimensions are different and the berdan brass has the anvil made in the brass. Boxer primers have the anvil in the primer. Once the crimp is removed from the primer pocket, load as usual. Remember, milsurp brass is usually thicker and heavier than commercial brass which can cause increased pressure. Use caution when working up loads for milsurp brass. Start with a lighter powder charge than commercial brass.

enstorm · December 25, 2007, 07:34 PM

Thanks

rwilson452 · December 25, 2007, 10:37 PM

Another thing to note. If your loading for an M1 or M1A, you do not want to load hot loads unless you like buying new op rods. Stick with a moderate powder such as 4895 and go for a muzzle velocity of around 2800 fps. I'm not saying just 4895 but something with around that burn rate. i wouldn't go much over a 165 gr bullet either. Military ball is a 147gr FMJBT as I recall. If your pressure gets to high you can bend the op rod. You can get special made gas ports to regulate that but that is not the way for a beginner to go.

amamnn · December 26, 2007, 12:19 AM

Just a couple of additional things I've noticed in addition to the good advice above.

Although I don't use ex-military brass for anything but plinking, I have had the chance to examine quite a few LC cases. After measuring the actual capacity of several dozen cases I have come to these conclusions:

Not all military brass is thicker than all commercial brass. I have several dozen Lake City cases that have more capacity than most PMC brass I have on hand and also a lot of Winchester brass I have. Mostly these are .223/5.56brass, but also some several .30-06 cases as well. I had read some years ago that Lake city made match brass that conformed more to commercial designs than conventional military specs. These cases (about 3500 of various calibers) were all given to me by a friend who was retiring from handloading due to spousal decree. He told me they were all from ex-military issue rounds. I have since seen postings and talked to people at the range who have had the same experience.

I have heard since the 60's that military brass was thicker and that the powder capacity was smaller. I have seen it noted in manuals that charges should be reduced for military brass. None of the brass I have tested for actual capacity was older than 1997.

There are tools you can buy to remove and reload berdan primers. I can't see how they would be worth buying myself, but I know someone who has them. I have several hundred berdan primed 5.56 NATO rounds that I was given by another person driven from shooting at all by spousal abuse. I run them through one of my ARs and save up the empties until I get 10 pounds or more and take them to the recycling yard. BTW, the primers are brass too. Some may be nickle coated. It's ironic that we use a European designed boxer primer here in the states and the Europeans use the American berdan.

December 25, 2007, 06:00 PM	#1
enstorm Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2005 Posts: 217	Berdan primed mil brass Is brass like Lake City 30'06 boxer primed, not berdan, but crimped? Do I need any specialty tool to prep mil brass in 223 308 and 30'06 other than the pocket swager to remove the crimp? Can cases designed for berdan primers be worked to accept boxer primers, and how? Thanks

December 26, 2007, 12:19 AM	#5
amamnn Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2006 Location: WA, the left armpit of the USA Posts: 1,323	Just a couple of additional things I've noticed in addition to the good advice above. Although I don't use ex-military brass for anything but plinking, I have had the chance to examine quite a few LC cases. After measuring the actual capacity of several dozen cases I have come to these conclusions: Not all military brass is thicker than all commercial brass. I have several dozen Lake City cases that have more capacity than most PMC brass I have on hand and also a lot of Winchester brass I have. Mostly these are .223/5.56brass, but also some several .30-06 cases as well. I had read some years ago that Lake city made match brass that conformed more to commercial designs than conventional military specs. These cases (about 3500 of various calibers) were all given to me by a friend who was retiring from handloading due to spousal decree. He told me they were all from ex-military issue rounds. I have since seen postings and talked to people at the range who have had the same experience. I have heard since the 60's that military brass was thicker and that the powder capacity was smaller. I have seen it noted in manuals that charges should be reduced for military brass. None of the brass I have tested for actual capacity was older than 1997. There are tools you can buy to remove and reload berdan primers. I can't see how they would be worth buying myself, but I know someone who has them. I have several hundred berdan primed 5.56 NATO rounds that I was given by another person driven from shooting at all by spousal abuse. I run them through one of my ARs and save up the empties until I get 10 pounds or more and take them to the recycling yard. BTW, the primers are brass too. Some may be nickle coated. It's ironic that we use a European designed boxer primer here in the states and the Europeans use the American berdan. __________________ "If the enemy is in range, so are you." - Infantry Journal

December 25, 2007, 06:43 PM	#2
keebo52 Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2005 Posts: 244	Lake city brass is boxer primed but a lot of foreign milsurp brass is berdan primed. Look inside the case mouth and if you see 2 flash holes it's berdan primed and a single flash hole is boxer primed. Berdan primed brass cannot be converted to use boxer primers because the dimensions are different and the berdan brass has the anvil made in the brass. Boxer primers have the anvil in the primer. Once the crimp is removed from the primer pocket, load as usual. Remember, milsurp brass is usually thicker and heavier than commercial brass which can cause increased pressure. Use caution when working up loads for milsurp brass. Start with a lighter powder charge than commercial brass.

December 25, 2007, 07:34 PM	#3
enstorm Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2005 Posts: 217	Thanks

December 25, 2007, 10:37 PM	#4
rwilson452 Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2004 Location: Tioga co. PA Posts: 2,647	Another thing to note. If your loading for an M1 or M1A, you do not want to load hot loads unless you like buying new op rods. Stick with a moderate powder such as 4895 and go for a muzzle velocity of around 2800 fps. I'm not saying just 4895 but something with around that burn rate. i wouldn't go much over a 165 gr bullet either. Military ball is a 147gr FMJBT as I recall. If your pressure gets to high you can bend the op rod. You can get special made gas ports to regulate that but that is not the way for a beginner to go.