Water Buffalo Caliber

BikerRN · November 13, 2009, 11:28 PM

Howdy all.

I may have the opportunity to go back down under next year for a hunt. I'm hoping some of our ballisticians and down under mates can clue me in to the rifle I should bring. I will of course go over this with the guide that will be taking me out, but I wanted to get as many opinions as I can.

I'll be going for Water Buffalo, and possibly throw in a Wild Boar as well. I've loved the 45-70 from afar for years. Now that I'm going on a hunt that I could use that caliber I'm being told to go with a .375 H&H. Between the two calibers, shot out of a Ruger Number 1, which would you select, and why?

Thanks in advance for your help in making my decision.

Biker

Bigjim3 · November 13, 2009, 11:36 PM

I love the 45-70 lots of different loads, an grain weight to pick from. Its been a great caliber for a long long time. But I dont know much about the other to say anything good or bad about it..

trooper3385 · November 14, 2009, 12:30 AM

I would go with the 375 as well. Not saying the 45-70 wouldn't do the job, but with an animal as large as a water buffalo, I would have more confidence in the 375. I believe there about as large as the cape buffalo, but supposedly not quite as aggresive. I couple of years back, we went hunting in Africa. We stumbled across four trophy size cape buffalo. Being within 15 yds of them, you talk about one large piece of meat. I did not feel too safe with the 300 win mag I had in my hands to say the least. If I was traveling that far to go on a hunt like that and spending that kind of money, I would definetly go with the 375.

BikerRN · November 14, 2009, 09:10 PM

After studying the ballistic charts I've come to the conclusion that the .375 would be a better option.

I can also use it for bear and moose here in the states, so that's a plus. As I'm working on this hunt, I'm thinking of the one after that.

I haven't done a lot of hunting, and now that I'm able to afford to hunt, I rarely have the time. Thus, I've been put in the situation of actually needing to be guided, as I don't have the time to scout. That goes for here in the states too.

Since the wife and I were already planning to go down under again, this just lets us combine what we both like and or love. She loves Australia, being a native aussie and all, and I like to hunt.

Biker

trooper3385 · November 14, 2009, 10:22 PM

Gotta love going down under

Swampghost · November 14, 2009, 10:31 PM

.416 Rigby, it's what a friend took on the same hunt. He did a lot of research.

sc928porsche · November 15, 2009, 02:36 AM

given the choice of 45-70 or 375 H&H, I would use the 375 H&H for water buffalo.

armoredman · November 15, 2009, 03:31 AM

Given what little I know about water buffalo, I'd rather use 20mm. From a LONG ways out! Nasty creatures, very mean, from what I am told. Good luck, and be safe!

Rob96 · November 15, 2009, 04:47 AM

Quote:

I believe there about as large as the cape buffalo, but supposedly not quite as aggresive.

They can be quite aggressive. We had them right on the base at Clark AB in the Phillippines. Even though the farmers used "domesticated" ones for plowing the fields, them buggers would get real mean when approached. I would take some thing in the 400 line.

phil mcwilliam · November 15, 2009, 05:48 AM

If you already owned a 45-70 I'd say take it, but if you were to buy a rifle specifically for the trip go with the 375 magnum. Water Buffalo grow a little larger than Cape Buffalo but are regarded as easier to drop.
The big bulls will charge, so I would personally prefer a repeating rifle over a single shot. Your guide will have a back up rifle, but then you have to rely on the guide. Some guides are good and some are not.
I have been on many hunting & fishing trips in the top end of Australia, the first being in the early 1980's when the Australian government decided to cull water buffalo throughout the top end. The government thought the thousands of feral water buffalo posed a threat of transmitting foot & mouth , or tuberculousis to the cattle industry & commenced a culling program that wiped out the majority of the buffalo.
I was invited along on a few of the culls & we mainly used 308 bolt action rifles, although I did drop a buffalo with a "behind the ear" shot with my 22-250. I also shot & dropped 4 water buffalo in under 10 seconds with a Browning A5 semi auto shotgun firing rifled Brenekke slugs. We accounted for 18 water buffalo but could have easily shot hundreds.
Well that was over 25 years ago & these days everone seems to recommend a magnum caliber for water buffalo hunting, but back then 308's were common.

Rob96 · November 15, 2009, 05:57 AM

Quote:

If you already owned a 45-70 I'd say take

I agree. I think I would go with loads from Buffalo Bore or Garrett though.

troy_mclure · November 15, 2009, 11:19 AM

in this forum somewheres there was a lady that took a vietnamese water buffalo with an AR in .50 beowulf.

kraigwy · November 15, 2009, 11:34 AM

This post is funny, to me anyway. I was just talking about shooting water buffalo with a guy at the VFW.

I've shot a couple. I use a 308. If you use fmj bullets in a 308, then tend to rip right through the buff. But if you can get a pair of TL 90s when you get re-supplied ( wire cutters, I think thats what the army called them) you can cut the tips off, exposing the lead, tha drop a waterbuffalo with a five round burst out of a M-60.

I guess this is a bit off topic, since I dont think there are many places where hunting with a M-60 is legal.

fisherman66 · November 15, 2009, 11:45 AM

Quote:

.416 Rigby, it's what a friend took on the same hunt. He did a lot of research.

That's what I was thinking, but either .375H&H or the 45-70 (buff bore - hot loading) should do the trick. Just don't gut shoot it.

BikerRN · November 15, 2009, 02:41 PM

I'm leaning towards the .375, as it is a more versatile cartridge, from what little I know.

Both are single shot guns, and I don't own a bolt action gun. I think the .375 would work good for Moose and Bear in Alaska as well as Bison. Those are all hunts I have planned for the future.

We, the spouse and I, are in the planning stages for this trip right now. I may have to use a "loaner" gun provided by the guide service, unless I can get the paperwork completed to bring my gun over. The guide service has said they will help with that. I much prefer using my own gun, and I'll just have to spend some time practicing my reloading at speed if I want a repeater of some sort.

Biker

SKULLANDCROSSBONES65 · November 15, 2009, 03:46 PM

G'day. I talked to an old guy a few years ago that used to use a .303. He said shot placement was a bigger issue than caliber.
I think he would have been using ex-military ammo as well. He died about 4 years ago, so no more details from him.

Old Grump · November 15, 2009, 07:36 PM

Quote:

I'll be going for Water Buffalo, and possibly throw in a Wild Boar as well. I've loved the 45-70 from afar for years. Now that I'm going on a hunt that I could use that caliber I'm being told to go with a .375 H&H. Between the two calibers, shot out of a Ruger Number 1, which would you select, and why?

What range do you expect to shoot at and what kind of bullets? If you are up close and personal, (under 100 yards), 45-70 will be plenty and easier on the shoulder.

If your host or guide is suggesting that then go with it, have to assume they know what works on what beast in their home territory. Practice off hand, bench is a shoulder killer, (don't ask), learn to shoot it off a shooting stick and be prepared for some bruises. A nice padded shooting vest or jacket is a really good idea.

November 13, 2009, 11:28 PM	#1
BikerRN Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2007 Location: "State of Discombobulation" Posts: 1,333	Water Buffalo Caliber Howdy all. I may have the opportunity to go back down under next year for a hunt. I'm hoping some of our ballisticians and down under mates can clue me in to the rifle I should bring. I will of course go over this with the guide that will be taking me out, but I wanted to get as many opinions as I can. I'll be going for Water Buffalo, and possibly throw in a Wild Boar as well. I've loved the 45-70 from afar for years. Now that I'm going on a hunt that I could use that caliber I'm being told to go with a .375 H&H. Between the two calibers, shot out of a Ruger Number 1, which would you select, and why? Thanks in advance for your help in making my decision. Biker

November 13, 2009, 11:36 PM	#2
Bigjim3 Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2008 Location: Alabama Posts: 419	I love the 45-70 lots of different loads, an grain weight to pick from. Its been a great caliber for a long long time. But I dont know much about the other to say anything good or bad about it.. __________________ Jesus according to Luke:22:36: Then said he unto them, ,,,,,, and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one......... Thomas Jefferson: "No man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."

November 14, 2009, 10:31 PM	#6
Swampghost Senior Member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: Florida, east coast Posts: 2,106	.416 Rigby, it's what a friend took on the same hunt. He did a lot of research. __________________ NRA Patron Member

November 15, 2009, 02:36 AM	#7
sc928porsche Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2008 Location: now living in alabama Posts: 2,433	given the choice of 45-70 or 375 H&H, I would use the 375 H&H for water buffalo. __________________ No such thing as a stupid question. What is stupid is not asking it.

November 15, 2009, 11:19 AM	#12
troy_mclure Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2008 Location: gulf of mexico Posts: 2,716	in this forum somewheres there was a lady that took a vietnamese water buffalo with an AR in .50 beowulf. __________________ There is only one tactical principle which is not subject to change. It is to use the means at hand to inflict the maximum amount of wound, death, and destruction on the enemy in the minimum amount of time."

November 14, 2009, 12:30 AM	#3
trooper3385 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2005 Location: South Texas Posts: 814	I would go with the 375 as well. Not saying the 45-70 wouldn't do the job, but with an animal as large as a water buffalo, I would have more confidence in the 375. I believe there about as large as the cape buffalo, but supposedly not quite as aggresive. I couple of years back, we went hunting in Africa. We stumbled across four trophy size cape buffalo. Being within 15 yds of them, you talk about one large piece of meat. I did not feel too safe with the 300 win mag I had in my hands to say the least. If I was traveling that far to go on a hunt like that and spending that kind of money, I would definetly go with the 375.

November 14, 2009, 09:10 PM	#4
BikerRN Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2007 Location: "State of Discombobulation" Posts: 1,333	After studying the ballistic charts I've come to the conclusion that the .375 would be a better option. I can also use it for bear and moose here in the states, so that's a plus. As I'm working on this hunt, I'm thinking of the one after that. I haven't done a lot of hunting, and now that I'm able to afford to hunt, I rarely have the time. Thus, I've been put in the situation of actually needing to be guided, as I don't have the time to scout. That goes for here in the states too. Since the wife and I were already planning to go down under again, this just lets us combine what we both like and or love. She loves Australia, being a native aussie and all, and I like to hunt. Biker

November 14, 2009, 10:22 PM	#5
trooper3385 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2005 Location: South Texas Posts: 814	Gotta love going down under

November 15, 2009, 03:31 AM	#8
armoredman Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 5,297	Given what little I know about water buffalo, I'd rather use 20mm. From a LONG ways out! Nasty creatures, very mean, from what I am told. Good luck, and be safe!

November 15, 2009, 05:48 AM	#10
phil mcwilliam Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2007 Posts: 573	If you already owned a 45-70 I'd say take it, but if you were to buy a rifle specifically for the trip go with the 375 magnum. Water Buffalo grow a little larger than Cape Buffalo but are regarded as easier to drop. The big bulls will charge, so I would personally prefer a repeating rifle over a single shot. Your guide will have a back up rifle, but then you have to rely on the guide. Some guides are good and some are not. I have been on many hunting & fishing trips in the top end of Australia, the first being in the early 1980's when the Australian government decided to cull water buffalo throughout the top end. The government thought the thousands of feral water buffalo posed a threat of transmitting foot & mouth , or tuberculousis to the cattle industry & commenced a culling program that wiped out the majority of the buffalo. I was invited along on a few of the culls & we mainly used 308 bolt action rifles, although I did drop a buffalo with a "behind the ear" shot with my 22-250. I also shot & dropped 4 water buffalo in under 10 seconds with a Browning A5 semi auto shotgun firing rifled Brenekke slugs. We accounted for 18 water buffalo but could have easily shot hundreds. Well that was over 25 years ago & these days everone seems to recommend a magnum caliber for water buffalo hunting, but back then 308's were common.

November 15, 2009, 11:34 AM	#13
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	This post is funny, to me anyway. I was just talking about shooting water buffalo with a guy at the VFW. I've shot a couple. I use a 308. If you use fmj bullets in a 308, then tend to rip right through the buff. But if you can get a pair of TL 90s when you get re-supplied ( wire cutters, I think thats what the army called them) you can cut the tips off, exposing the lead, tha drop a waterbuffalo with a five round burst out of a M-60. I guess this is a bit off topic, since I dont think there are many places where hunting with a M-60 is legal. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

November 15, 2009, 02:41 PM	#15
BikerRN Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2007 Location: "State of Discombobulation" Posts: 1,333	I'm leaning towards the .375, as it is a more versatile cartridge, from what little I know. Both are single shot guns, and I don't own a bolt action gun. I think the .375 would work good for Moose and Bear in Alaska as well as Bison. Those are all hunts I have planned for the future. We, the spouse and I, are in the planning stages for this trip right now. I may have to use a "loaner" gun provided by the guide service, unless I can get the paperwork completed to bring my gun over. The guide service has said they will help with that. I much prefer using my own gun, and I'll just have to spend some time practicing my reloading at speed if I want a repeater of some sort. Biker

November 15, 2009, 03:46 PM	#16
SKULLANDCROSSBONES65 Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2008 Location: Far Nth Wst QLD Australia Posts: 992	G'day. I talked to an old guy a few years ago that used to use a .303. He said shot placement was a bigger issue than caliber. I think he would have been using ex-military ammo as well. He died about 4 years ago, so no more details from him. __________________ If you're not confused, you're not trying hard enough! When you're confused, I'll try to use smaller words!!!