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Old June 5, 2014, 11:52 PM   #1
cajundefender
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Any advice on ammo?

Hello. I'm new to this forum and new to revolvers. I recently inherited six new revolvers including a Colt Detective Special and a S&W Combat Special, along with a semi-automatic S&W 645. I do not have a CCW permit but I will soon be applying for one. I am currently seeking two staple ammunition choices to purchase in relative bulk quantity (approx 500 rounds). I was hoping that someone here would be able to provide me with advice and whether or not I am heading in the right direction with ammo choices. My staples must include a FMJ ammunition for target practice (I only use FMJ for target practice) and emergency reserve, and a JHP choice for self-defense. My choices as of now include Herter's 158gr FMJ with brass case for my target staple and Winchester "white box" 125gr +P JHP for my defensive staple. Are these at least decent choices? I am looking for reviews of the ammunition and how you think that these would perform on human targets. These meet my basic needs for grain count and bullet type and they will be the easiest to stock up on from my source, but I would appreciate some advice before I go out and buy all of this. Pardon any mistakes or vagueness. Revolvers are not my thing, but since I have them I'd like to learn to use them.
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Old June 6, 2014, 07:46 AM   #2
g.willikers
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The most important part about shooting a revolver is learning how to be accurate with it in double action mode.
And that takes quite a bit of practice.
The FMJ ammo you suggested is fine, as is just about any other.
Choose what ever brand is the least expensive, so as to help provide that practice.
As for the choice of defensive load, again, all the ammo makers provide effective loads, providing of course, you are able to hit the intended target in an equally effective manner.
So, don't sweat what ammo to buy; not nearly as much as learning how to shoot double action.
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Old June 6, 2014, 09:49 AM   #3
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I'll second what you have already.

Not exactly familiar with the revolvers you have, but I have owned a few .38s over the years.

500 rounds of each is a fine start. Save your brass, even if you don't reload yet. 1000 pieces of NIB .38 Spec brass would cost me about $400 at the store, if I could find it.

Second, I encourage you to shoot up some water filled jugs and watermelons and grape fruit and so on. You may or may not find a 158gr cast bullet with a semi wadcutter shape is suitable for SD at reasonable ranges.
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Old June 6, 2014, 10:12 AM   #4
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Welcome to the forum.

FMJ or cast bullets for target shooting and hollow point for self defense is the correct approach.

I would recommend you "try BEFORE you buy". In other words, do not buy 500 rounds before you have run a sample of say fifty through the firearm. This is particularly important with a pistol (semi-auto). You do not want to get stuck with 500 rounds which will not feed or run the gun.

I'll echo - save your brass. If you enjoy shooting, then you may find yourself reloading before long. You will not save money by reloading; however, you will get to shoot much more for the same cost.
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Old June 6, 2014, 01:56 PM   #5
cajundefender
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Thanks for the great responses. I recognize the accuracy issue with the DA revolvers. I practiced aiming and dry firing. For single action I could easily line up a shot and pull the trigger while keeping the sights on target. For double action, especially on the little hammerless snubnose that only fires in DA, I can quickly line up the sights, but once I'm done with the heavy trigger pull I am significantly off target. This should be corrected -or at least managed- with training. I was planning on firing twelve shots of each type of candidate ammo from each revolver. I saw mentioned to fire a box of each. Do you think that twelve rounds per revolver will be enough to test or should I suck it up and go for a box of each per revolver? I will mainly be testing function at 10 yards, but I will also sight in for up to 25 yards to test accuracy. I am also looking at MBI ammunition for target use only. Does anyone have any experience with them? As I learn to cope with the DA, I would rather not be using name brand cartridges, but I don't want to buy a few hundred rounds of MBI if it doesn't work well. Reviews seem to be pretty good (for the .38 at least), but does anyone here have any experience with them? Thanks.
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Old June 6, 2014, 04:28 PM   #6
jason_iowa
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Lead bullets are generally cheaper then jacketed ones. I like wad cutters both for self defense and practice/target shooting.

http://gun-deals.com/ammo Is a good place to start a search. You can find deals that are not on here but it gives you an idea of whats going on. Congrats on the new revolvers!
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Old June 7, 2014, 12:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
The most important part about shooting a revolver is learning how to be accurate with it in double action mode.
I'm going to disagree with this statement, only because is it phrased as an absolute. Defensive/combat style shooting isn't the only way to shoot, and for a lot of us, isn't the only thing, or the most important thing.

About half my revolvers are single actions. Not going to be shooting any of them DA.

To me, the most important thing is being on target, and on time. However you get there.

If DA shooting is important to you, then its important. I just don't think it is the single most important thing about shooting a revolver.

Quote:
I saw mentioned to fire a box of each. Do you think that twelve rounds per revolver will be enough to test or should I suck it up and go for a box of each per revolver?
If you are looking to see what a given load does from a specific gun, you need to shoot enough rounds that you can be reasonable sure that your performance shooting is not a major factor.

Shooting from a rest, having other shooters (of known, proven ablility) shoot a few rounds, to compare against yours, these things help reduce the "you" factor, and give a clearer picture of what the gun and ammo will do. That is PART of the process. The other part is seeing what YOU can do with the gun and ammo combination. The difference between the two tells you which part of the combination needs improvement (if any).

Lets look at a couple of examples, for illustration...
If you shoot from a rest and get a 3" group, but unrested, you can only get a 6" group, then what needs work is you.

If you get a decent group, but its a foot low, and left, but your buddy gets the same size group, dead center of the target, its you.

If load A shoots a foot low and left, and load B is dead on, its not you, its the gun & ammo

You buy ammo a box at a time, split it up between different guns however you choose, Just shoot enough from each one that you can tell if it is the gun, the ammo, or you that makes the most difference in the accuracy.'

one gun a friend had shot wonderfully with 158gr .38 Special. Spot on at about 25feet. Couldn't hardly miss, even very small things. Same gun, ANY other ammo, shot to a different place, and group size. 125gr .357s shot a foot low and a foot left, in the hands of multiple shooters.

That kind of performance is rather common. That amount of difference is extreme, and uncommon, but can happen.

If you have a gun that throws a certain load into a really odd place, a couple of cylinders worth is usually plenty to show that, and shooting a whole box "low and left" (or where ever) is just a waste.

I don't know the MBI brand, so no comment on that. WWB ammo is their bargain stuff. Expect it to work, but don't expect more. If you get more, say thanks to the shooting gods.

Before stocking up on a quantity of ammo, I think you would be better off doing a bit of testing first.

Which is better, cheapest ammo that shoots, say 5" group in your guns in your hands, or more expensive that shoots 3" under the same conditions? And how much more expensive it is, vs what you get, and what you want plays a part, too.

if you get better results from ammo that costs $1 more per box, is it worth it? If its $3 a box, is that worth it?

Shoot enough different loads (ammo brands, and bullet weights) to see if you DO get a significant difference in results. Then, if you do (and you may not get a significant difference), then you calculate if the difference is worth the cost.

And of course, with the shortages still with us, what you can actually get plays a big part in it, too.

Good Luck!
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Old June 7, 2014, 07:13 PM   #8
cajundefender
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Thanks for your response. I am going to test my preferred staple ammo selections before I purchase the bulk quantity. I chose these types due to the fact that given the shortages, they are not only some of the only choices, but they are some of the only choices that meet my needs. I am now going to fire up to 20/24 rounds per revolver to test at ten yards from resting and not resting. This is just for testing to help me be fairly certain that when God forbid I have to pull that trigger at close range in a life-or-death situation, my sidearm will go bang instead of click. The 686 combat masterpiece or the model 67 and one of the smaller revolvers will be selected to be used in defensive situations and I will invest a significant amount of time and money into training with these choices. My first step is to make sure that the guns and the ammo function correctly. Then I will select which one of each class, combat and concealed carry, would I be willing to use to defend my life. Then I will train with those. Don't worry, I'm not expecting to become a professional with twelve rounds - just making sure my revolvers are capable of professional usage.
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Old June 9, 2014, 08:24 AM   #9
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Seems like you did fine. My only deal breakers with 38 Special purchased ammo is staying away from Blazer head stamp brass because of too thick heads. That was from a box of CCI's Independence brand. All that brass is in my scrap jar, and it took a while to cull it all.
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Old June 9, 2014, 08:47 AM   #10
sandbag
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Ammo Suggestions

If your S&W "Combat Special"is a model 19 or 66 you can used 158 gr lead rounds for practice and 125 gr JHP for SD.
With your Detective Special I'd g with any 158 gr ammo for practice and 158 gr Semi Wadcutter Hollow Point +P-often called the "FBI Load" for SD.
Buffalo Bore makes a very good,albeit pricey version of this load.
If you can find a box of this in Remington Express grab it-it's hard to find.
Yellow and green box.Winchester and Federal also make the load,but theirs are less satisfactory-much dirtier for one thing.
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Old June 9, 2014, 11:05 AM   #11
sm
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My preferred load is standard pressure 158 gr LSWC.

Recovering from surgery or more lately injury, I did load up with 148 wadcutters.

CCW is a Model 10 snub-nose.
I also have a 1928 Colt Detective Special.

Sending best,
Steve
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Old June 10, 2014, 01:04 AM   #12
badge851
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The Fiocchi® 158gr FMJ load you referenced is fine for practice. For a carry load I use the Buffalo Bore® Standard Pressure 38 Special 158gr LSWCHCGC (#20C/20). It is highly accurate in all three of my snubbies.
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Old June 10, 2014, 10:29 PM   #13
Jim March
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In 38Spl from a 2" barrel, you have to be picky about your ammo. Winchester white box (even +P) likely ain't gonna cut it.

My go-to loads in 38+P are:

1) Buffalo Bore 158gr semi-wadcutter +P - the "king of the hill" load, big recoil, bit blaster. Unfortunately the Buffalo Bore standard pressure version has failed a few reported expansion tests. Also, the +P version's massive recoil could cause trouble in a 17oz gun and is a really bad idea for anything lighter - the risk is that the slugs will pull out of the shells that haven't yet fired and maybe do so bad enough to tie the gun up. Plus at some point too light a gun will feel like you slammed your hand in a car door with every shot. Buffalo Bore's 125gr +P load isn't bad.

2) Speer Gold Dot 135gr +P "short barrel special". Less recoil than the Buffalo Bore +P loads. Works great.

3) Winchester's 130gr "Supreme" +P - I think they're now calling it "PDX1" or something.

4) Hornady Critical Defense in 38+P.

5) Remington 158gr all-lead hollowpoint +P. Similar in size, type and speed to Buffalo Bore's 158 standard pressure load, but the Remington lead is softer and it expands better. Hard as hell to find.

Remington's Golden Sabre 38+P isn't bad.

From a 4" barrel you have more options.

I don't think buying 500 full-tilt battle loads is practical, myself. I would try and find a bulk practice load of the same bullet weight as your combat load, whatever that is that you pick. Or similar to within 5gr, 10gr max. In other words, FMJ 130gr will act as a decent stand-in for a good +P 125gr or 135gr combat/carry load.

Take a look at some test videos:

https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...ors9+38special
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Old June 16, 2014, 06:47 AM   #14
Glock20/460long
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Just roll the dice and hit your target.
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