Handgun Enthusiast new to SHotgunning

GuyS · February 27, 2009, 07:52 PM

I am taking a basic shotgun training class thorugh the NRA and am about to purchase my first shotgun. i am looking for soemthing I can use for home defense, trap and skeet understanding of course there has to be compronises since each area has a specific type of shotugn. I was lookng at the Mossberg 500 combo set with field barrel and slug barrel and the Remington 870 police tactical which I udnerstand canb be modified for sporting.

I really don't want to spend a lot of money since I am just getting into shotgunning.

Is there a multi purpose shot gun that can meet my needs?

Any advice?

oneounceload · February 27, 2009, 07:56 PM

HD/SD and clay games - skeet, trap, 5-stand and sporting, are really different situations and really do not, IMO, work with one gun. .....while doable, you will not get your best scores on clay games when using a HD gun and vice versa

you will need to make a compromise....which area are you willing to make that compromise?

GuyS · February 28, 2009, 01:03 AM

I'd probably rank HD top priority and then the sporting games

zippy13 · February 28, 2009, 02:07 AM

Greetings, GuyS and welcome aboard,

Oneounceload is right about the compromises. Many times the comparison is made: selecting a home defense (HD) gun that's also good for trap and skeet is like wanting a reliable inexpensive car that will race on the road course and the drag strip.
A Mossberg 500 or Remington 870 combo gun is okay in some hunting situations and you can shoot a little clays. But, when you see what the serious shooters are using and their scores, your pump gun is going to have you feeling like you're playing golf with a croquette mallet.
As you get into shot-gunning, you'll realize that competition shooters use different guns for the various sports, and even different guns within a specific sport. An International Skeet shooter uses a different gun than a NSSA Skeet shooter. An NSSA shooter may use several different guns to shoot the events within a program. The same applies to ATA trap, there are different guns that are specialized for singles, handicap and doubles.
If you want to try your hand at targets with your pump combo, 16-yard trap is your best bet for starters. You can shoot a lot of club trap with a standard pump gun. With the sports that require crossing shots and/or doubles, you'll eventually feel handicapped by your pump. If this doesn't appeal to you, perhaps you should consider starting with a used over/under shotgun.

Dave McC · February 28, 2009, 01:51 PM

Welcome, Guy.

The two shotguns you mentioned are good, versatile tools suited to protection, sport and food gathering.

I prefer the 870, but the Mossberg is a darn good shotgun also, Basic models of either with two barrels. one long and with choke tubes, one short and perhaps with open sights, will do yeoman service for decades.

Get the one that feels best. "Tactical" is just a buzzword. A short barreled, well known pumpgun is an amazing close range weapon.

Dedicated clay fans often use more specialized shotguns for competition.

But, lots of fun is to be had on a trap skeet or sporting clays course with a well known pumpgun at hand.

And when things go bump in the night, a pumpgun you've used to take a fast pair of gnarly crossers time after time will probably work just as well on larger, slower targets.

Mine the archives. They have tons of info.

HTH....

GuyS · March 1, 2009, 12:04 AM

Thanks for the help. Well I got a good deal on both an 870 and Moss 500 so I bought them both!
I bought the new Rem 870 Express Tactical for home defense and maybe trap shooting (if I get a longer barrel of course) and the mossberg 500 field/deer combo set with a 28 inch barrel and 24 inch rifled barrel. I will try this for trap first. It was only 309.00. The 870 was a little bit more expensive at 425 but I think I got a good deal since the 870 express is so hard to find in Virginia.

kmrcstintn · March 1, 2009, 11:48 PM

a cost effective option:

I would buy (yes, I already have it) the Mossberg 500 combo; 'mothball' the slug barrel til yer ready to hunt deer/bear; go on a 'treasure hunt' and snag a used Mossberg 500 field barrel from a local shop...then you have it cut to @ 18.5" and have a new bead put on it (impromptu defense barrel w/ cylinder bore--no choke constriction)...now ya got yerself a shotgun that offers everything that you desire--and yes this how I am achieving my goal (the shop I found a used barrel at is doing exactly this for $50 - $60 bucks)

hogdogs · March 2, 2009, 12:31 AM

Good gawd man... That right there is jumping in with both feet... Literally! When you decide them remmy guns are over rated I bet it will net 100% return on investment!

Feel free to post even the most insignificant question on either or both! Read posts from the last 12 months and you will see who has the info to "feed the need"! BigJimP, ScattergunBob, DaveMcC and a few others stand head and shoulders above the rest for tonnage down range and wrenching on the guns... I am but a simple redneck. I have shot plenty down range but I admit I forgot how to tear down my 500 as it spent 11 years in police evidence room. I have since re-learned that and fired a thousand or 2 rounds in the 4 years since I got 'er back! Welcome to the fold and hope yu follow the sage advice of Dave McC... BA/UU/R (buy ammo, use up, repeat) on both and settle on the best for you!
Brent

GuyS · March 2, 2009, 12:36 PM

Thanks Hogdogs...I'm sure I will have plenty of questions. This is a great forum with lots of good info.
Just wondering...has anyone used a pump for skeet? I understand it's not bad for trap of course but skeet may be difficlut due to having to shoot doubles at several of the stations.
Thanks

91slicktop · March 2, 2009, 01:09 PM

Just remember. It's not a "Shotty"...It's a Shotgun

hogdogs · March 2, 2009, 01:16 PM

Or in the words of a famous "nearly" cajun guy Justin Wilson called it...
"A pump 'em up carry-o-bean shoot gun..."

BigJimP · March 2, 2009, 01:20 PM

I'll shoot a Browning BPS ( 28" barrel ) pump gun 12 or 20ga - for Skeet once in a while - for fun / not competition.

The trick on using a pump gun for a game where you have 2 targets in the air at the same time - is having long enough arms that you can cycle the pump action, without bringing the gun down from your shoulder - so call for birds, feel the lead - bang, keep a smooth follow thru - cycle the pump gun - move your eyes to find the 2nd target(without moving the gun) - then move the gun to feel the lead and kill the 2nd target ....

I'm not saying I'm as fast with a pump gun as using an Over Under - but its pretty fast - and at least as fast as most semi-autos.

Its the same way in the field - a covey of Quail flushes - focus on one bird, kill it - cycle the gun (on your shoulder) - find a 2nd bird and kill it ...

If you drop the gun from your shoulder to cycle it - you've lost a good 2 seconds probably - and your odds of success go way down / but if you can't cycle it from your shoulder, then do what you have to do. But with new shooters at my club - especially if they are getting used to their gun - we will just tell the puller to pull single targets on the skeet field all the way around. As they build up a little confidence / then let them call for a pair ( on appropriate stations ) when they feel like they're ready for them. Not a big deal / it really doesn't slow the squad down at all.

Make sure gun is empty / get a couple of snap caps - and practice moving and shooting at home. Pick a room ( where neighbors won't see you swinging a gun in house ...). Load 2 snap caps ( one in barrel, one in mag ) like you would on a skeet field. Mount and hold the gun on the crease where the walls meet the ceiling - in center of room - follow the crease ( to stay level ) and rotate with lower body - as you pass corner on right, click trigger - follow thru (stay on the crease ) - and cycle the pump gun. Shift eyes back toward corner on right - and start your swing to the left ( stay on the crease ) - and click trigger as you pass the corner again - follow thru to center of room. It'll allow you some practice cycling the action of the gun and keeping it on your shoulder - and help on the idea of rotating with lower body ( keeping shoulders level, 70% of weight over your lead foot, head always on the comb of the gun). Practice for 15 or 20 min / if your shoulders are dropping off - causing you to roll like a rainbow, keep doing it until you break the habit / keep your head on the comb ( don't lift your head ).

It isn't exactly like shooting sustained lead in Skeet - but it'll get you cycling your gun on your shoulder, give you feel for proper rotation of your lower body, and the feel of keeping your face on the comb. Your face should never leave a comb ... etc ...

Lots of good books out there on shooting clay target games, DVD's, etc ..

Have some fun / welcome to the forum.

February 27, 2009, 07:52 PM	#1
GuyS Junior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Posts: 11	Handgun Enthusiast new to SHotgunning I am taking a basic shotgun training class thorugh the NRA and am about to purchase my first shotgun. i am looking for soemthing I can use for home defense, trap and skeet understanding of course there has to be compronises since each area has a specific type of shotugn. I was lookng at the Mossberg 500 combo set with field barrel and slug barrel and the Remington 870 police tactical which I udnerstand canb be modified for sporting. I really don't want to spend a lot of money since I am just getting into shotgunning. Is there a multi purpose shot gun that can meet my needs? Any advice?

March 1, 2009, 12:04 AM	#6
GuyS Junior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Posts: 11	Thanks All Thanks for the help. Well I got a good deal on both an 870 and Moss 500 so I bought them both! I bought the new Rem 870 Express Tactical for home defense and maybe trap shooting (if I get a longer barrel of course) and the mossberg 500 field/deer combo set with a 28 inch barrel and 24 inch rifled barrel. I will try this for trap first. It was only 309.00. The 870 was a little bit more expensive at 425 but I think I got a good deal since the 870 express is so hard to find in Virginia.

March 2, 2009, 01:09 PM	#10
91slicktop Member Join Date: February 26, 2009 Posts: 43	Just remember. It's not a "Shotty"...It's a Shotgun __________________ Owner of: -S&W M&P15 (Sold) - GSG-5 carbine -Mossberg 500 Tactical - XDM .40 -Remington 700 .308 (Sold)

February 27, 2009, 07:56 PM	#2
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	HD/SD and clay games - skeet, trap, 5-stand and sporting, are really different situations and really do not, IMO, work with one gun. .....while doable, you will not get your best scores on clay games when using a HD gun and vice versa you will need to make a compromise....which area are you willing to make that compromise?

February 28, 2009, 01:03 AM	#3
GuyS Junior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Posts: 11	I'd probably rank HD top priority and then the sporting games

February 28, 2009, 02:07 AM	#4
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Greetings, GuyS and welcome aboard, Oneounceload is right about the compromises. Many times the comparison is made: selecting a home defense (HD) gun that's also good for trap and skeet is like wanting a reliable inexpensive car that will race on the road course and the drag strip. A Mossberg 500 or Remington 870 combo gun is okay in some hunting situations and you can shoot a little clays. But, when you see what the serious shooters are using and their scores, your pump gun is going to have you feeling like you're playing golf with a croquette mallet. As you get into shot-gunning, you'll realize that competition shooters use different guns for the various sports, and even different guns within a specific sport. An International Skeet shooter uses a different gun than a NSSA Skeet shooter. An NSSA shooter may use several different guns to shoot the events within a program. The same applies to ATA trap, there are different guns that are specialized for singles, handicap and doubles. If you want to try your hand at targets with your pump combo, 16-yard trap is your best bet for starters. You can shoot a lot of club trap with a standard pump gun. With the sports that require crossing shots and/or doubles, you'll eventually feel handicapped by your pump. If this doesn't appeal to you, perhaps you should consider starting with a used over/under shotgun.

February 28, 2009, 01:51 PM	#5
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Welcome, Guy. The two shotguns you mentioned are good, versatile tools suited to protection, sport and food gathering. I prefer the 870, but the Mossberg is a darn good shotgun also, Basic models of either with two barrels. one long and with choke tubes, one short and perhaps with open sights, will do yeoman service for decades. Get the one that feels best. "Tactical" is just a buzzword. A short barreled, well known pumpgun is an amazing close range weapon. Dedicated clay fans often use more specialized shotguns for competition. But, lots of fun is to be had on a trap skeet or sporting clays course with a well known pumpgun at hand. And when things go bump in the night, a pumpgun you've used to take a fast pair of gnarly crossers time after time will probably work just as well on larger, slower targets. Mine the archives. They have tons of info. HTH....

March 1, 2009, 11:48 PM	#7
kmrcstintn Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Posts: 151	a cost effective option: I would buy (yes, I already have it) the Mossberg 500 combo; 'mothball' the slug barrel til yer ready to hunt deer/bear; go on a 'treasure hunt' and snag a used Mossberg 500 field barrel from a local shop...then you have it cut to @ 18.5" and have a new bead put on it (impromptu defense barrel w/ cylinder bore--no choke constriction)...now ya got yerself a shotgun that offers everything that you desire--and yes this how I am achieving my goal (the shop I found a used barrel at is doing exactly this for $50 - $60 bucks)

March 2, 2009, 12:31 AM	#8
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	Good gawd man... That right there is jumping in with both feet... Literally! When you decide them remmy guns are over rated I bet it will net 100% return on investment! Feel free to post even the most insignificant question on either or both! Read posts from the last 12 months and you will see who has the info to "feed the need"! BigJimP, ScattergunBob, DaveMcC and a few others stand head and shoulders above the rest for tonnage down range and wrenching on the guns... I am but a simple redneck. I have shot plenty down range but I admit I forgot how to tear down my 500 as it spent 11 years in police evidence room. I have since re-learned that and fired a thousand or 2 rounds in the 4 years since I got 'er back! Welcome to the fold and hope yu follow the sage advice of Dave McC... BA/UU/R (buy ammo, use up, repeat) on both and settle on the best for you! Brent

March 2, 2009, 12:36 PM	#9
GuyS Junior Member Join Date: February 27, 2009 Posts: 11	Thanks Hogdogs...I'm sure I will have plenty of questions. This is a great forum with lots of good info. Just wondering...has anyone used a pump for skeet? I understand it's not bad for trap of course but skeet may be difficlut due to having to shoot doubles at several of the stations. Thanks

March 2, 2009, 01:16 PM	#11
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	Or in the words of a famous "nearly" cajun guy Justin Wilson called it... "A pump 'em up carry-o-bean shoot gun..."

March 2, 2009, 01:20 PM	#12
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	I'll shoot a Browning BPS ( 28" barrel ) pump gun 12 or 20ga - for Skeet once in a while - for fun / not competition. The trick on using a pump gun for a game where you have 2 targets in the air at the same time - is having long enough arms that you can cycle the pump action, without bringing the gun down from your shoulder - so call for birds, feel the lead - bang, keep a smooth follow thru - cycle the pump gun - move your eyes to find the 2nd target(without moving the gun) - then move the gun to feel the lead and kill the 2nd target .... I'm not saying I'm as fast with a pump gun as using an Over Under - but its pretty fast - and at least as fast as most semi-autos. Its the same way in the field - a covey of Quail flushes - focus on one bird, kill it - cycle the gun (on your shoulder) - find a 2nd bird and kill it ... If you drop the gun from your shoulder to cycle it - you've lost a good 2 seconds probably - and your odds of success go way down / but if you can't cycle it from your shoulder, then do what you have to do. But with new shooters at my club - especially if they are getting used to their gun - we will just tell the puller to pull single targets on the skeet field all the way around. As they build up a little confidence / then let them call for a pair ( on appropriate stations ) when they feel like they're ready for them. Not a big deal / it really doesn't slow the squad down at all. Make sure gun is empty / get a couple of snap caps - and practice moving and shooting at home. Pick a room ( where neighbors won't see you swinging a gun in house ...). Load 2 snap caps ( one in barrel, one in mag ) like you would on a skeet field. Mount and hold the gun on the crease where the walls meet the ceiling - in center of room - follow the crease ( to stay level ) and rotate with lower body - as you pass corner on right, click trigger - follow thru (stay on the crease ) - and cycle the pump gun. Shift eyes back toward corner on right - and start your swing to the left ( stay on the crease ) - and click trigger as you pass the corner again - follow thru to center of room. It'll allow you some practice cycling the action of the gun and keeping it on your shoulder - and help on the idea of rotating with lower body ( keeping shoulders level, 70% of weight over your lead foot, head always on the comb of the gun). Practice for 15 or 20 min / if your shoulders are dropping off - causing you to roll like a rainbow, keep doing it until you break the habit / keep your head on the comb ( don't lift your head ). It isn't exactly like shooting sustained lead in Skeet - but it'll get you cycling your gun on your shoulder, give you feel for proper rotation of your lower body, and the feel of keeping your face on the comb. Your face should never leave a comb ... etc ... Lots of good books out there on shooting clay target games, DVD's, etc .. Have some fun / welcome to the forum.