Silencer Question

jcle225 · July 28, 2009, 03:13 PM

I'm looking to get a silencer for one of my firearms but wanted to know if there was any paperwork, permits or checks I had to complete before doing so.

I believe a silencer is not one of those items I can just casually buy at the gun show so how do I go about getting one?

Shadi Khalil · July 28, 2009, 03:18 PM

This took all of 5 seconds...

From yahoo answers, the guy seems to know what he's talking about.

Quote:

Fortunately for you VA is one of the 36 states that allow unlicensed civilians to own silencers. But they do prohibit them if they are not registered with the feds. http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.… . I was not able to find any VA laws requiring additional VA registration requirements or permits, but you can do more research here; http://leg1.state.va.us/000/src.htm . There are only two forms to fill out plus fingerprints. A good silencer greatly reduces noise and they are a real blast to use. WA is the only one of the 36 states that allow ownership but bans use.

Federal law has additional requirements however. While ATF authorization is required, it is routine and never denied as long as the paperwork is fill out correctly. There is also a $200 tax paid for each silencer made or transferred by unlicensed civilians.

Two good forums for info are http://www.subguns.com and http://www.silencertalk.com . To purchase a silencer, just go to an FFL/SOT, one of the ones listed here, http://www.subguns.com/c2c3/c3state.htm#… or another in your state. Pick out and pay for the silencer, then the dealer will give you two ATF form 4’s that you bring to your local sheriff for a signature. If the sheriff will not sign then you can form a trust to own the silencer for you. You also need to fill out form 5330.20 attesting to your US citizenship. The dealer will ensure the forms are filled out correctly and send them to the ATF along with your fingerprints (2 cards), mug shots and your check for $200. It takes about 2 months for approval now. Good luck.

LarryFlew · July 28, 2009, 03:40 PM

Also keep in mind because of the nature of how an auto works they hardly do anything (not at all like on tv:-). Also do little with a revolver because of the blow by between cylinder and barrel so that leaves bolt actions where they do a very good job.

chris in va · July 28, 2009, 05:13 PM

Lucky you're in VA. $200 tax stamp, then the cost of the supressor if it's for the P22. More hardware needed if it's for your other two firearms (threading barrel, adaptor etc).

Consider this however. A supressor does indeed cut down on the crack of the report by ~30db and can generally be used without needing earmuffs. But understand you'll still need to shoot the gun at a range, so is it really worth ~$600 to still need muffs as everyone else will be shooting their unsupressed gun?

You may be one of the lucky few that has some serious acreage on your property and can plink away at a hillside, but I wasn't and decided it was not worth the expense and hassle.

Superhouse 15 · July 28, 2009, 05:40 PM

P22s are great pistols to suppress. The adapters for the barrel nut are easy to find and cheap. To keep it quieter, you can put your thumbs against the front and rear serrations on the slide and hold it closed, removing the sound of the action cycling.
http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trk...All-Categories

You might register and look here.
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/index.php

If you can buy a handgun, you can buy (or make) a suppressor. You can own it as an individual and go through a small bit of hassle, or you can own it through a corporation or a trust with some advantages and a lot less hassle. Some folks pay lawyers a couple hundred bucks to establish a trust, some use Quicken software to do it for $40 or $50 or so, some employers offer them as a free service. My tax lady did mine along with my taxes and some will stuff. Most corporations or LLCs require some kind of annual fee and if you should ever dissolve the corporation you must pay the $200 tax to re-transfer the suppressor (or other NFA item). Trusts are usually free forever.

BTW: NFA FAQ
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/nfa/

RAnb · July 28, 2009, 11:03 PM

Quote:

This took all of 5 seconds...

From yahoo answers, the guy seems to know what he's talking about.

I think the Yahoo Answers quote is from one of my answers on that website. While I try to be as accurate and informative as I can, I think using the Yahoo Answers website for info on firearms is not a good idea.

The best forums for questions on title 2 weapons are http://www.silencertalk.com and http://www.subguns.com . The subguns website has an excellent FAQ here; http://www.subguns.com/laws/laws.htm The ATF website is the best resource, but is not all that user friendly.

In my opinion the info offered so far is good but I have a few comments. Silencers work very well on semi-auto pistols as long as they are recoil operated. While significant noise still comes from the action, a good silencer will make it safe to shoot without ear plugs. I have not shot my Makarov with my 9mm can yet, but I suspect the blow back action will allow too much noise to shoot suppressed without hearing protection. Blow back operated 22lr pistols are suppressed well with small silencers.

Silencers also work very well on gas operated rifles like the AR-15. While they are louder than any bolt gun of equal ballistics and barrel length, the change in noise level is very dramatic. You have to be present while shooting to compare suppressed and unsuppressed fire. Camcorders and TV/PC speakers do a very poor job of recording and playing back the difference in noise levels. I have been told that the M-1a and AK's which vent gases from the action differently than the direct impingement AR's are louder. I will find out after the ATF approves the form 1 for my AK can.

The 1895 Nagant revolver seals the gap by moving the cylinder forward when cocking allowing the brass (longer than the cylinder) to enter the back of the barrel. Single shot firearms are also very well suited to suppressor use as not only do they have no action noise, they are several inches shorter than most center fire bolt action rifles and are less cumbersome when fitted with a silencer that extends OAL by 6-8 inches.

In my opinion silencers are very well worth the hassle and cost. I make my own on a metal lathe for $20-$50 in material plus the $200 tax. Even though I can not use them in WA, I take some with whenever I travel to a gun friendly state and enjoy them very much.

Ranb

johnwilliamson062 · July 29, 2009, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Also keep in mind because of the nature of how an auto works they hardly do anything (not at all like on tv:-).

Absurd. RAnb already pointed that out though.
Also, Nagant revolvers, available for $80 may be silenced effectively. I think there are no other production revolvers that can be effectively silenced.

Bartholomew Roberts · July 29, 2009, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Most corporations or LLCs require some kind of annual fee and if you should ever dissolve the corporation you must pay the $200 tax to re-transfer the suppressor (or other NFA item). Trusts are usually free forever.

Just to clarify, if you dissolve a trust or transfer it to a new trust, it requires paying the $200 tax stamp fee. The main advantage of a trust is that it may require less paperwork filed annually and are less public than the corporation route. However, you must be careful about creating invalid trusts using Quicken or other form trusts.

jmorris · July 29, 2009, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Just to clarify, if you dissolve a trust or transfer it to a new trust, it requires paying the $200 tax stamp fee.

This is a good point and the reason why your trust constructed for the purpose of acquiring NFA items should only be for NFA items.

jcle225 · July 29, 2009, 09:27 AM

Great advice from everyone thank you!

I've decided to make an appt @ Battlefield Sports LLC in Virginia. They told me they handle all the paperwork for the customers so everything is done "in store."

I'm looking at (aside from the 200 tax) 275.00-525.00 for the silencer. If I'm going to spend that much money I think I'm going to buy one for my USP .40.

Thanks again

aroundlsu · July 29, 2009, 12:27 PM

Don't forget you'll need a threaded barrel for that USP .40. You might be better off selling the USP .40 and getting either a USP-SD 9mm or USP .45 Tactical which would be ready to go for your silencer. Also a 9mm or .45 silencer would be a more versatile tool you can use on more weapons with arguably better suppression ability.

Don't worry about what gun you are going to use it on. You have 6 - 12 months to save your money for a pistol once you order the silencer. Good luck!

jcle225 · July 29, 2009, 12:45 PM

around lsu: I'm a little confused at the last statement. So after the silencer is ordered, I will not be able to purchase another firearm during that period?

I called the dealer that will be selling the suppressor. He said that its not good to suppress a HK USPc .40 because its a hypersonic round and that I will not be satisfied with the suppression.

Does anyone have any experience with a suppressed .40?

Housezealot · July 29, 2009, 01:28 PM

I think he meant you were going to have to wait six- twelve months to get your silencer.

RAnb · July 29, 2009, 05:39 PM

I should have added that what is normally seen on TV about firearms (especially title 2 weapons like silencers) is not like reality at all. But the rest of his post was absurd.

Ranb

Mike703 · July 29, 2009, 07:13 PM

I've bought several things from John. I'm very satisfied with his service.

aroundlsu · July 31, 2009, 02:19 PM

Yes I meant you won't have the silencer in your hands for probably six months or longer. IF the dealer IN YOUR STATE has the silencer sitting on his shelf then you MIGHT get it in your hands in 3 months. But that's a big if.

My first transfer took 6 months. The second took 12 months.

So basically you have plenty of time after figuring out which silencer/caliber you want to save money and find a host firearm.

You are right, the .40 would not be the most ideal caliber. I would get something more common that you could use on more guns.

July 28, 2009, 03:13 PM	#1
jcle225 Junior Member Join Date: July 27, 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 12	Silencer Question I'm looking to get a silencer for one of my firearms but wanted to know if there was any paperwork, permits or checks I had to complete before doing so. I believe a silencer is not one of those items I can just casually buy at the gun show so how do I go about getting one? __________________ Glock 26 - HK USPc .40 - Walther P22

July 28, 2009, 05:13 PM	#4
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Lucky you're in VA. $200 tax stamp, then the cost of the supressor if it's for the P22. More hardware needed if it's for your other two firearms (threading barrel, adaptor etc). Consider this however. A supressor does indeed cut down on the crack of the report by ~30db and can generally be used without needing earmuffs. But understand you'll still need to shoot the gun at a range, so is it really worth ~$600 to still need muffs as everyone else will be shooting their unsupressed gun? You may be one of the lucky few that has some serious acreage on your property and can plink away at a hillside, but I wasn't and decided it was not worth the expense and hassle. Last edited by chris in va; July 28, 2009 at 05:19 PM.

July 29, 2009, 09:27 AM	#10
jcle225 Junior Member Join Date: July 27, 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 12	Great advice from everyone thank you! I've decided to make an appt @ Battlefield Sports LLC in Virginia. They told me they handle all the paperwork for the customers so everything is done "in store." I'm looking at (aside from the 200 tax) 275.00-525.00 for the silencer. If I'm going to spend that much money I think I'm going to buy one for my USP .40. Thanks again __________________ Glock 26 - HK USPc .40 - Walther P22

July 29, 2009, 12:45 PM	#12
jcle225 Junior Member Join Date: July 27, 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 12	around lsu: I'm a little confused at the last statement. So after the silencer is ordered, I will not be able to purchase another firearm during that period? I called the dealer that will be selling the suppressor. He said that its not good to suppress a HK USPc .40 because its a hypersonic round and that I will not be satisfied with the suppression. Does anyone have any experience with a suppressed .40? __________________ Glock 26 - HK USPc .40 - Walther P22

July 29, 2009, 01:28 PM	#13
Housezealot Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 606	I think he meant you were going to have to wait six- twelve months to get your silencer. __________________ We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.

July 28, 2009, 03:40 PM	#3
LarryFlew Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2009 Location: Minnesota CZ fan Posts: 902	Also keep in mind because of the nature of how an auto works they hardly do anything (not at all like on tv:-). Also do little with a revolver because of the blow by between cylinder and barrel so that leaves bolt actions where they do a very good job.

July 28, 2009, 05:40 PM	#5
Superhouse 15 Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2007 Location: Sunny Florida Posts: 844	P22s are great pistols to suppress. The adapters for the barrel nut are easy to find and cheap. To keep it quieter, you can put your thumbs against the front and rear serrations on the slide and hold it closed, removing the sound of the action cycling. http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trk...All-Categories You might register and look here. http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/index.php If you can buy a handgun, you can buy (or make) a suppressor. You can own it as an individual and go through a small bit of hassle, or you can own it through a corporation or a trust with some advantages and a lot less hassle. Some folks pay lawyers a couple hundred bucks to establish a trust, some use Quicken software to do it for $40 or $50 or so, some employers offer them as a free service. My tax lady did mine along with my taxes and some will stuff. Most corporations or LLCs require some kind of annual fee and if you should ever dissolve the corporation you must pay the $200 tax to re-transfer the suppressor (or other NFA item). Trusts are usually free forever. BTW: NFA FAQ http://www.atf.gov/firearms/nfa/

July 29, 2009, 12:27 PM	#11
aroundlsu Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2007 Location: Louisiana Posts: 156	Don't forget you'll need a threaded barrel for that USP .40. You might be better off selling the USP .40 and getting either a USP-SD 9mm or USP .45 Tactical which would be ready to go for your silencer. Also a 9mm or .45 silencer would be a more versatile tool you can use on more weapons with arguably better suppression ability. Don't worry about what gun you are going to use it on. You have 6 - 12 months to save your money for a pistol once you order the silencer. Good luck!

July 29, 2009, 05:39 PM	#14
RAnb Junior member Join Date: July 20, 2008 Location: WA, USA Posts: 447	I should have added that what is normally seen on TV about firearms (especially title 2 weapons like silencers) is not like reality at all. But the rest of his post was absurd. Ranb Last edited by RAnb; July 30, 2009 at 07:14 PM.

July 29, 2009, 07:13 PM	#15
Mike703 Junior Member Join Date: December 21, 2006 Posts: 14	Battlefield Sports is a good choice I've bought several things from John. I'm very satisfied with his service.

July 31, 2009, 02:19 PM	#16
aroundlsu Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2007 Location: Louisiana Posts: 156	Yes I meant you won't have the silencer in your hands for probably six months or longer. IF the dealer IN YOUR STATE has the silencer sitting on his shelf then you MIGHT get it in your hands in 3 months. But that's a big if. My first transfer took 6 months. The second took 12 months. So basically you have plenty of time after figuring out which silencer/caliber you want to save money and find a host firearm. You are right, the .40 would not be the most ideal caliber. I would get something more common that you could use on more guns.

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